DOD255: Talk About Body Talk

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:02 Clip: I'm the cool dad, that's my thing I know now what I can offer you that no one else can Complete and under-dependent I'm a man, I'm sensitive I need to feel loved, I need part of being a father that I enjoy

0:00:28 Tom: Welcome to Dear Old Dads, the podcast that's chic as heroin. I'm Tom Curry, I'm joined as always by Thomas Smith and Eli Bosnick. Hello, gentlemen.

0:00:37 Thomas: Hmm. What? Huh?

0:00:46 Tom: That's a tier that we didn't advertise necessarily on our Patreon, but you know.

0:00:53 Eli: That's between you and that Monopoly money guy who I picture representing capitalism. No.

0:00:59 Tom: You guys are quite a bit younger than I am, so like the heroin chic tread was not really a part of your lives, right? Like, yeah. Yeah.

0:01:05 Thomas: I did not understand what you were talking about in the intro, so...

0:01:08 Eli: To be fair, there's no reason Thomas would ever be in touch with culture at any point.

0:01:13 Tom: Okay, but Eli, if I was aware of a cultural touchstone, like that's like, it rises to a pretty significant level. Right.

0:01:19 Eli: No, but it was a bad thing, so it probably happened to you. I imagine at some point in third grade, someone came in and they were like, Hey, kid, start doing heroin. It's heroin chic.

0:01:24 Thomas: Also, there's a thing where if you were... If Tom was young enough, you kind of had to participate in culture until you can become a conscientious objector later in life. I feel like as a kid, I

0:01:29 Eli: And you were like how come you didn't give this to anyone else?

0:01:40 Tom: That is very true. Yeah.

0:01:40 Thomas: Knew about culture stuff that I didn't necessarily know about later.

0:01:43 Tom: Right. And later you could just kind of drop out of life. And it's great. Like the more I drop out, the happier I am actually.

0:01:49 Thomas: Yeah yeah just doing no heroin by myself over here don't know anything about it being chic or whatever yeah

0:01:52 Tom: So chic as fuck though, you know, like I'm accidentally chic as fuck.

0:01:58 Eli: Everyone eventually does heroin by themselves. You guys never did a lot of cocaine, but there's a real moment the first time you do cocaine by yourself, and you're just like, because it's me and cocaine time. Now, two things happen at that point. Either you die, right? You are several months away from an overdose, or you go, oh, man, no more cocaine for me. Oh, time to put away cocaine -ish things, as the Bible says. No.

0:02:27 Tom: Cocaine-ish things. Did I ever tell you the cocaine story about my buddy and the chicago bulls player okay so

0:02:37 Thomas: It's gonna be like Len Bias and like, well, not exactly Chicago Bulls, oh

0:02:40 Tom: So I'm I'm hanging out with my buddy and I've got a very good friend he lives in the city very nice home he and I met at our first title company second for mine but like young guys at the title company and uh he was young and broke I was young and broke we're both like pretty smart very hard work and we're working like like 12, 13 hour days together. He gets a small inheritance and turns it into many millions of dollars and is now quite rich. Yeah.

0:03:05 Thomas: Wow what the fuck are you

0:03:06 Tom: I mean, he's a brilliant guy. I didn't get the inheritance. Yeah. Right.

0:03:09 Eli: He got the lucky half of the amulet and Tom, Tom did not.

0:03:11 Thomas: Doing yeah oh yeah that's

0:03:11 Tom: Yeah, he also got the inheritance that he was able to parlay. But like, yeah, that helps, you know. So now he's he's very I should have, man, I should've worked.

0:03:18 Thomas: Oh you should have worked harder for inheritance I don't

0:03:20 Eli: You should have inherited something. You should've been nicer to that snapping turtle.

0:03:24 Thomas: Know yeah

0:03:24 Tom: He and I have been friends now for almost 20 years, so we should check quite often. And I was hanging out with him, I guess it's six, seven years ago, something along those lines, maybe longer, I can't remember. I'm hanging out and I'm like, with him and we're drinking and having a good time and catching up. We only see each other every few years. I guess, it has to be nine, 10 years ago now, actually. And he's like, hey, I'm going to call my guy and I am going to get some Coke. And I'm, like, yeah, dude, it's fucking your house. You can do whatever you want. And so he calls his guy and, like some dude, like rolls up and that's his Coke dealer. And this guy walks in the house and he's fucking enormous. Like, he's, like 150 feet tall and my buddy is grinning like ear to ear like he's like showing me something right and I'm just like that is a tall man you know but like I don't know this guy so this guy comes in and my body buys a pretty significant amount of cocaine from him like it's not a small amount it's a thousand dollars or something worth of cocaine like it

0:04:19 Eli: That is a lot of cocaine.

0:04:19 Tom: Was a lot of cocaine yeah that's who he is right and

0:04:21 Thomas: That is like three gallons or something I don' t know

0:04:23 Tom: So like we're all the three of us are now all kind of hanging out and bullshitting like a little bit and then the guy's like I gotta go out to my car he's like I'm double parked and at first I'm like I feel like if you're selling drugs double parking calls some like unnecessary attention to just your presence and it's a bad call

0:04:38 Thomas: You guys emergency flashers on and

0:04:42 Tom: Right yeah right like a road flares to you know go around I just thought that was like a crazy aside but so he leaves and my buddy turns to me and he's grinning he'slike did you recognize him and i'mlike no I didn't recognize that guy and he starts laughing he'sLike that's so and so I'm like cool I don't know like I was like I was

0:04:53 Thomas: No, I'm Tom who's so -and -so fucker are you gonna not tell us who it is

0:05:03 Tom: Like did we work with him like I didn't know at all I'm like I Was like is this a co -worker we had that I don t remember from years ago he's like that's from the chicago bulls he's like my guy is a former bulls player and I was like oh well all right no I would have known dennis rodman that's the problem is like five bulls players that I probably would have known no he was not white no no no but yeah it cracked me up so we're We're hanging out. I don't know who that is.

0:05:15 Thomas: Please tell me you're talking about dennis rodman please tell me it was Dennis Rodman ah wait was he white ah okay that would have narrowed it down tony kukoc it's the one white player from the

0:05:34 Eli: Hey, Thomas, the sports people in our audience, fucking loved that one. Okay, buddy? Just because you didn't get any love on this podcast. Yeah.

0:05:38 Thomas: 90s hey you should watch the last dance you guys didn't watch the last dance. You should watch it just to get like all the memes from it. It was good. That was that was a good thing. It came out during COVID. It's about the Michael Jordan you know championships everybody but you watched it. No? Okay never mind.

