DOD278: I'm Not Gonna Cause I Don't Wanna

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:02 Clip: I'm the cool dad, that's my thing I know now what I can offer you that no one else can Complete and under-dependent I'm a man, I'm sensitive I need to feel loved, I need part of being a father that I enjoy

0:00:28 Tom: Welcome to Dear Old Dad, the podcast with all the privileges. I'm Tom Curry. I am joined, as always, by Thomas Smith and Eli Bosnick. Hello, gentlemen.

0:00:38 Eli: Okay, it sounded kind of like you said, dear old dad singular when you did the introduction just now, and I was worried you stole the podcast.

0:00:43 Thomas: Well, you stole a Patreon the other day and made it that, so we just have to adjust it to whatever you make the Patreon.

0:00:49 Tom: Wait, what did I do?

0:00:50 Eli: Oh

0:00:50 Thomas: No, Eli, he'll give the Patreon... He has about a 60

0:00:52 Tom: Oh, he'll give the Patreon as a random thing? Yeah.

0:00:54 Thomas: % accuracy rate on the Patreon He'll be like, Dear Oldie Dad.

0:01:00 Eli: Dear noon day.

0:01:03 Tom: That's yeolddads at dearold .com. What the fuck? Fuck.

0:01:06 Eli: I have never felt where, so I've been doing a lot of editing for the puzzle shows because we're playing with video stuff and I know how to edit video. My co -hosts are still just learning. So I've doing a bunch, which means I have been listening to me speak the last couple of weeks. And it's truly the fact that anyone who edits my voice likes me is a miracle one out of nine words I say is completely the wrong word, right? I'll be like I went to the grocery stonk and then just keep on rolling

0:01:28 Thomas: That's how I feel about me. Me tom how are we supposed to react right now is there oh I really I didn't notice

0:01:39 Tom: I'm just going to laugh with, laugh with laugh with not at laugh with not at. I just say it over and over in my head. Yeah.

0:01:42 Eli: It's insane.

0:01:43 Thomas: That it's really I thought you knew this about yourself this is like your spelling yeah

0:01:48 Eli: I knew that I'm

0:01:49 Tom: I love that. This is a revelation. That is what is getting me. Yeah, do you think you're the edited version of you? Wait a second.

0:01:51 Eli: I knew I misspeak occasionally, but

0:01:57 Tom: Like as content creators, hold on a second because this is something to talk like. Do you think you are the edited version of you okay

0:01:59 Eli: Oh God, I certainly that would be awesome. Just a bright shining light of hilarity. Oh, but yeah, no, I can't fucking fucking stand it it's crazy oh yeah no I mean look there's only so much you can do look I've learned because I when I say I'm going to the grocery stonk you can't fucking have lydia be like hey everyone store he means store like you can'T fucking yes no

0:02:16 Thomas: It's it's interesting there have been some ones where we catch you okay we catch usually, sometimes.

0:02:23 Tom: 100 I want that from now on I just want I want like a blurb in but don't acknowledge it don't do the hey everyone he meant just different voice changing it I'd be fucking that's some chef's kiss shit that's fucking great that's gotta happen that's locked in I'm gonna recall make that happen on citation eden eli

0:02:32 Thomas: Lydia does

0:02:38 Eli: It's just the it's just the lydia yeah just doing her best eli impersonation store it's got a real yiddish kite accent to it when she does it

0:02:52 Thomas: A really racist, you know, Jewish voice. Yeah. She's always doing that. I'm glad there's finally an application for

0:02:54 Eli: Really upsetting eli yeah she learned she does it around the house for the kids yeah we could talk yeah

0:02:55 Tom: Bosnick yeah right holy

0:03:03 Thomas: It. You know, it's been before it's just it's been pure racism you know but uh okay we'll work on that uh

0:03:12 Tom: Shit

0:03:07 Eli: Please let me in the bedroom give me my shickles I still want to have sex tonight but but gentlemen do you know the only thing worse than the deeply problematic eli bosnick impersonation that lydia lives 40 to 50 50 % of her life. And why? It's the auto -ants. The anti -Semitic voice of your podcast listening experience. Although, technically, that's just me. But anyways, you can make all that go away. Not the me part. You can't make me go away? You can, but don't, please. Over at patreon.com forward slash dear old dads, where, for as little as a dollar, you'll get a commercial-free version of every single episode, plus a little parenting bonus story at the end. We have little step -man bonus episodes once a month whenever the smiths fucking feel like it and you get all of that over at patreon.com forward slash dear old dads like lydia into the voices of the jewish people rip

0:03:18 Thomas: Good times

0:04:06 Tom: Jesus

0:04:06 Eli: Into it because

0:04:08 Tom: Christ all

0:04:14 Ad: [Ad break 1 — ad music]

0:04:15 Tom: Right gents so I've been thinking about something now for uh several weeks and we talked a little bit around it a couple of weeks ago we kind of got moved on a little what I think of as a tangent, but probably just because I described the situation wrong.

0:04:27 Eli: I stopped the conversation to call you a pussy yes

0:04:28 Thomas: We fuck tom's whole thing and he's being nice about

0:04:30 Tom: So I've been thinking a lot about the way that we grew up or grow up informs or creates these sort of mental artifacts that kind of tell us what a privilege is and what a privileged isn't. So what I guess I want to describe is I've kind of come to the conclusion that for, at least for me, I don't want to speak for anybody else, but for me what I've realized is that internally speaking what What feels like a privilege is often the distance between what you needed and what you actually got.

0:05:02 Tom: And so when I was thinking about it, like because Haley will tell me these stories. Right. So she'll tell me this very what I have come to realize are normal stories. Right. About like her parents drove her to the mall and they gave her some spending money to buy a clothes or she went to the arcade as a kid or they drove her to gymnastics and she did gymnastics for years. Right.

0:05:20 Thomas: It tom is it the inverse of the thing where you start telling a story and it turns out it's horrible where like hayley's telling story and you're like oh poor rich kid over here oh my god and she's like

0:05:31 Tom: Like in my mind, when she tells you, it's exactly what

0:05:34 Thomas: Because we were able to get bags at the grocery store they did it's like five cents oh

0:05:40 Eli: We had to juggle

0:05:41 Tom: She talks about stuff like that, especially when it comes to not just money, but specifically when it comes to like the way that her parents engaged and provided resources of time and energy specifically. So a lot of those things I was talking about are resources of time and energy so none of that stuff was how my dad parented me right and so all of that feels like god damn it's such a nice thing to do like my dad would never do that

0:05:53 Thomas: Man oh man yeah now imagine tom if you were you except your dad had no excuse that's where I am that's me you're you're at least when we talk about it you're like well my dad was working the eighth job and um we he just had to leave that one because somebody said a weird thing so he had to quit that one and then that way he had to take up four more and I'm like well my dad is just like he's just watching tv

0:06:13 Eli: Go that's

0:06:30 Tom: Yeah well and I don't want to give my like an out is not right but like I've been thinking about this for like a bunch of weeks like my dead didn't do things to a sort of pathological degree and it It was kind of weird. Right. So I'll give you some examples. Like my dad has never read anything I've written creatively.

