DOD141: Getting Frisky at a Quizno's

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:02 Clip: I'm the cool dad. That's my thing. I know now what I can offer you that no one else can. Complete and utter dependence. I'm a man. I'm sensitive. I need to feel loved. I need to be desired.

0:00:22 Clip: Telling is the only part of being a father that I enjoy.

0:00:28 Tom: Welcome to Dear Old Dads, the podcast that's mad that Eli and Thomas haven't seen Inside Out 2 so we can talk about it for an hour. I'm Tom Curry. I'm joined as always by Thomas Smith and Eli. I won't watch Inside Out 2 until they bring back Bing Bong Bosnick.

0:00:35 Thomas: All right new

0:00:44 Eli: That is my position and I stand by it strong and proud,

0:00:47 Tom: Not friends anymore. This is the end of the show. This how the show ends, not with a whimper, but with a Bing Bong bang.

0:00:52 Eli: But with a bing bong.

0:00:53 Thomas: Like saying I I'm not gonna watch Schindler's List 2 unless they bring back a bunch of those characters yeah I don't honestly that's like the same it's that's how I feel

0:00:58 Eli: All the Jews, yes, that's, can I say? That's how I would feel. That is how I'd feel if they were like, hey, do you want to watch Schindler's List too? I'd be like, no, I'm not gonna watch Schinder's List, too, because I'm still so sad about those Jews. Also, Tom, you're not bing -bong. Here's the problem every bing bong in the world spent their time watching inside out being like huh I'm like bing pong it's funny because I'm not like bong bong and then a little girl's like I guess it's time to grow fade into death bingbong and

0:01:18 Thomas: You're not wait oh I didn't even think about that

0:01:33 Eli: I'm just sitting there because I am like it's a kids movie there's no way they perma killed bing -bong who is me I keep waiting for her to see like an old doll on a shelf and be like huh oh bing bong's doing okay and then he like pops in and he's like how's it going happy hanukkah everybody right but he doesn't he doesn't she just gets over him because he never mattered he doesnT even get a ball he doesn 'T even GET A BALL he

0:01:50 Thomas: All you yes a ball oh like a core memory wait what what's a ball

0:02:05 Tom: It doesn't it doesn't get put into one of the little like core memory balls

0:02:06 Eli: doesn´T get a core memory he doesn''T get anything they're just like I don't know and then some fucking kike died I don´t know whatever we had some kike elephant and he was uh new listeners I am of jewish descent in case you're uncomfortable with this just you know anyways but there's this elephant he's fucking dead

0:02:11 Tom: Jesus christ jesus Christ holy fuck jesus

0:02:20 Thomas: He's jesus yeah well he's already gone before the that movie he not inside out one he's He's already like not in her life anymore. I don't know what.

0:02:31 Eli: He's not in her life anymore he's

0:02:32 Tom: He's not her life but he lives in the he lives the recesses of her mind

0:02:35 Eli: He's alive there's

0:02:35 Thomas: He's in the.

0:02:36 Tom: Right. She has to actually kill him from her own mind.

0:02:37 Thomas: Is he? I don' t know.

0:02:40 Eli: Yes she he's completely again I have to be very clear about what happens to bing bong bing bung doesn't die and go to heaven right because at least a children's movie where fucking like Bambi's mom we can assume is in Bambimom heaven right where she has green grass and she sits on the right hand of Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior Bing Bong ceases to exist he falls into the void he

0:03:01 Tom: Well, yeah, he sacrifices himself too. So it's like this, like, it's, of her own mind to protect itself.

0:03:10 Thomas: Right. We don't need to talk about the movie so much. This one's on my do not fly

0:03:15 Tom: It's like, yeah.

0:03:15 Thomas: List. The kids are not allowed to have this on. I'm not joking.

0:03:19 Eli: Try zero fucking solutions before they vault off Bing Bong's skull all like yoshi in mario island yeah

0:03:28 Tom: But it wouldn't be a Pixar movie if it didn't reach into the part of your soul you hold the most dear and just kind of rip it out and make you look at it and feel things about it.

0:03:37 Eli: Can me hit you with a

0:03:38 Thomas: Rip into it. Yeah.

0:03:41 Eli: Hot take about these pixar movies because everybody's like oh growing up to pixar I don't think they had to do that to us you know how we look at the movies from when we were kids right sleep and beauty and we see all the scary shit right like when I showed my son little engine that could and for no reason they were like I'm a demon mountain and I want to eat your soul and I was like oh we're turning you know forward 30 seconds till this motherfucker's gone I'm sorry I thought it's actually I think I can is I don't know if you've read the source material yeah

0:04:09 Thomas: I haven't heard of that jesus

0:04:10 Tom: Didn't know this.