0:05:55 Eli: Literally everybody except the two people on this I was like hey man I'm sorry no one got your joke and you were like you guys should watch sport you know what we should do we should watch sports yeah

0:06:03 Thomas: You know the meme that's Michael Jordan saying and I took that personally. That's it, and it's like it's a funny it's good. It makes a lot more sense when you've seen the documentary you guys watch it tell me what part you got I'll watch it too and

0:06:11 Eli: What's that I'm gonna have I'm going to pause the episode you guys go watch the

0:06:22 Thomas: The only thing worse than doing coke with tony

0:06:23 Eli: Thing oh but gentlemen do you know the only thing worse than having your cocaine delivered by a top 10 basketball sensation why it's the auto ads the auto adds the not having cocaine of your podcast podcasting experience you wish you had a little cocaine right now right wouldn't your day be a little more fun with some cocaine but you can't have cocaine because you're an adult or you're too young or you don't know any people who are scary and dangerous and that's just how your life has turned out but you know what you can have you know it's like cocaine parasocial relationships with podcasters over at patreon .com forward slash dear old dads we will someday deliver deliver our top patron, a bag of cocaine. We won't say how, we won't say when, but it's coming, buddy. It's coming.

0:06:54 Tom: Fentanyl? No, wait. And we'll double park.

0:07:10 Thomas: Cuco oh nay triple park all three of us will be parked like like yeah yeah

0:07:14 Tom: All three of us. Well, if any time Eli parks, it's double parked at least. Yeah, right. So run over a fucking baby carriage with a fucking car full of cocaine in it.

0:07:28 Ad: [Ad break 1 — ad music]

0:07:29 Thomas: So uh the other day guys my mom comes over for the semi -decadal visit and semi -annual semi oh you know it's kind of on me too I don't know I don' t really try that hard to see her but she comes in and it was just one of those moments where you know I felt kind of good so you know there's some moments speaking as someone who I think as a lot of people are like Like Tom, maybe trying to improve and get away from some of the things of what we grew up with, you know, some of the qualities. Sometimes there's like, oh, damn, I haven't made as much growth as I thought. You know, sometimes there's those sad moments where you're like, ah, damn it. Right back where, you know, where I thought I wasn't kind of thing. Thought I was better than that. And then sometimes there'S the other moment, which was really nice, which is my mom comes in and within 14 14 seconds I realized that she's done something that like oh I don't do that with the kids it's a good thing that I don t and I was like that's fantastic so my kids were in and they're kind of still in a stranger things mode did I talk about that on here where it's the all we watch stranger things together which is great we finished the whole show and of course kids being kids they're like let's watch it again and so they just watch

0:07:38 Eli: She did the best she could. She did it the best. She could.

0:08:01 Tom: What's there to improve on? I don't understand. Everything was great. Oh, God, no.

0:08:46 Thomas: It on repeat which is like there's worse things I can't sit there with them and watch it because I've already seen it now too too much but there's worse things at least I'm like oh okay yeah go ahead and do that anyway so they're watching stranger things and my mom comes in and within 14 seconds she's commented on like every single actor's body and she's like oh that that guy has that bone thing with his shoulder and I'm just like all this stuff about the actors and I was like oh yeah okay all right mom you know because like we don't do that in this house and I think it's good it's like something I've consciously made an effort to not do, which is like constantly commenting and critiquing like the physical appearance of fucking everybody, you know? And it's like, I just realized in that moment, like, oh yeah, we, we don't do that. My kids are like, Oh, okay. Weird. You know? Yeah. They're like, yeah, they, yeah. First off, they're barely listening. Cause they're watching TV. So that was good. That was for the best. Yeah. Pretty much. But I just was, I was kind of proud of it. Cause it was like, that's a, that'S a thing that we just don't really do here.

0:09:34 Tom: They're not even going to understand it. They're just like, why are you? It's weird. You're being weird. Right. Yeah. We don't know that old lady. Why is that old Lady in our house? Yeah.

0:09:48 Tom: Yeah, I put this article in our Slack and I was I've been thinking about this and Haley and I had a conversation about this because I think we've kind of come around and we've we've decided culturally in a very right headed way that like maybe we shouldn't have something to fucking say about everybody's body. And that's that is just universally like that's a good thing. That is absolutely a good time. And then I also think that it maybe hinders us from having some conversations that I worry that we need to have because we're concerned about making sure we don't do it wrong or we feel like we don'T have a right to do it or whatever it is.

0:10:24 Thomas: For example about how weird rfk jr looks did we lose eli is eli still oh okay sometimes he just disappears it's interesting the guy who swears he doesn't have adhd just sometimes just

0:10:31 Eli: Oh, I'm here. I'm Here.

0:10:34 Tom: It does. Just just is gone.

0:10:40 Eli: Sometimes I I'm biding my time. I was actually, I was cause the beat that I had planned was a quiet beat where I was like, might as well tell a singer not to sing any songs or a painter. Sometimes we just don't need to paint like that sucks I yeah you're right but think about how good I am at making fun of people's bodies I'm the mike oh let me do it so that everyone gets it I'm the michael jordan of making funofotherpeople'sbodies and

0:10:48 Tom: He just yeah right

0:10:57 Thomas: Yeah, that's fair. Yeah.

0:11:03 Tom: And everybody everybody's like we're over basketball dude nobody

0:11:07 Thomas: And Eli took that personally.

0:11:07 Tom: Cares yeah right right no

0:11:07 Eli: So yes and society was just like basketball's a little mean uh -oh no bad because then other people who are basketball might feel basketball I'm not talking about them basketball I'll talk about you this basketball over here Oh, I'm sorry. Is my calling taboo? Hey, Keats, I know you're like line 9 ,995. We're not really doing poetry anymore because not everyone can rhyme.

0:11:43 Eli: Anyways, Tom, you were making a good point about not being shitty to people and the tremendous amount of damage it probably causes to come on our people's body.

0:11:50 Tom: Well, no, I like my worry as we sort of navigate a household where, you know, Aislinn has ARFID, and there's a worry about her weight and eating disorders and that sort of thing. You don't want to veer into a territory, especially as things like skinny talk take hold, as celebrity culture grows thinner and thinner and thinner. I worry that we're veering into a directory that is well -intentioned but wrongly applied, where we decide we're just not going to notice these things. We're not going to notice as if they have no impact the cultural world that our kids are living in because we don't want to like, oh, we don'T want to comment on everybody's bodies. And it's like, well, kids are still absorbing messages culturally, socially, through media, through TikTok, through algorithms, through movies and all this stuff. They're absorbing all of that and like not commenting on it or not addressing it or pretending that it's not there, I don't think is a good answer. When you look at the comment section, so this is inspired by an article that I read from The Cut called The Era of Emaciation, Celebrities and Influencers.