0:06:43 Thomas: Me too okay but that's normal though

0:06:50 Tom: I've been writing creatively my whole life. He's never listened to one podcast I've ever done. Like he's never done that.

0:06:55 Thomas: Okay yeah so so far totally normal is it supposed to be weird it

0:06:59 Tom: Cecil and I wrote a book. My dad, I gave him a copy. He will never open it. He has not and will never open it

0:07:05 Eli: So fucking insane to me that's so crazy

0:07:07 Thomas: Would be weird if he did I don't know what what you're talking about

0:07:10 Eli: Think about Arlo's first book you're gonna have Arlo first book gay dragon 27 you're going to have that memorized you're to be correcting people on the reddit you're like hey Arlo dad here as someone who read the

0:07:13 Thomas: Oh yeah I have a thousand of

0:07:26 Eli: First seven drafts of gay dragons and their victories I do want to point out that but Scalascar always had the Scar token, so it's actually not a plot hole. You're just not following his work.

0:07:31 Thomas: Them that's awesome

0:07:34 Tom: So like dad for me like he made sure to provide there was always dinner there was always a hug if you needed it like he was not like there were good things like I don't want to say like there weren't good things right but like he just wasn't going to do things with and for you that didn't connect to what he wanted

0:07:46 Thomas: Weird yeah god that's so funny hearing you try to explain yeah because like that's so us too he just wasn't gonna do stuff I don't know how to explain this to eli like if you know it was a thing that you'd have to do he

0:08:12 Tom: Yeah so if there was something thing that was like my dad was a needs versus wants kind of guy is kind of how I've been thinking about a little bit if there was anything that was in need a hundred percent it was covered right

0:08:18 Thomas: Wouldn't he doesn't want to do it

0:08:25 Tom: Well no like I mean what I mean is like if it's something that I wanted this is really at the at the heart of some of the conversations that I've Been thinking about like I grew up thinking that permission meant you were allowed to do something and hayley grew up Thinking that permission meant you were Allowed and would be supported if you did it so the key distinction like let's say like like Haley wanted to do gymnastics, right? Can I do gymnastics? Yeah, you can do gymnastics. And embedded in that is, and I'll help you get there and I will not just allow this to happen, meaning I didn't say no, but I will support the endeavor to help it occur. For my dad, permission and support were not linked. So I didn'T grow up thinking that permission and support Were linked. So when I had this thing happen with Aislinn the other day, where she is like talking about wanting to join Key Club, I'm like, yeah, join Key Club. That sounds great. Good for your sort of college resume. It literally never occurred to me that I might have to do anything at all, like arrange for rides or bring her to a volunteer event or anything. Because in my mind, my mind is not like connected the idea of permission being accompanied by support. And that's a weird, wrong headed way to think about things. That's it's an artifact of that gap between having what you know between what you need and what you wanted so like I got a lot of permission I didn't get a lot actually a very little but when I got permission to do something like my dad gave me permission to get a job but he would not drive me to that job so the only way for me to get to my job was to either walk ride a bike or hitch a ride with a friend but it was not going to be like assumed that dad would drive you to work that's It's not a thing. But Haley thinks that's crazy because for her embedded in permission is support. And I think she's right that that is a more naturally normal way to sort of parent and think about parenting. But it's created this like weird gap space for me where things don't occur to me, I think, that would occur to more normally raised humans. Where you're like yeah like if I say yes to this I am agreeing to also support it to allow it to occur like to put the pieces in place that will allow this thing I've already said yes to to happen and I'm just curious like where you guys like if that resonates at all with either of you or if you have any experience that that speaks to that as well

0:10:52 Eli: That terrible afterlife punishment that you went through?

0:10:55 Tom: Do

0:10:55 Eli: No, I don't really get that, if that was what you were wondering. No. Poor people? Yeah, no, I've met poor people. Yeah, they smell vaguely of cleaners.

0:11:00 Tom: You know people like similarly though? Like, no, no. It's not about poor people. Cause my dad could have, my dad a hundred percent could have on the weekends driven me to work. Right. And I only worked on weekends. He could have driven me work, but that's just not a thing he did. He didn't let me borrow his car. I've never driven a car. My dad's ever owned. Not one time ever. If I've been behind the wheel of a car, my dad owns, that's juste a hard no.

0:11:21 Eli: You remember at the beginning of the episode when you guys were trying to help me come to the realization that I talk like a crazy person. This is me and Thomas pausing to see if you're going to come to the realisation that your dad hated you. So if you just, no, just talk it through until you get there, King. Whatever you...

0:11:33 Tom: No, I, I don't think he hated us. I, I don't, but I think he's, I think my dad, on reflection, was not, no, I think he was not anticipating, sitting is not something my dad did much of.

0:11:41 Eli: Which he never did.

0:11:42 Thomas: Now really liked sitting that's my dad see that's the thing that's why that's the only reason I can't understand you is my dad just it was because of sitting that he didn't do any of those things other than that I'm a hundred percent with you.

0:11:58 Tom: For me, like, what I've discovered is, and it doesn't happen very often, but every once in a while, it'll create these, like gaps where I'll think like, yeah, that's like a fucking giant privilege to like have somebody drive you home from school on finals day because finals got out at noon and And you don't want to take the bus at 2 .30. Like, that to me feels like not a small thing. That feels like a huge thing. And Haley's like, you have kids. Sometimes you got to pick them up. What are you talking about?

0:12:12 Thomas: Sure is.

0:12:28 Eli: Yeah.

0:12:28 Tom: And I think she's right. And I'm crazy. And that's a weird thing to realize at 48 years old, right? But like, I think that she's wrong. She's right, and I'm crazing. No, I mean, I realize it a lot. But it's just like, though, I didn't realize this one. You know, usually I've picked up on them earlier. You know I'm

0:12:38 Thomas: Well, this can't be the first time you're realizing that. Okay. Yeah. Gotcha. Okay, I think

0:12:47 Tom: Curious what you think about that definition I'm not talking necessarily about money privileges but privileges in terms of like how we spend our time and emotional energy and physical resources like it feels to me like what we sort of count as a privilege measures that gap that gap between what we needed and what we had and if we sense that space it feels like a privilege and when we don't sense that place it feels normative and so people who've always had more it's like well they don't sense any space there and so that feels normative and people have had less they see this wide gulf and they're like a drive ride home from school is a fucking big deal and I don't think it is but there's a part of me that I think will always think it is and that's insane but what do you think of that

0:13:34 Thomas: That makes sense. I don't know the part where it's like what you needed because I don'T understand, you know, as a kid, it's, like, you get what you get. So, that part still, frankly, feels a little privileged to me, Tom, that you can talk about having needs. That's, uh, Ooh, boy, rich guy over here. Um, but other than that, yeah.