0:04:11 Eli: Guys you gotta watch when you watch little engine that could the animated film for no reason I mean literally no they don't even tease it like it's not like they're like but what about the demon and the mountain no there's just literally the train is like kind of chugging along and then And all of a sudden, the mountain's like, what if all that happens after death is pain? And Millenium Code is like, oh, no. And then they fucking move on. And they're like a talking bird. And I'm like, hey, check in with me real quick. So here's my hot take. Here's my razor hot take, I don't think grown up ennui that those 3D animators put in should have been in there.

0:04:49 Eli: We need to kill Bing Bong. I've talked to a lot of Gen Zers. They're not okay maybe the reason they're not okay is because you fucking killed bing bong when they were six have you thought about that you thought about that maybe maybe your climate anxiety didn't belong in a children's movie yeah

0:05:00 Thomas: Has it been that long isn't tell that to fern gully I

0:05:08 Eli: Thing remember when there was gay oil and the gay oil was a menace and the younger listeners are sitting there being like I don't know what he likes there was gay oil kids the Robin Williams was a bat and he was like oh Oh, how's it going? What a go to whatever. He was like doing straight up bits, right? Completely out of universe. And then fucking Tim Curry, the epitome of homosexuality at that time was like, I'm gonna lose the oil and I'm going to lose all over your face and chest. And we were just like, I'm eating my crackers before school while we watch that.

0:05:41 Tom: Look I I think we could all agree like pixar didn't do anything new in terms of traumatizing kids with cartoons everything you're describing is just a laundry list a litany of the different traumas that all of these cartoons like

0:05:55 Thomas: I think what pixar did that was new was it traumatized adults as well I think that's what it did yeah

0:06:00 Tom: Because all the kids to to see it this weekend we all saw inside out too and everybody walked away like that movie was fucking awesome that movie was genuinely honestly incredible I'm

0:06:10 Eli: Who do they kill? Do they kill someone? Do

0:06:11 Thomas: Thank

0:06:12 Tom: Not giving anything away no spoilers no inside out two spoilers this

0:06:15 Eli: They bring the ghost of George Burns onto screen and then shoot him in the head and you watch his brain splatter down the back wall while everyone continues their conversation like it didn't fucking happen?

0:06:25 Tom: Cannot be the moment where I tom on this show watch a kid's movie and you guys don't and we don't talk it's always the the other direction it's always the other direction you god damn it it's

0:06:34 Thomas: You yeah we'll never watch it yeah I I mean I'm I might but I so way back when we did an episode on this and eli and I had one of our many inventions that we don't have time to make, which is sad dad rating. You don't have the faith ratings. They that but for sad dads and inside out would be the, I don't even know what the good comparison is, but like the top of that mountain it's is

0:06:43 Tom: So good

0:06:50 Eli: Thank you. Dead It's the Dead Dog website. Yes. It's The Logo of the website. The Logos of the site is bing bong.

0:07:04 Thomas: Bing bong.

0:07:05 Eli: And and it's what we're doing with that website when you pay the monthly fee you help us fundraise for bing bong one and a half which is just just us rewinding the footage of that and then we pay that voice actor to go never mind I'm fine and that's it that's what we are saving up for with saddad .com

0:07:22 Thomas: But I don't know what the bing -bong rating for inside side out too is, cause there's no way to really suss that out. There's also a nut, like I've mentioned, there's, there's two to three Pixar movies on my don't fly list that I cannot have on in the house. I've, you know, it's, it's been a while since we've talked about this, but I, not exaggerating when I say that, like we don't put them on in a house. I it's hard because now once with Disney plus the the kids are kind of, you know, a little more independent now, they actually remember and they they're will like, run run it by, you know, Lydia, like, Hey, can we put this on? And and I'll just be like, okay, I just have to like, not be around, you Know, but

0:07:23 Tom: Because haven't seen it

0:08:01 Eli: Dad's

0:08:01 Thomas: There's two of those movies.

0:08:01 Eli: Gonna go to a coffee shop

0:08:02 Thomas: Yeah. I, well, I'll just go to, you know, have headphones on. They, they, no joke, put inside out on the other day. And I was like, well they really want to see inside out too. So I'm not going to take, they're like, Oh, we're so excited for inside out too. We want to watch inside out one. Like, I'm not taking that away from them. I was working. I literally put on my headphones and turn my monitor. So I couldn't see like move my life around so that I couldn't see the TV. Cause even the edges of the frame were, like, killing me. I it just puts me in a depression. I can't watch that movie and one other movie that will go unnamed. And, and it's not necessary. Look, I love Pixar, but it's not necessary, you know, it's a great movie. Uh, WALL-E, uh, you know, it's a great movie? Uh, the chef one with the rat that's

0:08:45 Eli: Ratatouille

0:08:45 Thomas: Ratatouille fucking phenomenal movie. And it doesn't make me go to a depressive state for several months. Like I can just watch that movie and cry a normal human being amount. Just stick to that?