0:12:59 Thomas: Oh Tom, I read things I'm able to read words on a

0:13:02 Eli: Tom had me break through the fucking paywall for that for him, and then he immediately gave me homework with it. I'm never doing that for you again. He was like, can you get through the paywall? And I was like hackety hack hack. And he was like great read this fucking thing. I was Like fuck you Pirate me that book now read it all

0:13:16 Tom: 500 words, tops. The subline is celebrities and influencers have become worryingly thin. It's impossible not to notice. And I think when you look at the comment sections for things like this, there's a huge amount of people like, hey, can we stop talking about people's bodies? Can we just not comment on people's Bodies? And I would say, no, we have to be careful about how we comment on People's BODies. But it would be wrong, I think, as parents to pretend that our kids are not living in a culture that has begun, especially with things like skinny talk and some of the messages there, that has began to refetishize skinniness, especially for girls, in ways that are unhealthy and damaging to their bodies and to their self -image. Yeah.

0:13:36 Thomas: Page hmm well

0:14:04 Eli: The women are listening are like refetish eyes, baby We've been fat shamed for the last not since Ruben have we been allowed to eat a sandwich? I don't know what you heard Tom

0:14:12 Tom: I'm just saying it's gotten worse. Like there was in the 90s, like if you watch, it was crazy.

0:14:16 Thomas: It was really bad in the 90s and then it got like better and then worse again right Right. That's my kind of impression of it. Yeah.

0:14:21 Tom: Yes, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, right. And I totally recognize that like body issues have never gone away. You know, even though like the thick thing is problematic, right? Like these messages about bodies are not generally good. But I think we as parents have to be able to address them and I think we run into a barrier where people are like oh you can't talk about people's bodies and it's like well my kids are seeing it anyway and Ithink it's how not if you

0:14:45 Thomas: Also you want to be way hesitant especially regarding women you know like extra so because of this obviously and that's why I think everyone was super duper relieved when that one fuck face also got Trump Mar -a -Lago face. You know who's that? You know the representative who probably in the Epstein files or if not he fucked a kid. You now who I'm talking about. He resigned. Sorry you're right. I've narrowed it it down to every one of them um the guy florida matt gates

0:15:05 Eli: You got to be so much more specific. You're talking about thousands of people

0:15:06 Tom: Gotta be so much more specific yeah like what are you narrow it down at all like

0:15:12 Eli: Marshes in the Epstein files my man. I need you to limit this down do

0:15:18 Thomas: Matt gates how many matt gates's are there no remember everybody was relieved when matt gates got a mar -a -lago face so he'd be like oh thank god we can talk about it we can't talk about the fact that everybody over there mainly the women obviously plus matt gates and a few other men are just butchering their faces in a disturbing disturbing way, like a very, very disturbing way.

0:15:19 Eli: More Do more. Florida? Mm -hmm. Yeah.

0:15:40 Thomas: And it's like, you want to be able to say like, please don't do that. But also it's usually like women's faces and bodies. And you're like, I don't, someone else say, don't doing that. I don' t know.

0:15:51 Eli: Yeah, I mean, I think that what happens is that conversation just gets painted with too broad a brush, right? Because I think the let's not comment on other people's bodies conversation comes from walking through the grocery store every year since the day I was born and seeing, like, Rachel, what's her name? Rachel from Friends. Fuck it. Jennifer Aniston packs on the pounds at the beach. If every time I went to the beach, someone took constant photos until one of them was bad, and then they put it in front of a newspaper, in every grocery store in the United States, with like, little chubby, I would kill absolutely everyone involved. The grocery stores, the newspaper, the checkout clerks, everybody involved. Like, to acknowledge how insane we have been about fat shaming is to be part of that conversation. Conversation but I think sometimes especially for parents who like want to be good we're like great don't talk about people's bodies and then our kids are like why is that person fat and you're like dude no

0:16:10 Thomas: Oh yeah. Jesus. Jesus. Yeah, yeah, there is that too.

0:16:51 Eli: Don't haven't you heard of twiggy no that's like a 40 year old reference okay well I need you to understand a lot of things yeah I I think it's also like what the context is and that's part of the conversation that we need to have with our kids right when we talk about how people treat their bodies, right? Like, so I talk about the fact that I am fat with Max all the time and I don't use it as a negative thing, right. I'll talk about my big belly or I'll talk about how my body is bigger and I have a bigger body because Max has my genes. He will probably have a better body. And we also talk about medicine that I take a medicine for my body, right, that makes my body because he's noticed that I'm getting a little smaller and I'm like, I take medicine for body that makes me a little bit smaller. It's important that we have those conversations. And then on top of that, we defer to them and say like, Hey, and by the way, we don't talk about the fucking vice principal. If she also is a GLP one baddie, we don'T talk to her about how she's keeping her protein levels up. This is just inside the house.

0:17:53 Tom: Like in this article, one of the things I thought gave me great pause was this woman is going through a story where her kids who already have some body issues that they're concerned about, they go to see the Wicked movie, the newest Wicked moving. And I guess the actresses from this movie are quite thin and she says what did you think about the actress's or whatever and this kid who's like 11 or 12 says something like oh body goals as a result right and if you watch like some of this stuff that's like popping off on

0:18:21 Thomas: Dear God. You mean being green, right? Do you mean being green?

0:18:29 Eli: Please mean being green.

0:18:29 Tom: This if you Watch like some of the stuff that like popping off on like skinny talk Haley and I were watching like a breakdown video of some of the this stuff you know some of these big skinny talk influencers and these are huge huge huge accounts that have just an enormous following so they're not like niche things you know they're talking about like hey when you're working out don't do squats and don't doing this don't that because you'll get too thick of legs do walking and running on a treadmill yeah so like the thing is like

0:18:52 Thomas: Oh, shut up. God damn it. Oh no, you'll be too hot if you do this, so don't do it. Fuck you.

0:18:58 Tom: Yeah there's a selling now to kids of a specific kind of skinny culture that has nothing to do with health at all right it has nothing to do with being healthy being strong being fit it doesn't relate to that it relates specifically to being skinny and it is very much a throwback to when I was young in the 90s skinny was important fit was not something people were talking about it was being skinny was being thin it was like you didn't want to have an ass you didn'T want to HAVE a chest you didnT want to I mean like it was fucking emaciated and that's what the skinny talk is glorifying again and then that I think worryingly for for me, sort of like rubs up against this very well -intentioned, we don't talk about other people's bodies. And then who's left to talk to our kids about bodies, these influencers and they're influencers because they're influential and kids are living in a culture where they're absorbing that messaging. And I worry that we're sort of well - intentioned and trying to avoid fat bat shaming, but then we're not able to then have real talk conversations about like the problematic world that these kids are growing up in and the sort of like goals, hashtag body goals, you know, that they're being sort of, like, railroaded into by

0:20:15 Eli: Absolutely. I also think that there's for so many of us, because social media and the rules of social media have blended into this like alternate Facebook life that so many people have. It's like, okay, I know that on social media, right? So let's use Ariana Grande as an example, right. So Ariana Grande looked to me unhealthily thin. I don't know. I'm not her fucking doctor. I've not in her inner circle. I am a fucking weirdo from upstate New York who thought 9 -11 was done by the me's at one point. So not a lot of great decision making but when I saw her in that movie I was like too thin I

0:20:49 Tom: The me's.