0:13:52 Eli: Yes. Finally. Yeah.

0:13:45 Tom: Definition well yeah that's but like for you too like part of it is not money right like take the money aside like Like there's plenty your dad could have done that wouldn't have cost a nickel, right? That would have been how he, and I don't want to talk about it in terms of money because I think that's just different and there's nothing a lot of people can do about it. But like, there's so much that your dad would have done,

0:14:01 Thomas: Oh yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. That was, that was just kind of joking. Yeah, yeah, yeah you're talking to the guy who got left at school for 30 plus minutes every single day of my life.

0:14:13 Tom: But he made choices on how to spend his time differently, right.

0:14:22 Tom: Like, did your dad go to your games? You were a sportsing guy. Did your dad goes to your game?

0:14:25 Thomas: So, uh, so my dad liked sports, so he went to, let me think about this.

0:14:31 Tom: That's exactly how I would answer for my dad. If my dad liked something, he would do it, right, it wouldn't be that he liked me and that's why he'd do it.

0:14:33 Thomas: So yes, yeah yeah. It's called autism, Tom. It is, a um it's an interesting thing uh

0:14:41 Eli: Hey, don't come after our autistic listeners like that we have some great dads in our autistic listeners

0:14:44 Tom: No you would never describe my dad as autistic though

0:14:44 Thomas: No it's it's uh we wouldn't describe your dad as autistic everything you've said about your dad screams out to me I agree that here's here's what I agree I don't have any fucking idea who your dad is so every time you say something about your dad it's a shock to me

0:14:49 Tom: If you met him no no way not even close no yeah well because he doesn't fit a type of any kind yeah

0:15:01 Thomas: Exactly that's kind of like autistic people but the

0:15:04 Eli: No hey

0:15:04 Tom: Yeah no it's not like that at all yeah

0:15:04 Thomas: Thing that That is the most autistic about it is I've described this about my dad. And it's the main thing that people don't get when I describe it is, well, yeah, he didn't want to do that. So he just never did anything he didn'T want to DO ever. Sure.

0:15:20 Tom: Well no but I think I think like here's a distinction here's what I what I really think because remember how I ended up living with him like he just got a phone call that I was getting on an airplane the next day and I was coming to live with him. I don't think he was anticipating raising kids. And I don' t think he wa s really into it.

0:15:36 Tom: And I think that is the thing. I think he w as like, okay, this is not how I thought my life was going to go. This is not what I had my life planned out. All of a sudden I get a phone call and I' m going to do it. I' M going to d o it. A d I' l make sure I hit these high water marks. Bing, bong, boom. But the rest of it I just am not into.

0:15:55 Tom: And And I just don't think he was into being a dad. I think he loves us. I think that's clear. But even now, no, no. Even now, if I don't call him, he doesn't call me.

0:16:01 Eli: Tom it's not clear just real quick I just wanted to chime in to let you know it's not

0:16:06 Thomas: There's a good distinction. My dad thought the whole point of his life was having kids. And this is how he acted. So that's a big... distinction yeah

0:16:14 Eli: Clear wait now I'm confused about your dad

0:16:17 Tom: That's very, yeah.

0:16:17 Thomas: No my dad my dad on his fake deathbed when he almost died the first time gave us a deathbed speech that was like well all I thought I've ever wanted to do with my life is have kids so I'm good I was like huh Doctor, actually do, do the life -saving. We change our minds. Do the life saving. We just need to know.

0:16:30 Eli: I don't understand did the whole room burst out in like what the fuck what no wait sorry wait no give him something that keeps him alive for another hour I have a lot of questions so when When I was at school, you were at home. Yeah, no, take a tube. Put a tube, take it to. I have so many questions about what the fuck you think you just meant just now. That's okay.

0:16:54 Tom: Oh, I understand it entirely. I get it entirely, he wanted to have kids. As soon as you guys were born, he had kids. He doesn't want to do the work of raising kids. I think those are really different things. I think there's a lot of dudes that want to have kids as long as they can outsource all of that work to someone else and just be like yeah I had kids that's a thing I wanted and I got it

0:17:17 Thomas: Sort of. I sort of thought I also think like he just thought he was doing it. You know what I mean? Like, I also kind of think, oh, he

0:17:25 Eli: Stan, how can you think your doing it if your kids are unhappy?

0:17:29 Tom: Yeah

0:17:29 Thomas: Probably thought that kids needed certain, they need, who knows? It's a combination of selfishness and kids need grit kind of thing. I don't know. I'm not sure.

0:17:39 Tom: I can answer that too though because like and I still have this that runs in the background operation of my mind for sure like eli you're like how can you feel like the kids weren't happy because I don't think that like people at least my dad's age grew up thinking that like happiness was an important metric

0:17:51 Thomas: Oh, he didn't give a shit about that. Yeah.

0:17:55 Thomas: No, not at all. For kids, especially. Yeah. Yeah.

0:17:56 Tom: At all like what's most Most important for my dad with kids is that we go to school on time, that we perform well in school, that we are obedient, that we are capable, that we are polite. Like, he had a hundred different metrics before happy. The idea of, like, raising kids to be happy, I don't think entered into the mind of most people born in 1947. I don'T think it was even on his list of, like, things to be worried about. That's what I was trying to tell Haley, because I was like, yeah, my dad, But he gave me permission to get a job, right? So he gave me permission. Well, I got a job at Burger King. I was like, can I get a job? He's like, yeah, no problem.

0:18:35 Thomas: That's the one part that's a little weird to me.

0:18:37 Tom: Embedded in that was not, I care if you have a job or not. He doesn't care if I have a job. I'm the one that wants the job. So if I want something, it's up to me to figure out how to get the thing I want. It's not up to him to figure out howto give me the things I want that is not how he thinks. It'S not how I was raised. It' It's just, it's just it's alien. It's an alien idea to my dad. I'm certain of it because like that's like, well, you're the one that wants a job. So like you problem solve that shit out until you get the thing you want. I said, yes, that's my job. I've said you are allowed to, and that's all I'm going to do on it. But like whether you're happy or not is not particularly a metric. I think my dad is like in his top 20, but I think that's generational, man. I don't think that that's even weird for, we're not the same generation, man, when was your dad born?