0:08:46 Eli: You

0:08:57 Tom: Right don't know whether to tell you whether or not you can watch inside out to that I have no idea whether or NOT this movie

0:09:01 Thomas: I might

0:09:01 Eli: Know we can't watch inside out too time it's about teenage emotions emotions we couldn't handle the movie about childhood emotions and I know that they added some for the teenage one oh

0:09:04 Thomas: Be able to, oh man. Yeah. Well, in fairness for me it's like, I had Phoebe at the time.

0:09:19 Thomas: Like, I can't handle that. So, maybe I'd be saved by Inside Out 2 that Phoebe's still too young. She's not that age, you know? Like, maybe that would help me. I don't know.

0:09:28 Eli: Maybe yeah but I hear it's really good and

0:09:32 Tom: Outstanding it's genuinely genuinely it's fucking outstanding

0:09:33 Eli: Probably see it at some point I it's funny I have a screener of it from the director's guild and I was I I in my comments I was like not until you bring back bing bong send I didn't actually do that They would stop sending me screeners, but it would be amazing. It would be Amazing if I sent in all the comments from the director's guild that they pull from for nominations and stuff. Suddenly on the poster is just not until you bring back Bing Bong, some weirdo in New Jersey.

0:09:44 Thomas: That would be really funny. Yeah.

0:10:00 Eli: Gentlemen, you know, the only thing worse than the death and destruction of Bing Bong's consciousness to no effect and with no memory for anybody anywhere. Why? It's the auto ads. The auto ads! Kids, they're the Pixar deaths of our podcast, but you can prevent those deaths by heading over to patreon.com/dearolddads, where for as little as a dollar a show, you'll get access to commercial-free versions of every single show with a parenting story at the end. And sometimes, Tom shows up for that part, which is fun.

0:10:33 Eli: Oh, what's happening next week, Tom? What's happening NEXT WEEK?

0:10:32 Tom: Once I didn't one time it's not showing up yeah

0:10:38 Eli: That's right. That's That's

0:10:38 Tom: Yeah that's true all right you got me on that one you got me that one I'm

0:10:40 Eli: Living up to your name and reputation.

0:10:43 Thomas: Are you still... Hold on. Are you Still doing that bit, Tom? Where you're pretending you're taking time off? That's...

0:10:43 Eli: Anyways. Yeah.

0:10:48 Thomas: All right. Are we... Eli, are we supposed to...

0:10:48 Tom: That's it why it's locked in it's

0:10:50 Eli: I don't know, it's a weirdly... He'll cancel it at the last minute and he'll be like, Oh, it turns out the time dimension was there. Or something. You know, you gotta...

0:10:51 Tom: Locked in

0:10:51 Thomas: Speaking of participating in other people's kinks or not, like we're going to pretend you're OK. All right. Your fantasy.

0:11:03 Eli: Podcast listener, this episode I was going to talk about kink stuff. I now want more than anything to not talk about that so that we just have a comment on -star review on iTunes. Liked this show until Bing Bong made Thomas say, speaking of other people's kinks, Bing Bong's kink is the of my name username, so please don't take that.

0:11:08 Thomas: Talk about it. That joke just sits there. Patreon .com slash zero death.

0:11:29 Eli: Get ripped into it.

0:11:31 Thomas: Rip into it.

0:11:32 Eli: Rip it.

0:11:27 Tom: Oh fuck oh thomas squamous is in there we go he's ripped into it all right so eli I downloaded tiktok just for you so we could do this I did super

0:11:38 Thomas: Oh boy I

0:11:39 Eli: Rule of threes. You did. It's true. You gave the People's Republic of China access to so much of your data, just so much of your Data, so that we could talk about this. But there's a TikTok going around that I thought was interesting.

0:11:52 Tom: Fun

0:11:57 Thomas: Just imagined someone from china contacting tom hey we just based on your whole thing um we were wondering if you could be a consultant for us trying to you know interrogate dissidents um we think you might have some insights into that

0:12:13 Tom: Hey china if you pay call me

0:12:15 Eli: He keeps giving suggestions and they're for staff, but they think they're torture things that's

0:12:23 Thomas: Yeah oh I was gonna say he keeps giving suggestions they're like well we okay I don't know it's

0:12:25 Tom: All right so here's

0:12:27 Eli: Too much man relax

0:12:28 Tom: How you wake them up in the morning

0:12:29 Eli: Silly it's a bit much for us

0:12:29 Thomas: A little uh uh we can't okay well why don't we just kill them then like why don' we just killed come on

0:12:34 Tom: That's a little much there settle down curry yeah

0:12:36 Eli: It's you're crazy are you okay um I saw this tiktok um we'll put in the show notes maybe uh yeah I volunteer thomas to put in this or lydia more likely to put into show notes This is a TikTok by Darth Idiots who talked about eternity collars and wearing infinity collars around your children and sort of what place sex has in front of our kids. So if you're not familiar with an eternity collar, they're a kink thing. They're like a relatively hardcore kinking thing. And basically it's a metal necklace that you can't take off. You can cut it off, obviously, but you like, you bend it onto you when you have it. And it is usually for people who are in dominant and submissive relationships. And what