0:20:48 Thomas: You thought they were done by the use, but they just weren't telling you about it? Man. You like weren't involved.

0:20:54 Eli: Thought that was done by the me's and like I was going to eventually be it I was gonna be at a temple service at one point and they were gonna be like and by the way we got them and I'm gonna be I knew it I knew him

0:21:03 Thomas: I love the idea that you weren't invited to the cabal, though, like you're not.

0:21:06 Eli: Have I not told you guys the story about me like kind of asking my dad if he'd ever heard any scuttlebutt about us doing 9 11.

0:21:12 Thomas: Oh, my God. No way.

0:21:13 Tom: Oh, my Lord.

0:21:13 Thomas: No way, no way. Oh, yeah, this is important.

0:21:14 Eli: So I was high all I promise I'll get back to our very serious topic about very serious things so I was high all the time at this point I had watched a bunch of zeitgeist I was also just doing a bunch like it's you

0:21:26 Thomas: Cocaine with the Chicago Bulls, you know.

0:21:27 Eli: Know I wish that would have been really cool so there's this thing called depressive psychosis which is that you get so depressed that your thoughts become distorted to the point of psychosis and part of that was the spiral that I had over the government thing and I've talked about this other places I won't bore you with it but like it was that I was like the result of a government conspiracy essentially oh yeah it

0:21:48 Thomas: Dude, I don't think I know anything about this. What the fuck?

0:21:50 Tom: This is amazing. This is new lore.

0:21:50 Eli: Was it was not fun so I I call my dad who I can talk to about everything and um I don't know if you've ever had a psychotic person

0:21:57 Thomas: Dad, have you ever done any 9 -11s?

0:22:01 Eli: Almost word for word Thomas I don'T KNOW IF YOU 'VE HAD A PERSON IN PSYCHOSIS TRY TO HAVE A HEART -TO -HEART WITH YOU BUT IT'S LIKE WHEN A REAL PERSON DOES RIGHT THEY'RE LIKE HEY MAN I JUST GOT TO TELL YOU THE DUCKS THE DUCTS MENTIONED THAT YOU BEAT YOUR WIFE AND I I I want you to stop. I want You to stop that's not an okay way and you would just have to take a second because they're doing the real tone to go and so I got on the phone with my dad and I was like has anyone ever mentioned like a secret society and he was like no what kind of secret society and I Was like so there's I mean I don't know if you know about this but there's a there's There's a lot of evidence that, yeah, cause fucking there was zeitgeist and then some YouTube videos and then some forum posts.

0:22:36 Thomas: I hate to be the one to have to break it to you.

0:22:38 Tom: Oh my God. There's a lot of evidence.

0:22:47 Eli: That's all the evidence I require. Yeah.

0:22:49 Tom: That's it. Yeah.

0:22:50 Eli: Dr. Reverend Alex Jones. I had all, yeah. So I definitely tried to like get with my dad and figure that out.

0:22:47 Thomas: Yeah alex jones

0:22:54 Tom: Jesus Christ.

0:22:55 Thomas: Yeah that's so funny so what do you say do you say

0:23:00 Eli: Much as I love my dad, he handled that in exactly the way you're not supposed to, which he was like, you're full of shit. You need to get your head out of your ass. Look, I didn't think my dad was in on it, but I was like that poor Rube. That poor, feckless Rube Right, yeah, exactly

0:23:14 Tom: Go lift some weights some more, Dad. Jeez. What do you know?

0:23:24 Ad: [Ad break 2 — ad music]

0:23:26 Eli: Don't take my word on anything, but I watched that movie because I like that musical and I was like, that lady too skinny That's probably not good And I also, because I know GLP -1 drugs are a thing Do I know if she's on them? Absolutely not But I was, like, she's probably on those And she probably takes them so that she can be too skinny Right? I had all these thoughts in my head That I don't know And there's two conversations That are both completely acceptable to have the first is where I go into my online life and I'm like oh should I make a post about shitting on Ariana Grande's body and like calling her anorexic and making a bunch of assumptions about her medical health and her identity as a person no shouldn't do that it's bad it's not nice and then there's over here in my life where I have to talk to my kids about what a healthy body does and does not look like and there I should talk about what healthy bodies do and do not look like. And again, this is where the Charlie Kirk liars come out of the woodwork and they're like, actually, you're never supposed to say anything about bodies. And they're lying. We know they're lying and they know they'RE lying, but the Facebook part of their life has bled over into the real part of Their life. So they can't pretend. They're not always the person they are on Facebook. Yeah. And that's what I think the problem is here. Right. Which is that like there There is a public persona version that we have all learned to have, and not talking about other people's bodies is a really, really good idea. And it kind of dribbles over into real life, because you should be careful how you talk about other People's Bodies, right? You should make...

0:24:58 Thomas: Hey I just want to remind you there are some people maybe just me but there are some below just are the same everywhere and it's kind of I just what I did is I decided to change my behavior as a person because it's not good to talk about people's bodies so much and And so I just don't do that. And it's not a virtue signaling thing online. I just wonder, I just, the possibility

0:25:03 Eli: There are some people who are the same everywhere we go.

0:25:11 Eli: Right, exactly. But for most people, they've just created a weird persona on the internet.

0:25:17 Thomas: That some people actually genuinely believe the things they say. I'm not saying it's everybody, but you know, it's definitely,

0:25:21 Eli: Not a fucking one. I hate to disagree with you, T -Dog, but I'd like you to visit the old Book of Face. You'll find you are alone. Alone.

0:25:29 Thomas: Yeah. No, you could find the many examples of people who don't, but I don't think it's like everybody. I think a lot of people genuinely are like, this is progress we should make as a society.

0:25:39 Eli: No, no. I don't think that guy thinks we really want to kill all the snakes either. I'd say that's just fucking lying. Nope. No. You know why? Because he drives a car and he goes to work and he has a nice day and he eats a sandwich. You can't function in. I know people who are in that level of psychosis all the time. They have these cool socks with grippies on the bottom and And they are being dealt with in a medical scenario. The idea that you go about your day, you watch two episodes of Stranger Things, then you log on and go, actually, I think you do want to kill all this. No, it doesn't happen.

0:25:45 Thomas: Oh, I think that guy does think that. I very much think that guys does think like that.