0:19:23 Eli: Oh, hey, keep your generation to yourself. I had a great dad. My dad was born in the 70s or something.

0:19:32 Tom: Yeah.

0:19:32 Eli: I don't fucking know.

0:19:32 Tom: Your dad was not born in 1947. I'm 48 years old, man. We're different generations. Yeah.

0:19:36 Eli: He's dead now

0:19:33 Thomas: 70s. My dad was born in 1945, baby. What, is he Googling?

0:19:39 Eli: When did you die when was

0:19:41 Tom: Oh, God damn, dude. He's trying to figure out when his dad was born. You could just look him up on Wikipedia, man, you

0:19:46 Thomas: You don't know the year of your dad's? That's weird. That's a funny thing. I know nothing about my family, but that I know for some reason.

0:19:48 Eli: David that's

0:19:52 Tom: Can literally Wikipedia your own dad.

0:19:54 Thomas: You can't?

0:19:55 Tom: Yeah, I showed it to you like a couple of years ago because he was all footballing. Yeah?

0:19:55 Eli: What I'm trying

0:19:56 Thomas: Oh, because he's the sports guy? Yeah.

0:19:59 Tom: Yeah, he was a big footballing guy.

0:20:00 Thomas: Class of what? Class of 1970 -something.

0:20:05 Tom: It'll just say when he was born on his Wikipedia, though.

0:20:05 Eli: Something it didn't say anywhere 1954 54

0:20:11 Tom: He was born in 54? Oh, wow. Wow. Yeah. I would have, I would've expected maybe a different attitude.

0:20:17 Eli: Nah man yeah listen he fucking loved this

0:20:21 Thomas: Tom, I think there are people who are just nicer and better. I don't think it has everything to do with... Yeah.

0:20:24 Eli: Shit

0:20:25 Tom: I mean, that's, that's probably true too, but I don't know. Like, I just don't remember the adults around me being as concerned with their kids' happiness when I was younger in the eighties. Like it just wasn't as big a deal.

0:20:34 Thomas: Yeah. Oh, they for sure weren't. Yeah. Broadly speaking. Yeah.

0:20:39 Tom: Yeah it just, it, that wasn't like the goal, right. That was not like on the list, you know, it just Wasn't Thomas.

0:20:53 Ad: [Ad break 2 — ad music]

0:20:55 Tom: I mean, your, your experience was very similar. Eli's your experience is very different. When When you think about things like permission to do something, for example, because I think this is an interesting one, is support for that thing embedded in the permission?

0:21:08 Eli: Well this is the interesting thing this is how we sort of got sidetracked because because you had to ask for everything so there was never an implication so a really good example and I think I've told you guys this before on air my dad drove me to school every day including when I went to middle school across the street from my house I need to be clear I don't mean down the street for my house I mean look out the front door of my house and I'm looking at my middle school, but we would drive around the block halfway around the block one so that he could park his car and then he would have things to bring into his classroom. But obviously that wasn't really it. It was so that we would just get to talk. He just liked the moment where we spoke every morning where we would just drive together for the two or three minutes that we were together. We had a door closing tradition. So when I was really excited for it, this is going to sound insane, so I'll try and keep this short. When I was really excited to get a sega no he

0:21:33 Thomas: That's so funny

0:21:34 Tom: Well, yeah. Well,

0:21:41 Thomas: Why yeah it's okay tom was just insane for 20 good minutes so

0:22:13 Tom: I know it's not normal. Yeah, like.

0:22:14 Eli: Was he was working through something spiritually and we were holding him in the light how dare you or then he would say I don't love you and I'm I'm starting to wonder if that was cool no so when I wanted a seGA genesis because of how fucking different my life honestly tom I think I should have been allowed to go first with my story when I wanted a sega genesis when I would say goodbye to him every morning I would say buy me a seGA and then I would close the door it was the joke buy me a seGa close the doRe and he thought that was hilarious and then as the other kids got taller I started to worry about like being tall that was a big thing because I was short a little what I was actually was was fat and so I just I was like the growing is happening in a different direction for me and so so I remember we had a conversation once really really really early like elementary school middle school where I was like oh everyone's taller than me it was like ah don't worry about it they're all lop heads lop of heads I say who knows it's just a thing he made

0:22:46 Tom: What?

0:22:52 Thomas: Yeah it's

0:23:21 Eli: Up in the second so what we would do is as I would leave he would say lop ahead and I would say sega and then close the door right that was the thing and I mean into adulthood that was how we said goodbye lop a head saying And so like, that was why he drove me to school every day and drove me to high school every day. And that like, cause he enjoyed being around me. I mean, look, the privilege of having my dad wasn't just extended in that, like he was a cool dude who taught me how to be a good man. Although that was a huge part of it, right? A huge part of it was just, he modeled friendship. He modeled community. He modeled parenting. He modeled being a good husband. Like I had all of that, but it was also that like. Like, it was unequivocal that his number one priority was his family. It wouldn't even enter anyone's mind who knew him to think that my dad's priorities were anything but his family, right? Like, the joke was, oh, my dad is always doing something for my mom or me, right. Right. Like the joke in amongst our family was like me and mom sit on the couch and send dad out of the room to get us snacks. That was the relationship dynamic in my family. And I did not realize what a privilege that was truly like as much as we're joking around until I started to be exposed to other families. I mean, I remember I don't know if you guys remember your first sleepover and if you went home from it because you got homesick. Like, I went home from my first sleepover because the parents freaked me out. I was like, hey, can I have some chips? And they were like, no. And I was, like, oh, cool. I'm leaving. And I called and I was Like, hey guys, this

0:23:36 Thomas: Funny that's

0:25:03 Eli: House is fucking insane. No, hear me out, hear Me out. I asked for chips.

0:25:06 Tom: They said no, and I'm me. I was me the whole time.

0:25:10 Eli: I asked For chips and they said no and seemed kind of mad. I know, I know. Yeah, you can come get me. Thank you so much. So yeah, that was just my whole childhood growing up. And it is what I have turned around and instilled in my own family as well, right?

0:25:17 Thomas: Funny yeah

0:25:26 Eli: Is that I am sort of at my, yeah, chips or whatever. I think I told it in the parenting story a couple of weeks ago, or maybe I just wrote it in our notes. But the other day when I made Max's snack, I came over and I was about to make him his snack, right. He sits and he gets his little iPad time after school. And I said, hey, buddy, what do you want for snack? And he goes, just make me something.