0:13:20 Tom: By usually all

0:13:22 Thomas: Those people have like a blacksmith they go to to do this that that fits actually

0:13:25 Eli: They've got a person. In fact, they, they they sell like make your own eternity collar kits. I'll say not my cup of tea, right? That kind of like, and now we go to the grocery store and do this thing has never been my dance party. Um if it's your dance party I well actually it kind of gets to the point of this which is like I think if that's your danse party and you can assure that nobody's kids see it rock on right like if if my grocery store was like hey everybody we're closed from eight to nine so all the kinky people can fuck each other with watermelons in the aisles I'd be like hell yeah I'll shop at 9 30 make sure you mop but the minute your sex thing gets public enough that a child could like see it I'm like ah nope he's

0:14:10 Tom: Right so real quick when Eli was telling us about eternity I didn't know anything about an eternity collar I googled it I clicked on because I was curious that

0:14:17 Eli: Wearing one now

0:14:16 Thomas: We're not we're we're not buying it, Tom. Yeah.

0:14:20 Tom: Thing doesn't electrocute you I'm not interested I

0:14:24 Thomas: It's not hardcore enough. I

0:14:27 Tom: I'm always amused though what I find on ebay used eternity collar now just something about that that

0:14:35 Thomas: Think you'd be an oxymoron. You would think like that can't exist.

0:14:37 Tom: Where it's just like oh all right right um something went real wrong something just went really really wrong this is a big

0:14:44 Eli: Thank you

0:14:45 Thomas: That's like best case scenario. Someone died.

0:14:47 Tom: This is that scene from fight club like I You don't know where I've been, Lou. You don't know where I've BEEN.

0:14:47 Eli: But what this tiktok was about and what I thought could spur an interesting conversation because there there's going to be an easy answer to this question but we don't have to worry about that so what the tiktak was about is this fully adult woman now is is talking about how her parents or her mom and somebody were in a dom -sub relationship and that there were non -sexual things that happened outside of the bedroom that were still part of that, right? And so the example she gives is, like, she would do a water -serving ceremony for her dom whenever the dom wanted water. And it wasn't sexual, so she did it in front of her kids.

0:15:28 Eli: And that, thank you, that noise that Thomas is making is the noise I was making while I was watching it right and the the question of course is was that okay and the answer of course absolutely not absolutely a hundred percent not but but the question that I think is worthy that I Think is interesting is where is the line how much do we want to be you in front of our kids and where where can that affection travel into the realms of the sexual versus non -sexual? Cause I think honestly, like you cannot be too affectionate in front of your kids, but you can be too sexual. If that makes sense.

0:15:28 Tom: It is, though. Yes, it is. That's sexual. Ew. Oh, perfect sense. I think you want to model for the kids a relationship that loving and loving often looks affectionate, right? And that means, I think don't think this is actually like a tough line to draw like I really don't like I think we kind non -insane people understand that over the clothes not touching your genitals not touching like not like grabbing a boob like like know arms around snuggling like not fucking like like an hour -long make out like these things are all normal this is fine but like it starts to get into like would I want my dad to watch this no all right cool my kids probably don't like there's an easy litmus test right like for normal people which

0:16:51 Thomas: Because your dad will give you pointers. He's got the best sex films.

0:16:55 Eli: So you got to watch minute three 47 to four 13. I'm telling you that's.

0:16:58 Thomas: Let me go to the big shelf that has all of them and indexed in chronological order well

0:17:02 Eli: He's watching them like football tapes.

0:17:05 Tom: Like kiss hayley in front of the kids for sure but like I'm not gonna like fucking make out for 10 minutes you there's a difference right but like well we're kissing and a kid walks in I'm Not like embarrassed about it or anything like that's perfectly fine

0:17:07 Eli: Like you won't. Sounds like your life. Yeah.

0:17:17 Thomas: Tom and I last episode firmly I think it was last episode firmly established we are pro consensual sexual harassment in front of the kids so funny

0:17:26 Tom: Absolutely like I'll grab her ass right but I'm NOT gonna like grab her breast in front of the Kids I think there's like a playful difference right

0:17:31 Eli: There's a massive difference between those two yeah right

0:17:35 Tom: That's what what I'm saying like like when you said that like like the water ceremony is non -sexual it's like yeah it is a hundred it's part of your sexual role play it doesn't involve your genitals this fucking water ceremony but that's partof your sexual role play you can't involve your kids in your sexual role play that is insane

0:17:50 Thomas: Not trying to disrupt the entire whatever but just when you you said that I just was curious for a second thinking like why is it that grabbing your wife's ass which is like the me that's like nearer to the technical place where the sex happens versus grabbing a boob is like out of bounds whereas you are like they're there's used for things other than stuff you of you were like Like definitely that's 100 % different, way over the line. And I'm not like saying I disagree. I was just thinking like, why is that? And I think it might have some relevance to the discussion in terms of how much of this is just, okay, what's fine within the societal norms and pushing that behavior a little too much, you know? And how much are those redundant questions?