0:26:16 Tom: Got to bring it back a little bit because I think there's a tension that I want to acknowledge that I think is really important. And that's like if we have conversations with our kids that focus entirely on like what healthy bodies do and what healthy bodies look like and all that stuff, I think that's great. And I think two -thirds of the conversation has to be dealing with the fact that people want to look a certain way people like an a certain body aesthetic we have to acknowledge that people deeply want to look a certainly way and we have just say like hey you're gonna want to a certain way tell me about how you want to like well how important is it to you and it's going to be different for different people and they're going to have different fucking body goals and they have going to have different people that they find influential or that they're going to like sort of like aesthetically look up to and you can't tell kids teenagers especially young people who are just coming into their you know social sexual prime that they shouldn't or can't or what like that's not a starter that's just a total non -starter right like oh that's Not What Health Looks Like like if you're a kid you're like would you rather be attractive or healthy I mean I'll let me take that back for most people right I don't want to say kids like for many

0:26:45 Eli: Doesn't happen, yeah.

0:27:31 Thomas: To be like attractive yeah right

0:27:36 Eli: Luckily, some of us are both, Tom,

0:27:36 Tom: Many many many people so I do think it's really important that we acknowledge that people want to look a certain way and that that will often be more important to them than being healthy and unless you acknowledge that as a parent like you don't have a starting place where you can be on the same page and that's fucking awkward right because like the message we want to send is that our health Health is the most important thing. But, like, if that's the message that I'm getting, I'm going to be like, that's not that important to me. Like, I want to be attractive first, and then I'll worry about health later. And that's just true.

0:27:39 Eli: Blessed, yeah, you have to add on to that the fact that if you are getting your what beauty is information from social media, that's fake

0:28:19 Thomas: Yeah I don't know how many of the ariana grande photos are are actually just bullshit like I actually don't no some some amount of that was once there's a trend then people make the exaggerated one um or I say I mean people it's evil ghouls but it's it's also like the clickbaity um you know pages or whatever they'll make the like photoshopped version that's even emphasizes even more like how skinny she is and I don't I actually don't know because I haven't like taken the time to look I don'T know how much of that is bullshit like some amount of the skinny crap you saw with her I think is bullshit but I I don't know how much.

0:28:55 Eli: Yeah a tremendous amount around it is bullshit. Do you remember when they that headline was going around that they were in a non -loving something something fancy schmancy right they just put a bunch of relationship words together and there was a headline going around that was like this is what she and the green one are in right and that turned out to just be a hundred percent fake right that was fake news so yeah there's a tremendous about but even when it comes to like beauty influencers hashtag body goals those photos are all photoshopped right you're never going to look like those beauty influencers you like because those have all been extensively put through filters and photoshopbed and like genetics aside it's physically impossible right you know I remember growing up and not understanding that like the ripped superhero bodies I saw were on roids because roids to me was just professional weightlifters and I remember the first time someone mentioned like Hugh, what's his name? Wolverine.

0:29:51 Tom: Hugh Jackman.

0:29:51 Eli: Hugh Jackman being on roids every time he has to. And he hates being Wolverine because he's got to get back on steroids. And I was like, Hugh Jackmen's not on steroids. He's just a normal hot guy. And they're like, no man, he gets on a bunch of steroids and then he eats nothing and drinks no water. And they take six pictures and then they still use computer imaging on those fucking pictures.

0:30:12 Eli: Right. And that's a really important conversation to have. Cause if you set your beauty standards at these things you see, especially things that mask themselves as reality. Speaking of everyone being a liar, but Thomas on the internet, right? You will always, always have a bad idea of what you can actually look like.

0:30:29 Tom: Yeah. Like, when I was a kid, when I was a young person, like the big controversy was photoshopping women on these magazine covers. And everybody was appalled. Like every like media critic and like fashion critic and body critic yeah but like now it's basically the

0:30:41 Thomas: They should actually ban that. Yeah, true. Yeah. Yeah.

0:30:45 Tom: Same thing built into your phone as a filter right it used to be at least that like an editor had to do it and you had to buy the magazine right it was like and now

0:30:53 Eli: You used to be a job creator.

0:30:55 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah. I was going to say. They used to look a man in the eye when you killed him. Now it's just a button you push.

0:31:00 Tom: It is though like a little bit like the ubiquity of these things has accelerated these trends in ways that are impossible to control, right? So it used to be like, yeah, that's a fucking magazine. But it's like, I don't know, man, like if kids are spending the majority or a huge amount of their social time engaged on their phone, online, on screens, and the things that they see on there are impossible standards that are not actually real to start with, and that begins from a very young age, they're set so far back. They're swimming uphill against a series of messaging that's impossible and I just think that as parents I don't know what the answer is I don'T even know how the conversation should go I know that they're really important and I know the answer to it can't be this sort of like well we can't comment on people's bodies because like we can'T do it in a shitty judgy way a hundred percent we can 'T decide like what bodies are good what bodies are bad I DON'T even think you can say what bodies ARE healthy and what bodies Are unhealthy because I DON 'T think you CAN determine somebody'S health from a glance at their body that's not a real thing either but like we have to have conversations with our kids about bodies in general theirs and the ones that they see and like what their like aesthetic goals are and whether or not their genetics even make those realistic yeah I think of like finn on the boy's side like fin's got my genetics right if finn was like dad I really want to be slender so I can wear like yeah like I'm never going to be a slender guy I am never ever ever going to to be a slender guy for the past several years with hayley like being sick many many days I eat one meal a day she eats one meal every day I eat with her I might have a couple of snacks here and there but I eat one meal per day and I don't lose any fucking weight like it's

0:32:27 Eli: Lucky.

0:32:47 Tom: Just not like no

0:32:47 Thomas: Until you get on the GLP -1.

0:32:47 Eli: Tom, the difference there is if you just don't stop eating, it does technically count as one meal,

0:32:53 Tom: Yeah one meal I mean it's a very calorie dense meal but it's like I'm just saying like for finn and I we are

0:32:53 Eli: But you need to, it's the, it's an entire bag of dog food. The big ones that you're supposed to put Putting the trash cans, the bugs don't get in them.

0:32:57 Thomas: It is pure motor oil rocket fuel.

0:33:09 Eli: I do one of those a day.

0:33:09 Tom: But For certain genetic types, it's going to be really hard to gain weight or really hard to lose weight or like, you know, really hard to have a certain aesthetic. So I just I'm just like very aware that these are really tough conversations that we need to have. And we have to be aware of like, hey, what are you watching? Like, what aren't your fucking hashtag body goals? Because I got to tell you, like, I feel like we have an obligation to know that, like to ask our kids that question and to see like how important on that continuum are these things to you? Because I know some people were like looking good is way more important than being healthy that's

0:33:33 Eli: Yeah, 100%. And here's the thing. A buddy has said this to me a few years ago, and I think about it all the time. He said, any conversation you don't have with your kids, someone else will. So if you don'T want to talk about bodies, right? If you're one of the people that Thomas Pretends is real that just has a moratorium on body talk, someone else WILL have a conversation about bodies with your kid.