0:25:26 Thomas: Chips yeah

0:25:46 Eli: And I sort of look at him like, hey motherfucker. And he goes, please. Right. But the just make me something is the heart there. Right? That's the core. And so like, yeah, that is a tremendous, and it wasn't a financial privilege. It was just a tremendous privilege to have someone in your life for whom you were their priority. Now I will say this, I will say this.

0:25:46 Thomas: Oh yeah

0:26:07 Eli: I think that, I think,

0:26:06 Thomas: Never happened to me I'll go to my grave never having had that happen to me

0:26:13 Eli: I know my dad obviously was not,

0:26:20 Thomas: It's got to be correlated at least yeah

0:26:20 Eli: Wealthy for, right. But there were times where my dad had it relatively easy. We had a two income household. I think if you are working super hard and your life is filled with financial worry, unless you have had some time ahead of time, because again, my dad went through some really, really big financial hardships at times in his life. I don't want to say that he, like we always had it on easy street, but unless you are, I don' know, I'm not sure if I'm it is very easy for those things to fall by the wayside, right? If you are working hard all the time just to survive, it is Very Hard to Make the Emotional and Mental Space for Those Other Things.

0:27:02 Tom: Yeah, I think there's some definitely there's some truth to that. I struggle a little bit in the personal side of it because like, again, like when I talk to Haley, you know, she'll describe she had two parents. I had one. So there's a difference there, right? It's literally twice as many people. So that makes a difference. You know, they went through long periods of time where you could never describe them as privileged like by any stretch of the imagination like pretty hand to mouth and like they still would figure it out right like whatever it was as far as like time or yeah you can borrow the car you know or yeah, you can you know get you to gymnastics or you can go to the mall or you can like here's you know 10 bucks for gas or you know that kind of stuff like to some degree like I think a lot of parents just find a way to figure that shit out especially when it comes to like how do we use our time yeah and I think that's the thing is I think some parents just don't really like being parent I think

0:27:48 Thomas: Yeah because they like their kids

0:27:56 Tom: My dad probably did not like being a dad but understood what his obligations were in the broad sort of obligation sense made sure that he met those obligations I'm not sure he even necessarily like wanted to connect with us as people the same way that like you're describing eli where it's like oh this is my buddy eli we have a little fun in joke and I like spending time with him because I want to have this that's just not the sense that you get from him like he'll make jokes at the end stuff but like we you know keep it light keep it surface yeah

0:27:56 Thomas: Yeah see that's interesting because Because my dad and I joked all the time. We did do a lot of joking. That was very fun. But none of the other stuff.

0:28:38 Tom: There was always like a lot of distance and I never really understood how much distance there was until I started kind of thinking about how little little distance there was between other parents. Like I famously on this show, like I don't really know any personal details about my dad. I know we've talked about this before, but like, I don'T KNOW VERY MANY PERSONAL DETAILS ABOUT HIM AT ALL. I DON'T KNOW HIS RELIGIOUS BELIEFS ANYMORE.

0:29:04 Thomas: I don't know his religious beliefs. Don't know his ethnicity. No idea.

0:29:05 Tom: I KNOW THAT HE USED TO BE METHODIST 25 YEARS AGO. YEAH, NO, 25 YEARS AGO, BUT HE WON'T TALK ABOUT HIS RELIGIOUS BELIEFS, YOU KNOW, LIKE I DONT KNOW.

0:29:15 Thomas: Won't.

0:29:15 Tom: WE 'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE, LIKE WHEN I WAS, Yeah, he might still be Christian, but I don't know.

0:29:17 Thomas: No, I've never heard. I don'T know my dad's religious beliefs, though. Maybe I have. But that I.

0:29:24 Thomas: First off, at least that tells me he's not a mega like because they can't shut the fuck up about it. And so, yeah, no, I know. Know I'm just saying like my my parents being conservative like they can't shut the fuck out like nobody

0:29:29 Tom: My dad's not MAGA at all. No, he's not even MAGA adjacent. I

0:29:36 Thomas: That's like the only thing you could hear from my dad was like some dumb conservative bullshit so

0:29:42 Tom: Wouldn't describe him as particularly conservative or liberal either. It's tough because if he were, I don'T know that I would know it. I think he would think that that was an inappropriate thing to talk to someone about, like anybody about.

0:29:46 Thomas: Autism

0:29:59 Tom: He's a really hard person to know. And if the conversation starts to veer into that territory, even on the phone now, if like the conversation starts to get too personal, he'll he'll make an excuse to get off the phone. Yeah, he'd be like, Oh, I got another call coming in. And I'm like, really? Always? So there's always been this like distance like, yeah, but

0:29:57 Thomas: Too personal

0:30:12 Eli: Well, gotta go. You're being weird.

0:30:20 Thomas: That's fucking bizarre I don't know what his deal is man I still think it's autism but if you don't like that then sure dude not telling your kid I guess I don'T know what that means like

0:30:26 Tom: It's not if you met him, you would be like no, it's it's not that.

0:30:32 Thomas: The whole thing being like I don't know my dad's religious beliefs

0:30:36 Tom: If he has autism, he has got the highest level of masking anyone has ever had ever in all of time. Because if you met him, he would come across as incredibly charming,

0:30:46 Thomas: Yeah I don' t think that yeah yeah I I don know yeah I'm not sure what

0:30:47 Eli: Autistic people can be charming, Tom. How dare you come up for my son like that?

0:30:50 Tom: Comfortable. Well, no, I mean, if you look at the diagnostic criteria for autism, that would be very unusual for people with autism. No, he Would come across As very socially apt, very comfortable, very socially appt. He can make anybody in the room laugh and goof around and like he's very very charming, will never seem uncomfortable in any kind of a social scenario, but you'll never know who he is at the end of it. You won't get any like juice out of him that way.

0:30:56 Eli: You know I refuse to do that, Tom, I hate when people talk.

0:31:17 Thomas: Yeah I dont even know what that is so like social but not willing to ever talk about anything what even is

0:31:20 Tom: Yeah. He just doesn't talk about deep conversation with you. Like you won't talk About deep personal stuff. And it's very easy to do. I mean, you know, lots of people that don't ever really talk about anything of substance, right? I mean that's like every work relationship most people have.

0:31:32 Thomas: That yeah but yeah I get that but you're talking like with your family and your do you think there's anybody he talks about do you thing during that um handshake that once a month handshake like do you you think there's anybody he talks about that with or

0:31:38 Tom: Right. But that, and that's, yeah, I presume that he and Lynn talk about stuff. I presume it. I I don't know. They would not talk about it in person with me. I don'T EVEN KNOW HER ADDRESS.