0:18:35 Eli: It because grabbing a butt is generally not meant to be erogenous and grabbing a boob is the consensual grabbing of a grabbing is the wrong word because it's almost there's very little situations aside from Tumblr where grabbing is the verb you want to use there but when hand meets boob is probably foreplay right part of sexual play but hand meeting butt is not necessarily that case

0:19:07 Tom: That I think that's I think that's it I think you can like look like I would I a coach might slap, player like on the ass, right? Like, but no, but I'm saying, like that's, there's socially, like there's a norm around that, right, a norm that, like is understood to be non -sexual. I think, like you can, like slap your kids on the ask, like as like they're, like walking up the stairs, like or whatever, and that's there's, a playfulness to it, right. That is non - sexual, and so I think like one thing for me to, like reach up and playfully like you know hayley's butt when she's walking up the stairs but I'm not like massaging her ass in

0:19:10 Thomas: You guys are doing it wrong.

0:19:10 Eli: You shouldn't do that right culturally right

0:19:17 Thomas: Yeah, you shouldn't do that. God, God, that shit bothered me so much in high school. But yeah, go ahead.

0:19:33 Eli: There is a tickle factor to it yeah right exactly

0:19:45 Tom: A sexual way right we don't have the same social agreement around breasts

0:19:49 Thomas: I need to see if there's any rights -free super sexy music that I can just put like low under this the whole time. Oh, yeah.

0:19:58 Eli: Oh yeah what

0:20:00 Tom: We just don't Have the same like sexual agreements around breasts where it's like there's never a time where like touching somebody's breast unless you're like a doctor doing an exam or something or very rarely a time I don't want to like exclude every possible permutation because we had a fucking boring email that doesn't matter about it yes thank

0:20:17 Thomas: Checking for lumps.

0:20:16 Eli: If I'm in a fire and the only way

0:20:18 Thomas: I'm checking for lumps, kids. It's breast health.

0:20:19 Tom: You right thank you yeah but

0:20:22 Thomas: And now she's going to do my testicles.

0:20:25 Eli: Cliffhanger but it's boobs instead of hands

0:20:27 Tom: But I do think that that's the reason right is there's lots of scenarios where like can like touch somebody's butt and it's not necessarily sexual it certainly certainly can be sexual, but it doesn't. It's that, it's that necessarily, or more often than not factor. I think that's what makes sense to me. Just thinking about it out loud.

0:20:44 Eli: Side road you guys and this is this is a genuine side road you ever accidentally touch a friend's like or boobs and be so freaked out by the interaction that you don't know how to function no

0:20:57 Tom: Uh, no, no, I don't think so.

0:20:58 Thomas: I think I'm pretty good at not doing that.

0:21:01 Eli: You never like bumped someone or like run into none of those situations right

0:21:06 Tom: Where you're like, you go to reach for a glass of water and you end up with like a titty in your hand. You're just like, Oh, that's weird. That's I miss that.

0:21:10 Eli: But no you like reach across and someone leans forward too quickly or like you get someone's come on you've accidentally right I'm not talking to me I'm talking about a full honka honka right

0:21:16 Thomas: Just a brush by just a, yeah. Here's the thing. I imagine that's happened, but it's so not memorable to me that I wouldn't. So, but, it sounds like it's major trauma for you. So

0:21:28 Eli: It because I I myself on being a safe person to be around so every time that happens I'm like well there it was there usually my friend hasn't noticed that I like accidentally brush their butt as I was going past them in the movie theater, but I spend the next 20 minutes in just mortal terror that I have traumatized my friend. Just me? Okay, just me. No, I'm all alone.

0:21:48 Thomas: Man, yeah, you're

0:21:49 Tom: I I think I have a I don't have a similar worry about it I'll tell you like my I was like maybe 10

0:21:53 Thomas: Like, I'm not a Harvard attorney. I'm a Harvard lawyer. I swear to God.

0:21:57 Tom: When I Was like 10 or 11 my cousin you know 13 my cousin kim uh who is 23 moved in with us because she was going to work at my dad's store for a few years so she moved in and was living in our bedroom and she was 23 and I was 13 and I remember what happened but she started like trying to like roughhouse just playfully roughhouse you know and I was like so mortified by trying to I was like I what if I accidentally touched her boob or something and like when we were I refused to like ruff house with her because I was like nope nope like been like paranoid about that for my whole life like my whole whole life

0:22:29 Eli: Tom just curls up in a ball. He's like, you win! You win!