0:33:52 Tom: Exactly it yeah yep yeah yeah man that's exactly true

0:34:06 Eli: And it'll be it'll be the most money-making thing which is the worst version of it always the worst version

0:34:12 Thomas: So I got to talk to my kids about the Jewish cabal that did 9 -11, I guess. Fuck.

0:34:14 Eli: You do gotta talk about your kids about all that bullshit absolutely did 9 -11 so do you know George Bush Jr. he it turns out he was the third worst president I know I know I did not I didn't think I would suck him out of a giant's dick to have him back is what I'm telling you kids I would work that stump with all my might to have him back as president he He wore a little cowboy hat. It was great. Why are you crying? I'm talking about, I'm going to talk about bodies eventually. No, not the giant I'm jerking former President George Bush Jr. out of.

0:34:19 Thomas: Okay. So Eli's dad, um, kids, uh, I have it on good authority.

0:34:53 Eli: God, let a man build a moment, kids these days. Am I right?

0:34:53 Thomas: I

0:35:05 Ad: [Ad break 3 — ad music]

0:35:07 Thomas: Don't know what just happened. Did I interrupt you? What were you saying? Yeah. The conversations you got to have with your kids because someone else will.

0:35:08 Tom: I have no I have have no idea what was going I

0:35:13 Thomas: No, No, that's totally true. And mind you, I don't want people to mistake me for advocating the never saying anything. I think Tom's making a good point. Yeah, it's tricky. It's like, well, I think, Tom, didn't you talk about one time one of your kids just, or maybe that's the story you were starting to talk about. I can't remember where. It was like all of a sudden they had this idea of how skinny they should be. And it's like oh, where's that coming from? What am I remembering? Did that happen?

0:35:13 Tom: Yeah that is true no no yeah

0:35:19 Eli: No, of course not. Yeah, yeah.

0:35:38 Tom: All of my kids have ideas about what they bought their bodies to look like I'm at least peripherally aware of several of them right so like amen I don't think has any idea right now at 11

0:35:50 Eli: I've been texting him, but he won't, he,

0:35:50 Tom: Or at least he's yeah but everybody else you know everybody else has expressed some desire to have a certain aesthetic and like well of course they they have, you know, of course they have. They have a desire to have an aesthetic because everybody had a desire for a certain aesthetic. I have at 47 years old, part of why I work out is to stay healthy. And part of the way that I workout is to build a certain body aesthetic that I happen to like for myself, because there's a lot of different ways to work out and they're going to build different body types. So it'd be absurd and hypocritical.

0:36:22 Thomas: Work out the door ripping off the hinges type, for example. Says tom yeah yeah

0:36:25 Eli: I love it when I can break things that I just try to touch gentle.

0:36:30 Tom: But like it would be hypocritical to be like yeah like aesthetics don't matter all that matters is health right like that's an insane thing to say when we do and live our lives in ways that don't match that and like I also think it's really important to emphasize to our kids and I know I touched on this but I think it's really important they have no idea if somebody's healthy based on looking at their body type that you cannot know you know like somebody who's thin might be thin because they're sick or they might not be and somebody who's heavy might be able to run a marathon you have no fucking

0:36:39 Thomas: My favorite

0:36:52 Eli: 100%. Mm -hmm. No.

0:37:03 Thomas: Example of this just to do more sports that you guys don't care about is phil kessel any chance you've heard of phil kesel he's a hockey player who no he's a hockey player who looks like well now I don't want to like say anything bad about bodies but he doesn't look like he would be an athlete of any kind he's yeah

0:37:09 Tom: Idea no is he from modern family I think he's from modern

0:37:20 Eli: He sure doesn't. I've gone ahead and Googled him. Tom, this is what I imagine your brother looks like based on the descriptions. This is, I

0:37:26 Thomas: Yeah google phil Kessel this dude Dude, fucking not only was he a great hockey player, he's not playing anymore, although he probably could for some team. But I think he finally like nobody signed him. Not only is he a good hockey player. He has the Ironman record for most games played in a row without like missing a game. He couldn't be more like an amazing athlete. And he's overweight, you know, like round looking to your point of like you don't know what's actually healthy for people. Or like people have an idea of what an athletic body is. And that's even wrong oftentimes.

0:37:26 Tom: Family yeah right

0:37:57 Thomas: Times because this guy this guy's incredible it's not actually athletic and I also used to love um mixed martial arts for this reason back before you know all the fascists took over ufc or they were all there all along but you know fucking dana white and dude

0:38:09 Eli: Put a picture of Phil into our Slack chat, Tom, just so you can see.

0:38:12 Thomas: This guy look at this guy he was incredible yeah

0:38:14 Tom: Okay hang

0:38:13 Eli: He looks like one of your wife's friend's husbands who she tries to get you to hang out with. And you're like, no, I'm good. I'm going to

0:38:19 Thomas: Wouldn't it be like imagine being like that guy fucking ruled as a hockey player he did he was good

0:38:26 Eli: Imagine trying to fight. Hockey players can kind of fight, right? Imagine because I would absolutely pick a fight with this guy. I'd be like, come on, Gramps. And then he'd be like, I'm the Phil the Thrill Kessel. And I'd be, like, what do you mean, Phil the Thrill Kessel? You're a used car salesman.

0:38:29 Thomas: Yeah he wasn't a fighter but yeah probably oh no he'd kill you yeah yeah so good yeah guy fucking ruled so I was saying ufc as well um like I used to like that because there's there's great memes where it's like imagine try to explain to somebody in the 90s that the guy on the left could beat the shit out of the guy in the right and the guy on the right will just be some skinny guy and the gather I'll be a bodybuilder or whatever

0:38:43 Eli: And not a great one. You're an okay used car businessman.

0:39:00 Thomas: Because it's actually fighting body is not bodybuild or body really bodybuild her body is actually not useful for anything like there's pretty much nothing unless you need to lift I don't know a very specific thing in a very scientific way it's actually not yeah

0:39:14 Eli: On the Ocho.

0:39:14 Tom: It's not even great for lifting necessarily yeah

0:39:17 Thomas: Tom would know better yeah I don't I don' know that much

0:39:19 Tom: No bodybuilding is specifically about about creating an aesthetic it's not necessarily about any kind of functional I mean you're going to be strong for sure don't get me wrong but it is not the same as like power lifting crossfit any of these sort of like other sports where there's a functional element to this like body building is specifically to build an aesthetic and it's actually kind of interesting when you as a bodybuilder if you were to go on competition day that is the day you are absolutely the weakest So the day you aesthetically look the best, yeah, you're starved. You're dehydrated as fuck.