0:31:52 Thomas: And she and she wouldn't either you'd have to beat it out of her I imagine too so okay

0:32:00 Tom: I DON'T EVEN KNOW HER ADDRESS NO

0:32:02 Thomas: This episode is just called Tom's insane I don't

0:32:05 Tom: I'M NOT INSANE THE WAY I GREW UP WAS INSANE BUT LIKE THERE'S LIKE A LEVEL OF LIKE ALMOST PROFESSIONALISM OR PROFESSIONAL DISTANCE I'M NOT EVEN KIDDING I THINK THAT'S THE BEST WAY TO DESCRIBE IT I THINK THAT'S THE BEST WAY TO DESCRIBE IT BUT THAT'S THAT'S HOW MY DAD IS WITH EVERYBODY LIKE HIS BEST FRIEND GROWING UP HIS BESST FRIENDS WAS THIS GUY NAMED JIM I THINK JIM IS MAYBE be deceased now, but like his best friend, Jim.

0:32:10 Thomas: Know that's so funny professionalism

0:32:27 Eli: Wouldn't know, because he wouldn't tell me if he had.

0:32:27 Thomas: Yeah that'd be

0:32:30 Tom: Yeah. So he and Jim were very close all through grade school. They maintained a relationship their whole lives. We'd go visit Jim. He lived a few hours away from us by the time everyone was adults, but we'd go there every other or every, you know, new years they'd come to our house every other new years. They was friends for life, you know kind of thing. And then like Jim in his middle age, he quit his job and he became an an author, a fiction author. And he started writing books. And my dad, as I've mentioned before, is a voracious reader. And Jim asked my dad and I was there when it happened. Jim asked my dad if he would read his first book. And My dad said, well, don't you write sci fi? And Jim said, yeah. And I was like, no, I don't read sci fi. And that was the end of it. That was the the end of it if my best friend wrote a book about fucking werewolves and vampires on the fucking planes in the 1800s in a romance story I'd be like it's not my jam I'm a hundred percent reading your book because you're my best friends yeah

0:33:18 Thomas: Unprofessional autism here's all I know my dad is incredibly I think was pretty autistic now that I think about it and that's the most defining characteristic of my dad this is the thing you're describing right now that's all I'm saying that's what I'm saying man the ability to shirk any and all social convention and be like sorry what's what kind of book is the my dear childhood friend for my entire life that I that's apparently my closest relationship I've ever had what oh I don't like that genre the genre now I didn't do it I

0:33:58 Tom: He's not gonna do it he's not gonna so yeah I think there was like there's like this weird distance that always was there growing up and like I think it's created all these like pinpoints for me where I look at my kids or I hear stories of other people and what would read to so many other people as normal reads to me as incredibly privileged I guess is the point

0:34:17 Thomas: Think I've said this before tom but I do think it's amazing how not insane you are relatively speaking I do think is like genuinely

0:34:23 Tom: Like like I'm not trying to describe I'm not trying say all this was good this was bad I'm acknowledging this is all bad right yeah right yeah so

0:34:27 Thomas: Yeah we all know it was bad

0:34:29 Eli: We know it's bad. I'm glad to hear you know, it's bad. That's important.

0:34:32 Tom: Yeah but I don't feel hurt by it I guess this is just how I grew up it's a fact of how I grow

0:34:37 Thomas: And that's the funny thing is when you I I do you have two different like modules in your brain because when I think about that kind of thing I think about what my dad would do I have this sense that we've I think we've kind of both described where it's like yeah obviously well obviously my dad wouldn't like go to my wedding or like obviously and then and then like when I switch into my kid mode then I'm like well yeah my kids are my favorite people in the world I would do everything with them and for them that they'll allow me to do and it's two different modules it doesn't strike me as the same relationship or something you know it's It's like I don't analyze my dad's behavior at that level because it's just not the same thing at all.

0:34:56 Tom: Up yeah

0:34:58 Eli: Swan

0:35:22 Tom: I guess I similarly like my dad and I don't share the same priorities and values use. And like, to me, that's just okay. I don't need to share the same priorities and values with him. To my mind, it doesn't make him a bad guy. And again, like I totally recognize that there is a, what were my options growing up? Right. Like my options were like, I had my, my mom who was like drunk and abusive and, you know, a problem and my stepdad who was the same. And, you know, so like there was that hot fucking mess. And then there was the real stability of my dad. My dad is incredibly stable. And like, I think that I was very grateful for the stability. I was grateful for, you know, the many ways he is supportive and did provide and I did the things I didn't have to worry about. And so no, no ,no ,no. My dad is not. I swear to God, like my dad is not a routinized person at all. He smiles easily like he makes friends with everybody, but nobody will like really know much about him.

0:35:47 Thomas: You had Gilligan. You had the monkey, you know? Yeah.

0:36:10 Thomas: Does he have a lot of routines? Okay. I was just kidding. Ron Swanson. Yeah.

0:36:25 Tom: My Dad is a very easy person to make friends with, it but he just yeah yeah a little little swansony it's a little swanson is all that fucking insane is that totally

0:36:32 Eli: Statistic.

0:36:38 Ad: [Ad break 3 — ad music]

0:36:43 Thomas: Well, we are all agreed there.

0:36:44 Tom: Insane yeah right I understand the experience is insane I guess I'm just like I I was wondering if it had any analogy at all in terms of like how you understand what feels like wow that's a real privilege like versus what's

0:36:58 Eli: Yeah, absolutely. 100%.

0:37:00 Thomas: I've spent since I was like 24 thinking about this nonstop so I've kind of like done a pretty good job of like okay I've separated my weird fucking bullshit upbringing from what is like normal or like what you actually are supposed to do so I have a lot of a lot of work doesn't mean it's perfect but I do I do have a a lot of putting good hard hours you know I do still struggle sometimes because sometimes you're like these fucking spoiled ass kids what are you talking about you know it's like the food that my kids waste I can't handle it and I think it's also what's also rough is that my wife is one of the kids too at least in terms of like having a normal upbringing so she's one of the normals too or I guess and so I'm like I don't what do you mean they're just eating this and then they're like throwing it away because when they didn't finish it what is that but she doesn't have that same reaction I guess or something because all they do all day is eat shit and not finish it and leave it on the floor

0:37:54 Tom: Not right right right

0:38:05 Thomas: For somebody else to get and it's like I it drives me insane I don't understand it but I guess that's kind of how other people live I don' t

0:38:12 Tom: It's funny because I'm just kind of like thinking through, but like I a hundred percent do have those two modules going on in my brain. Like I want my kids to be happy. And I think that their happiness is of tremendous importance and is a fundamental obligation of my role in their life as parent is to help them build what happiness means long -term to them. Not necessarily what happiness is in any given moment. I think about that idea a lot. I do not, however, think for for myself that one of the top 10 most important things is whether or not I'm happy. That is not of particular motivating. It's not a particularly motivating force for me. I mean, like I would like to be, I'd like to Be happy, but like, if I'm not, that doesn't worry me or distress me either. Do you know what I mean? And I think that's why like growing up, I don't, I don'T think back at, and then I donT like, I DON'T like hold anything against my dad. Like I think my dad got a phone call called you're raising kids start tomorrow and he's like shit wasn't expecting that okay let's figure it out and I'm not sure he necessarily wanted it I

0:38:20 Thomas: Know yeah well that's clear yeah that would have to be how you are yeah Yeah. I know I'm, I'm intensely selfish, so I don't understand that, but yeah.