0:22:32 Tom: For I I remember being like yeah we're not doing this like I I guess I I have the same I don't remember ever actually like making a mistake on that but mostly because like I think I've been hyper vigilant in a almost pathological way

0:22:33 Eli: I'm shocking myself. Ha ha.

0:22:35 Thomas: Shocking. I know.

0:22:46 Eli: This is how I know I've done 166 episodes of this show anytime you start a story I have a small anxiety attack we

0:22:53 Thomas: I was worried if we were just learning another thing, were we just learning Another thing.

0:22:55 Eli: Were yep we were absolutely about yeah

0:22:58 Thomas: So I'm sorry. A 23 year old lived in your bedroom room and initiated some,

0:22:57 Tom: Everything's fine everything's fine nope everything's fine everything's fine

0:23:03 Eli: So one night she invites over a boyfriend and he's a seller of men no this is fine you trust me you'll think it's funny you'll be you

0:23:08 Tom: No no everything's fine this time promise I promise this is a good story you guys gonna like this one so that's

0:23:14 Eli: Guys are gonna like this one is says that in the same tone as a human trafficker introducing a child in a cargo hold somewhere

0:23:25 Tom: You guys gonna Like this one is a day that's a danger zone I will admit I've recognized that yeah yeah

0:23:30 Eli: It's a danger yeah sure

0:23:33 Thomas: God. But I wanted to come back to like how much of this is just like, I look, I couldn't agree more with I agree too much. And we all agree too Much on this. So I wanted To pose the question for the sake of argument. Are ways in which this is merely what societally acceptable is looked at as, Oh, that's OK to do in front of your kids. But there was a time when it's like, OK, but two guys can't kiss in front of a kid because that is that is obviously pervert. Like there was a time when was actually a view that was expressed openly, if not still now in some places. But like that was like the consensus in our childhood was, yeah, even if you were in a liberal place, yeah. OK, gay people are fine. But like you can't don't do it. You can't do it in front of kids, though, like you can.

0:24:14 Eli: There's actually a very famous story about me as a kid uh the first time we went to provincetown

0:24:19 Thomas: Tom, Tom, we're going to learn another thing. Are we going to know?

0:24:20 Tom: I'm a little his stories are much safer yeah this

0:24:23 Thomas: He did date his dad okay here we go

0:24:25 Eli: That's true well

0:24:26 Tom: This is going to be about a time he grew up rich or something

0:24:28 Eli: It's actually you're not far off thomas you're actually not far off so we're walking I'm probably like five or six years years old and we're walking around Provincetown which if you're not familiar Provincestown is a part of Massachusetts yeah is like very very very gay friendly and was sort of a safe haven for gay culture for a really long time and my mom taught there at the Provincethown Fine Arts Works Center really really cool spot for artists and writers and people like that but it was where people could be openly queer um ways that they really couldn't in other places and so that was is where I saw two men kiss for the first time. And so we're walking along and like two guys are in front of us and they like kiss goodbye. And I turn very, I'm like five or six, and I turn Very Huffily to my parents and I say, well, I hope that was his father.

0:25:11 Thomas: What what the fuck that is the weirdest thing I've ever heard why would you

0:25:16 Eli: I said as a kid. I and like my parents were super cool with gay people. So that was just straight up, that's an OG homophobia. Be a baby Eli's homophobia coming right out to play yeah

0:25:28 Thomas: And and like talked about how kids just put everything in categories and it's six is a little old because Because Phoebe's six and she's well past that. She'll always remind Arlo, well, boys can have long hair. Well, boys, you know, she'll always do that thing of reminding him. But I do think there could be something to that. I'll tell you, Eli, it's interesting. What about like a poly situation around kids? Like, then like, on one hand, if you did all the same things with another person that Tom has declared are totally fine because it's not sexual to grab your wife's ass, news to me, but if you do that with another person, all of a sudden, then you are doing something that's a little less socially acceptable, and I wonder what people's reaction would be, I wonder how you would handle that, you know, like, that's interesting. Interesting.

0:25:41 Tom: Wouldn't

0:25:53 Eli: That's tough yeah would say this right only poly stuff I could imagine that would be inappropriate in public is triangle stuff right because if it's two people they'll just be like ah those two people are the couple and also they have a friend with them right

0:26:31 Thomas: I mean around your kids. Sorry. I mean, around like your kid. Is there the the feeling of like, oh, this is going to be confusing or this is gonna make them think that, you know, like, OK, well,

0:26:40 Eli: Kids don't care at all yeah

0:26:42 Tom: The same rules apply like as as a non -poly relationship though like right you're having if youre going to get into a relationship and there's already kids right so I'm thinking of like when hayley and I were in a relationship we already already had kids. So we were not going to introduce each other to the kids until we were both really sure as much as we could be that that person was going to be in my life. My intention was for to be In My Life permanently as a permanent fixture. And her intention was For Me To Be In Her Life as a Permanent Fixture. And until we both felt very confident about that, we weren't going to meet the kids.