0:39:48 Thomas: But sure yeah right you've starved yourself and

0:39:54 Eli: You're oily.

0:39:54 Tom: Like you are. Yeah. Yeah, I will

0:39:57 Eli: You look like an artificially hard dick, right? Not a regular hard dick. Not like it's a good time. It's like a porn star took a nine Viagra and told his agent this is the last time, he swears. Liars level dick.

0:40:00 Thomas: Stuff yeah

0:40:14 Tom: Say like I would never do bodybuilding.

0:40:17 Eli: Me neither, Tom.

0:40:17 Tom: I actually don't think that there is a lot of ways. I don't think there's a lot of ways to do bodybuilding that actually reflect a healthy self -image because of how toxic that culture that is around it is for the most part yeah

0:40:28 Thomas: Think a lot of the women skinny stuff or a lot of the stuff women do to look better is the equivalent of bodybuilding I don't think women are huge into bodybuilders maybe some but I don't really think they are but I think the dudes think they aren't I think other dudes are like man I bet women love that giant guy and the the same thing yeah and the same thing with the super duper skinny stuff that's the weird thing is like no one really wants this stuff but everybody wants it I don't get

0:40:42 Eli: Oh, it's the, yeah. It's the Batman Spider -Man thing.

0:40:54 Tom: What we're doing is like we're all working toward social goals rather than goals that like on an individual level everybody is like hey do we actually want this and everyone's like yeah for themost part no and then it's like yeah but you know because we take everything to a crazy extreme like data does show that like Like, people tend to, like, in male bodies, tend to like a more muscular V -shaped body.

0:40:54 Thomas: It it's weird right but that's a slight yeah yeah exactly

0:41:21 Tom: But then we take it to an extreme that is, like. Insane. Right. And the same thing with, like thinness. Right. Like, it is not unclear that in the last, you know, hundred years or so, maybe a little less. Thinness in women has been socially, sexually desirable. But, like there's a level of, like craziness that people take it too. That it's not healthy.

0:41:38 Thomas: I don't defend men often but I do want to say that if women could see in the average straight dude's heart how body positive they actually are in terms of their sexual tastes I think it would be encouraging I think you'd be encouraging no

0:41:50 Tom: Maybe the people you know.

0:41:50 Eli: Thomas. I wish I wish buddy, but unfortunate. So this actually brings me back to the Facebook liars because I think Thomas is right.

0:41:58 Thomas: I don'T know no you are interpreting me as saying that But I think like being super overweight or something is attractive to men. I'm not saying that. I'm saying that like men actually really like, you know, hips and a butt and legs and stuff. The idea on social media and on these magazines in the 90s and shit is that men would like or anybody would like this, you know, four pound completely bone thin. And that's just not true. Like men actually aren't really like that.

0:42:23 Eli: So again, I think it's sort of comes from the Facebook liars, right? The opposite end of the Facebook liars. So the Facebook liars on the right have just repeated the lie that men find skinny more attractive so often and the men insist on that so often even though I agree with you that it's not true that it'S created this idea that that's what men are attracted to oh yeah

0:42:48 Thomas: Oh, I didn't. OK. Yeah, I don't think it was anything to do with that, but I'll take your word for it. I was just talking about like you and I just don't even talk about whatever that is like I mean no

0:42:57 Eli: Well you because you don't talk about bodies with me I wish I was someone nobody will I text tom pictures of strangers in public all the time and I'm like four out of seven. And he's like, stop, stop. Why would it be a scale of seven? I need the midpoint not to be even between the two. I don't know what to do with an even midpoint. It's a silly idea.

0:43:00 Thomas: No I'm inviting the opportunity like our tastes I think

0:43:08 Tom: I just think your odd seven scale is weird that's the thing that throws me off yeah are we doing decimals or not I don't know if we're doing

0:43:21 Thomas: I think that most straight dudes uh I won't say most I know many straight married dudes have the thing where their wife is complaining about their body and you're trying to say like what the fuck are you talking about like first off let's have sex right now I don't know what you're talking about I'm into this body secondly can you stop thinking these negative things about yourself and yet it doesn't matter doesn't work and that society do you guys not have this problem I guess maybe it's just me society tells women that they need to be a certain way or something tells women they need to be certain way and meanwhile often the dude in the relationship is like what stop I don't not want that like just be normal you're great

0:43:46 Tom: Decimals no no yep but I think that there's there's an interesting tension there that is I don t know if I'll be able to properly articulate but like I think there is a distance and a difference difference between wanting to be attractive sexually to your partner which is generally a lower bar and easier to achieve right I think that's what you're

0:44:17 Thomas: First off how dare you secondly yes

0:44:17 Tom: Putting your finger on right yeah right and by that I mean like it doesn't conform to this very rigid narrow social standard and then there is the larger but I also have to go out into the world and the entire world is telling me that if I look this other way, I will reap other social advantages. And so I need to look this another way, regardless of what my husband thinks or my wife thinks. If I look this other in the world, I'll reap other advantages. We do know for sure that people who are thought of as attractive are thought as being friendlier, as being smarter. There's a lot of like pretty privilege a lot of attractiveness privilege that's documented and real yeah

0:44:57 Thomas: I feel like I'm not maybe I'm that yeah I'm saying that doesn't exist that's not at all what I'm saying yes this is god it's weird if this is just me have you not had like you know your partner be like oh I need to be way skinnier here and here and you're like nope don't care not at all don't need to do that

0:45:12 Tom: But but that's the thing is I I do understand what you're saying what I'm saying is that they want to feel skinnier there here here and here not to be attractive to you they already know they're attractive toyou they

0:45:23 Thomas: Well they might not but yeah

0:45:23 Tom: Wantto be attractiveto the rest of the world because broadly that really is the message the world is sending them

0:45:31 Thomas: Okay I guess I was just I didn't understand the attractive I wasn't denying that attractiveness is a benefit in society it sounded like you were saying I was because you were like oh yeah okay

0:45:38 Tom: Right no I'm just saying like that's why it's so important is because it reaps so many benefits. And if society is sending us a message that attractiveness is narrow, it doesn't really matter so much if you're like, yeah, but honey, I think you're beautiful. It's like, yeah, but like I got to go out in the world. I will be better socially accepted if I match this narrow prescription.

0:45:56 Thomas: Like yeah so I guess the mismatch that I'm trying to say is like why does this happen is I don't actually think in the world it's true either it's like a social media slash magazine back in the day thing I donno hollywood pop culture version of what's attractive that I actually don't even think is what quote unquote the real world even necessarily thinks is attractive that's what I think the

0:46:21 Eli: Oh, a hundred percent.