0:39:22 Thomas: But do you think your dad cares that he is happy? Because it does sound like he prioritizes what he wants and does, you know what I mean?

0:39:30 Tom: Think my Dad does want to be happy yeah I think My Dad very much yeah uh -huh 100 %

0:39:33 Thomas: That's what's interesting. So it's, so it's like, it's the part where you're not prioritizing yourself at all. In a way it is kind of like your dad, but, but also not really because the ways that he just didn't do stuff in certain I feel like was him just being like, no, not for me. Prioritizing me. Yeah.

0:39:49 Tom: Yeah there was just there's just other things that were more important right so like there's always a hierarchy and I think for for My Dad there's a hierarchy and some of it is just plain selfish like Like, I asked him one time, like, why he doesn't live with Lynn. Like, he and Lynn have been together now for 46 years, as far as I know. And they live an hour apart. And my dad's 78 years old. You know, his health isn't going to get better and better. And she's had some health scares. And it would probably even be safer for them to live together. And they are never going to live together. My dad said, you know, I'm a 78 -year -old man. And at this point, you know, I want to do what I want to do when I want to do it. And I don't want to have to think about whether somebody else wants to do it at the same time. He's like, if I want to go to bed at 8 .30, I'm just going to walk into my bedroom and go to sleep. If I want To wake up at 3 .30 I'm going to wake up At 3. 30. If I Want to get a glass of milk, I'm Going to get A glass of Milk. He's like, I don't want to Have to Compromise. Well, He doesn't want To have to, He doesn'T wake somebody up or say like, you know, He doesn 'T want to do any of that stuff. He doesn't want to have to compromise. And I think that's how He's always been with His time. I think He's definitely provided for us And I mean, he wouldn't have had to work three jobs if he didn't have two kids, you know, like, mm

0:40:06 Thomas: None of those things are things that you're not allowed to do. Yeah sure.

0:41:02 Thomas: Yeah no I get it. There's like a difference between what's like, a societal expectation or what's, like a duty in a way like he'll always do that, but anything discretionary he's not going to do it right. Right yeah yeah sorry yeah yeah for sure

0:41:15 Tom: If it's discretionary, he'll do it if he likes it. So if he doesn't like science fiction, he's not going to do it. I bet, though, that if his friend Jim had written a police procedural, which he likes, yeah, you know, I bet my dad would have happily read it, although I will offer this, he might still have refused because if he did not like it, he would not have felt comfortable saying he did n't like it.

0:41:25 Thomas: A steamy romance novel. No, I'm just kidding oh yeah yeah so that's funny because I feel like my dad would have I'm trying to think it almost felt like he didn't do stuff on purpose like that like maybe that was why like the awkwardness of like having to deal with that social interaction which I'll be honest I kind of get at this point in my life where it's like boy I don't like if someone wants me to listen to their music sick, I'd probably be like, you know, it's probably better if I didn't, you know, like just for you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm with Tom's dad on this one.

0:42:02 Tom: Because then what are you going to say? Do you want me to lie about it or do you want me to say I hate it? Like, those are my choices, right? I do think my dad thinks that way too. Like, dude,

0:42:07 Eli: You lie. Hey, guys, do you do you not know about lying? I thought my presence on the show sort of helped out in that aspect. You just lie and tell someone that their thing is nice it's all you do it's so easy that's insane okay just so you guys know just hey everybody listening at home because technically this is the deepest and most private of conversations uh but just for everybody at home just soyou know what to do about that stumper you lie and say something nice is what you do on 100 of the time for the rest of your life

0:42:43 Tom: It's actually funny because I thought about that with respect to his friend quitting his job to write a book. And I thought, what if he's a terrible writer and nobody is nice enough to tell Tell him, go back to work, man, because you know what Jim never did? Publish a book. He didn't ever actually publish a book, so maybe he wasn't very good at it, you know, and everybody is just like lying to him to be polite, and he's like, all the feedback is excellent. Why is nobody taking up my book and publishing it? So, yeah, I don't know what I think about that. The stakes are higher than a dinner party, youknow, ah, great, great lasagna.

0:43:20 Eli: You just gotta lie.

0:43:21 Tom: Yeah yeah I

0:43:23 Eli: He's got a lie that's like, this is so easy. This is just Human Interaction 101.

0:43:28 Tom: Do honestly think that's that that is a big part of why my dad doesn't engage with the stuff that I produce in the

0:43:34 Thomas: It's because it sucks. No, I'm just kidding.

0:43:34 Tom: World is because if yeah I think he's I think it's like well if I don't like it I'll have to tell him or lie to him and I don't want to tell them it sucks so I'll just not engage

0:43:47 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah, there's also, man, and I don't think I'll be this way with my kids, but there is also a sense where it's like they kind of need to have their own things. Like at that part, I kind of get about my dad again. I don'T know that I'll BE the same way, but I, there is a sense when people, when artists will talk about like, oh, and then my, my dad, my parents, you know, they're my, they'RE my best friend. I'm like, I donT know, isn'T that private? I feel like it'S like the art you'RE making is like not, your parents shouldn'T be involved. I don't know why, but they shouldn't.

0:44:18 Tom: It and eli's like yeah my mom but see the other thing too eli is your folks are also also creators or were creators

0:44:26 Eli: Yeah. Well, my dad wasn't. He wanted to be, but he really wasn't, yes.

0:44:30 Tom: Okay but he was a lover of creating and like yeah he had an appreciation of that yeah I

0:44:34 Thomas: Creativity and yeah. Yeah.

0:44:35 Eli: Yes. Yeah. No, he really wanted to be a writer, too, so he got it.