0:27:16 Tom: Wouldn't the same idea apply for a poly relationship? Like you can hang out and be a friend, but you're not going to get introduced as anything other than a buddy or be seen doing anything other than buddy stuff unless you're going to be a permanent fixture.

0:27:28 Eli: And is actually a conversation in the poly space is like hey stop introducing your weird fuck buddy who you met three times to your family and then you just have some fucking unicorn with a you gory tattoo sitting on the couch next to your nine -year -old like fucking wait that shit out a little bit before the family gets involved so yeah Yeah, Tom, you're you're exactly right, which is that that that is a conversation that is being had in the poly community.

0:27:55 Tom: And I think that's a very, like, like generally that that is a good idea for non -poly couples, right? You don't just introduce everybody you're dating to your kids. Kids

0:28:05 Thomas: That's interesting, because my intuition would have been especially I don't know, wasn't I sure, but I was anticipating Tom like you don't think there'd be any because I feel like when it comes to your kids, especially small kids. Kids there's it's not like they're going to question like okay but is this a friendship or are you getting it on and it's like you could just keep that a friendship the whole time and then not have the risk that your kid at school one day mentions you know your parents other partner kind of thing and I wasn't sure if I guess I brought it up as a way to kind of test that variable of like it's the same kind of behavior but it's less societally acceptable so does that change the calculation? And maybe, maybe the answer is it doesn't, I guess. I don't know.

0:28:47 Tom: I mean I think that person could be just off the top off the cuff like it makes sense to me that that person Could Be a Friend of the Family but like if you're going to make it known if youre gonna like you or cuddle or behave in ways that appear to be affectionate or romantic with that other person I don't think you would want to do that in front of the kids until or until and unless that person was going to be a permanent lifelong fixture in in your home. And if they're never going to be a permanent lifelong fixture in your home, then there's really no reason to do that in front of the kids, right? Nothing to gain from having that interaction visible to the kids. So if they are just somebody who comes by and plays with you once in a while, then why would you ever have that open to the kid and invite that conversation? That's your personal sex life.

0:29:34 Tom: That's not something that you would necessarily have to connect to. But if that person is going to a permanent part of your family then it's just necessary right like whether or not like it's like my cup of tea it would just be necessary at some point

0:29:46 Eli: Actually have a friend who had this scenario and had it in the funniest way possible, which is and this is like the cartoon of what you would imagine would go wrong. The kid was drawing a picture of his family in school and drew partners that his mom had. And the teacher called what she believed to be the birth dad to break the news to him.

0:29:57 Thomas: Yep. There you go.

0:30:11 Eli: Called our friend Devin, was like, we want you to know that your daughter drew someone else who she says your wife spends a lot of time with. And he was like. Yep. Are you talking like that?

0:30:10 Tom: What

0:30:26 Thomas: Also, fuck that teacher. I got to say, come on. So fucking stupid.

0:30:28 Eli: I so fucking weird. So fucking weird

0:30:31 Thomas: That's you wanting to be dramatic.

0:30:31 Eli: To look at that picture and be like, yes. To think

0:30:34 Tom: That's yeah they're trying to confirm the tea is what they're trying to do so they can have a conversation in the lounge

0:30:36 Eli: To think that's your job as Mrs. Smitherson to be like I gotta fucking tell this guy his wife's fucking other people like this so a banana steak here's what I will say here's my hot take here's my brave take get ready for an open heart so we have three poly couples in our life who have other people in their lives and I'll tell you what I find perverted and disgusting that I'll never accept they just call that guy chris and I hate it the kids are always like that's my mom and that's my dad and that's CHRIS and I'm like no no no we need a tie it's fucking

0:30:49 Thomas: I was waiting for one of those.

0:31:05 Tom: What do you mean wait

0:31:12 Thomas: Yeah

0:31:12 Eli: Insane when they're just what

0:31:12 Thomas: I kind

0:31:14 Tom: A minute wait a min hold on like we gotta roll that one back like I'm just Tom to Donovan and Aislinn.

0:31:15 Thomas: Of agree with that to your

0:31:20 Tom: What would they call me?

0:31:20 Thomas: Triad okay

0:31:21 Eli: You haven't replaced them for the four loco can yet you gotta

0:31:25 Tom: He's their dad. I'm not their dad, Haley is Haley to Finn and to Eamon. They're not going to call her mom. Eli, what would they called us? What, yeah.