0:46:22 Tom: I do too. I do though. Yeah.

0:46:22 Thomas: The sickness is and I don' know what that comes from

0:46:24 Tom: I think if you are a person who matches the social beauty standard that music videos and movies and television and social media all tells you is attractive, that you are going to reap more rewards than any other body type, more social rewards.

0:46:44 Thomas: Yeah what I guess I'm saying what like what creates that I I don't know what creates that fucking incentive for it to be this extreme plastic surgery, skinny type of person that actually in reality, I don'T think most people think is that attractive.

0:46:57 Eli: So I think social media is so much more persuasive of our quote unquote self -image, right? Than our real interactions are, right.

0:47:04 Thomas: Yeah. No, no, I get that. I'm saying like, what, where does the version that that thinks is attractive come from? That's what I'm trying to say.

0:47:09 Tom: That I don't know.

0:47:10 Thomas: That's the thing I'm try to say,

0:47:10 Tom: Like, I will agree with that. Like I've never understood the origin. Yeah.

0:47:12 Eli: Oh. Where does like like thinness is a trend come in?

0:47:14 Thomas: Yeah, thinness and like, and a lot of the plastic surgery stuff they do,

0:47:16 Eli: Oh, we sell it. We sell it, yeah.

0:47:17 Tom: Oh, exclusivity.

0:47:19 Thomas: But why that you're still not answering. This is like, I'm tryna say, but who created God? And you're like, uh, the Bible or something. I'm like, no. No. Why is that the version and not something else? Like, I don't get what creates that. Like, you know what I mean?

0:47:31 Tom: My theory is that in part it's exclusivity, right? Because this, these body types are so difficult to achieve and they're so rare.

0:47:34 Thomas: Oh, that's interesting. That might make sense. Yeah.

0:47:39 Tom: I think it's easier to commodify things that are rare, right.

0:47:43 Thomas: That's a really good point.

0:47:43 Tom: And that's just true of all things yeah right

0:47:44 Eli: And being thin is also expensive.

0:47:46 Thomas: Cause you, yeah, you couldn't really sell like, Hey, look pretty much like the average person.

0:47:51 Eli: Right, you can't sell. Think about the things that you get to add, diet pills and GLP -1s

0:47:51 Thomas: That'S a good point! I've never thought about it from that angle. Yeah, that'S a great point.

0:47:56 Eli: And fucking surgery. You can't cell normal body image.

0:47:59 Thomas: Huh. Well, I feel like that maybe should be a comforting thought to people. And I think think that applies to men too it's like I think that's kind of fake like I actually think for the most part that's not what society in general even for men and women is going to think is really that attractive like if you meet a random person on the street it's not going to be the same standard and I think it's because that's a really good point it's probably because of the exclusivity look

0:48:19 Eli: Have we not done an episode? Because we should do an episode called Women Don't Care About Looks At All, Yes, I'm Serious. Because it's one million percent true.

0:48:29 Thomas: At phil kessel chick magnet

0:48:30 Tom: I don't believe that

0:48:31 Eli: One million. Women are aware that some men are more attractive than others my wife isn't like eli's the handsomest man in the world they also don't fucking care even a little they're like yeah

0:48:38 Thomas: I say that by the way I think you're the handsomest man no they don't

0:48:45 Tom: Uh that's not

0:48:45 Eli: No that guy's hotter than you but you remembered my favorite flowers so come on over to pram they could

0:48:51 Thomas: Well I disagree that last with that last part but yes I think this is so true

0:48:51 Eli: Not give less of a shit about how hot you are

0:48:57 Tom: I don' believe this at all yeah

0:48:57 Thomas: I think I think maybe not to the extreme eli's saying but I think the gulf between what men think women think and what women actually express on this attractiveness thing it's so fucking huge like women are so much more about demeanor and confidence and and how men

0:49:13 Tom: But the idea that attractiveness doesn't matter at all like I know I don''t know if you're kidding or but like if you''re saying that like as a real and it does does not matter at all. I think that's patently insane.

0:49:24 Eli: I think when it comes to the real the real decision -making they do, right? I'm not talking about which Instagram they hand around to their friends, right, I'm talking about when it comes to, like, making life decisions about who they marry and who they bone and who they have kids with, all the stuff, like push -comes -to -shove decisions, all one need do is visit the married philosophy professors of any philosophy department in this nation to see looks don't matter. Just a bridge stroke. This is Asmeranda! She used to work for Victoria's Secret, and now she cleans the gunk out from my wrinkles. And she's like, what can I say?

0:50:03 Tom: Yeah.

0:50:03 Eli: Consent imperative of beauty, am I right? He taught me that, and then he remembered my favorite flower, so here I am. Have you not seen the, oh, dude, this is a fun game. This is an amazing game to play, which is called Philosophy Professor at Any Given University. Name a university, then go to their philosophy department, then Go to the Staff page, and you will see not just the smartest, loveliest people you will ever meet, you will also see the human randomizer hit on absolute zero 100 % of the time. Everybody looks,

0:50:00 Thomas: Act what the fuck this is a weird direction our philosophy professors pulling really heavy uh no I don't know what this okay okay no but you're saying they also have attractive like wives or something oh

0:50:39 Eli: Spouses, every single time, go to any department meeting in a philosophy department, everyone is married to an absolute Adonis descended from heaven and they all look like they just emerged because a god jerked off onto dirt. 100 %of them.

0:50:53 Tom: I do not agree that it has no bearing at all, I think it has a way lesser bearing than a lot of people think that it does, I think there's a way less of a bearing than people, especially men, are selling other men, for sure, right? Like, men are selling to other men that is the only thing that matters, I think that's nonsense.

0:51:12 Eli: I'm just hitting all fucking homerooms I literally googled philosophy professor and wife and it is just a series of smoke shows and the god damn mouseketeer puppet they married I am crushing this

0:51:18 Thomas: Okay phil kessel yeah yeah yeah that's interesting I've never thought about only you would notice to something like

0:51:28 Eli: I am squagooshing this so hard I'm just scrolling through I might as well have googled Eli you're right and you've never been wrong about anything

0:51:38 Clip: DEAR OLD DADS

0:51:44 Eli: Gentlemen before we go what do you get when you cross a motorcycle with a joke a Yamaha ha ha ha

0:51:55 Thomas: That that's stupid

0:52:40 Eli: Oh man no more cocaine for me

0:52:45 Thomas: You know the representative who probably in the epstein files or if not he fucked a kid you know who I'm talking about he resigned

0:52:50 Tom: You got to be so much more specific.

0:52:50 Eli: So much more specific you're talking about thousands of people Eli's the handsomest man in the world oh

0:52:58 Tom: Yeah, that is a tall man.

0:53:02 Eli: I'm sorry is my calling taboo