0:44:40 Tom: Will say like I know I've mentioned before like my dad liked to do woodworking and remodeling and like you know the handy man kind of stuff so that's a lot of times how he'd spend his time on the weekends or like in the evenings like working on some project or building something or whatever so if I called my dad and wanted to talk about like a woodworking or handyman project or something he'd happily talk to me about that for as long as we he wanted because he cares about that and he's knowledgeable and I think he feels like that's a space where we can sort of banter and have like a good back and forth and I Think if I were to call him be like hey I you know I wrote these uh poems daddy'd be like fucking shit I don't know what to do with that fucking hell I mean he's not like I love him but like he went to high school and it was hard for him and that's just true so like I also wonder too if he's like I just don't feel like capable of it you know anyway no I just I was just you know curious because these these issues popped up and I'm like why do I feel fucking weird about these things and then why do some things feel like privileges to me yeah well I don't act on them you know I try really hard not to act on these these things but they're just those sort of artifact reactions

0:45:23 Eli: Man.

0:45:37 Thomas: Theorists to Tom's. Yeah. It gives us good insight into Tom's insane brain. Yeah.

0:45:56 Tom: Where I'm like that's such a nice thing and it's like that'S FUCKING NORMAL STUPID THAT'S HOW PEOPLE ARE

0:46:01 Eli: Well, yeah, that's what I was going to say. What's amazing is Is that, like, usually what happens when you're having this conversation with someone, right, is they're explaining away why they suck, right? And what's really fascinating about doing this show with you, Tom, is like, you are a dad like you had my dad, right. Like, you seem to have spontaneously grown all great ideas about parenting. You've been a good dad the entire time I've known you without exception and every other time I have this conversation about someone's bad childhood or someone or someone like figuring it out as they talk about this kind of thing it is because they're justifying a bad behavior not being like and this is what I've noticed in myself and so like I think that's really heartening for a lot of folks in our audience because look thomas can relate to it but he's just like no your dad's fucking autistic I can't relate to it at all to me you said you ever talk to someone who hits their kids yeah to me your like a guy who's just casually spanking his kid while we're talking in terms of like I have no idea what you're talking about and I wish there was a kind of jail

0:46:58 Tom: Uh no I don't know anybody that hits their kids

0:47:03 Thomas: Just that one time when it happened while I was talking to that guy, I froze. I didn't know what to do. He

0:47:18 Eli: For you right but like what I think is amazing is that you have skipped all the bad garbage and gone right to the good shit like imagine dear old dad's 2 .0 rip rip out of it right where finn and donovan and amen and a's I mean think about the fact that one of the bits that I did on our bonus episode with a'slyn and donavan was like oh it's pretty easy to tell when tom is mad and they didn't have that relation because they've never seen you

0:47:28 Thomas: Really hits his kids like just totally be ripped

0:47:51 Tom: Yeah right yeah no never yeah

0:47:51 Eli: Mad we mostly interact via skype and I've seen you mad a bunch of times that's

0:47:57 Thomas: Out well sometime one time he broke the software door somehow like he ripped the software door off its hinges yeah

0:48:04 Eli: Right like they're not going to be able to relate to this absence at all

0:48:10 Thomas: Yeah that's the goal man that's

0:48:10 Eli: And I think that's really I thinkthat's like really yeah I think thats the fucking goal is to stop and look I know you probably wouldn't use the term generational trauma that's something that just all of the psychiatrists would use but like Like the fact that you stopped that generational trauma or that generational absence in its tracks without ever needing. And here's the other thing, too, because I think this is something, Thomas, that maybe you've experienced. And feel free to tell me I'm I'm speaking too far. I think part of the way that Thomas has been better is to acknowledge the failings of his parents and hold them responsible for it. Part of theway that Thomas is better than his dad is being like, oh, no, that was a shitty thing of my dad to do. And what's interesting in this moment is that you recognize that you don't want to do the things that your dad did without going, he sucked.

0:49:01 Tom: Yeah. I feel very reluctant to blame like I think my mom sucked, right? Like my mom was a bad. I think she is a. Oh, real quick. She's still alive. I just want to tell the listeners she was supposed in January. This is crazy. She sucks. My dad is just my dad. But like my dad tried his hardest, I think, to do a good job within the constraints that he felt. And I sort of am sympathetic to that. Like, I think it's OK to be like, I don't think I wanted this, but I'm going to do it anyway. Here's the best you can do. And I think that's honestly the role that he was probably playing. But my mom's a piece of shit and it's funny to talk about like my mom in january for listeners like they'll remember in januar she was literally on death's door the panamanian government gave my brother like wrote a letter to get my brother a emergency passport so he could fly down to panama and help cedar her final affairs she was on her death literally on her deadbed that bitch is up up and kicking she has got congestive heart failure she's got copd she's partially deaf now from like this experience like damaged her hearing

0:49:06 Thomas: That's true he saves it all for his mom oh

0:49:06 Eli: Yeah. She's still alive!

0:50:08 Tom: But she's just like fucking whatever like I'm just made out of doers and cigarettes and fucking beef jerky or whatever and she is just like powering through my man powering through. It's a guy because I texted my brother I never talked to him except for on christmas and something popped up on like facebook marketplace that It made me laugh. And for some reason, it reminded me of Bob. And it's, I mean, I literally only talked to him on Christmas. I texted him out of the blue. And then I was like, wait a minute, is mom still alive? And he was like oh, yeah, like she's like, you know, this and that. She's doing better. Yeah, because I forgot to ask about it. It's been five months.

0:50:17 Eli: Powering through my mom's corpse.

0:50:43 Thomas: Yeah hey whatever happened with that yeah

0:50:50 Tom: And I'm like, she should have died a few months ago. And I can see him not telling me because he knows I don't really give a shit. So I can say I'm just like not mentioning it. So like yeah I guess that she's still alive

0:50:58 Thomas: Like that thing you remember to ask to be nice socially like that thing you know like Eli's blog like oh oh whatever what happened what happened with the with the like your our mom thing you were into yeah you were doing that something weird about caring about her mom or something how what was that I like

0:51:10 Eli: How's your blog, buddy? How's our mom doing? Doing?

0:51:16 Tom: Yeah well he knows I don't like he knows I don's give a shit so yeah

0:51:24 Clip: DEAR OLD DAD

0:51:30 Eli: All right, gentlemen, before we go, I changed the light bulb across the street and walked into a bar this morning. My life is a joke.

0:51:41 Tom: Oh my god oh my god that was pretty good actually

0:51:43 Thomas: That one that was good

0:52:29 Tom: Laugh with not at laugh with no doubt I just say it over and over in my head

0:52:34 Eli: I was like, hey, can I have some chips? And they were like, no. And I was, like, oh, cool. I'm leaving.

0:52:41 Tom: Great lasagna Yeah.