0:31:27 Eli: Come on no I

0:31:30 Thomas: There's gotta be well I think that's eli's point there needs to be a new term somehow

0:31:37 Eli: Is exactly what I'm saying yes we need like a I've upgraded my parent term

0:31:43 Thomas: Maybe not full -on mom or dad but like give me semi something semi -dad yeah

0:31:47 Tom: I hated this. So when I was a kid, I had to call Lynn, Aunt Lynn. And I still refer to her and fucking

0:31:54 Thomas: That's not the answer yeah

0:31:55 Eli: That's definitely not it because that's your dad fucking his sister

0:31:56 Tom: Weird that's fucking weird I never liked it I understood the impulse the

0:32:01 Thomas: Your dad made some curious choices around that

0:32:03 Tom: It's the same pulse you guys are driving at is to like create some kind of like familial connection with the with the nomenclature but like it's

0:32:09 Eli: They're setting up the camera that night and she's like really aunt lynn

0:32:11 Tom: Weird it's freaking weird like I don't yeah

0:32:17 Thomas: Guess we're doing some incest shit in this film

0:32:19 Eli: All right fine I didn't didn't get these lines ahead of time so this is a cold reading for me just so you know we agreed we were going to run all scripts past the dramaturg

0:32:38 Thomas: I don't know when we got the reveal that tom had to watch his dad's sex tape but everybody tom had TO WATCH HIS DAD'S SEX TAPE yeah you were forced by

0:32:43 Tom: Yeah like did not watch my dad's sex tape I did not watch it I did watch my father's sex tape I

0:32:46 Thomas: A rapist babysitter to watch your dad's sextape that happened okay

0:32:49 Tom: Am aware that he has a sex tape yeah

0:32:51 Eli: That it exists tom was like I'm aware it existed and you and I were immediately like tom watched it every day after school

0:32:57 Thomas: No the babysitter tried to make him watch it come

0:32:57 Tom: The babysitter watched it yes but we did not I did not watch that sex tape so so,

0:33:02 Thomas: On I wasn't

0:33:03 Eli: And I wanted him to watch it much like I want you to I want youto read the diaries and I want tom to watch the sex tape yeah

0:33:03 Thomas: Making that up and I oh yeah Yeah, same thing. There's probably diagrams in the journals, you know.

0:33:12 Eli: Exactly exactly useful for everybody

0:33:12 Tom: She watched it, I did not watch that tape, so, but yeah, there does have to be another name, but there isn't one, step and -parents have the same problem, where you're just, you know, I'm just Tom to the kids, and it is like, just tom

0:33:27 Eli: My gosh I know we don't invite people into our social media lives but I have to tell the listeners about this because it's so funny so uh posted this really sweet thing all the kids were eating the same meal the other day and so she posted this great video of them all eating the Same Meal and if you've listened to the show you know that like the kids have various food issues so it was like a really lovely sweet moment that was a little ruined for me by how absolutely obviously two of the kids are yours and two of the kids are Haley? Cause it's like two Haley clones and two Tom clones and we're supposed to be like oh, find the fucking difference.

0:34:02 Tom: You're not like finn is fucking huge like he's huge and like donovan is you and thin and aislinn looks

0:34:11 Eli: He looks like a de -aged version of you. He looks likes you're about to run into the room and be like, guys, the machine! It worked! Bam, bam, bam!

0:34:21 Tom: Yeah that was actually a great moment like I was going to talk about that for the parenting story but yeah they

0:34:24 Thomas: That's crazy. Yeah. Okay. We can save it for that.

0:34:27 Eli: Well, stay tuned, everybody. Give us a dollar and you can find

0:34:30 Thomas: Had a joke, but I'm not going to make it right now. I'll wait. And it won't be good enough and it'll be edited out anyway

0:34:32 Tom: But know but

0:34:32 Eli: You're for the patrons, that joke. Ever since thomas has said that he pictures ass grabbing is sexual I'm picturing him trying to get things started by just goosing lydia over and over again ow stop stop

0:34:48 Tom: Fine

0:34:48 Thomas: Just I just grab enough until yeah like alternate hands alternate cheeks and then she's like fine

0:34:53 Eli: Eventually I'm holding you like a pet bird I

0:34:59 Tom: You did say something I want to come back to you real quick thomas I think it's like I think its interesting and and it is important like you said like what part of this is just society and I think like when it comes to sex and sexuality it is really important like that social norms around sex and sexuality are important things to consider and to sort of understand the boundaries of in a really like explicit way especially when it comes to like raising our kids I don't want to be careful about what I say here but I guess like we all know those people who are just like well that's just a social norm so I'm gonna fuck right in front of the kids or whatever could they just blow off the idea that social norms are important I'm

0:35:38 Eli: Don't know those people tom you should call the

0:35:38 Thomas: I'm not who is who is that yeah

0:35:40 Eli: Cops yeah

0:35:41 Tom: Being ridiculous Look, you do, because he just did a tick tock the eternity lady.

0:35:43 Eli: I was I was kidding sorry

0:35:44 Tom: Right. Like those people that reject the idea that social norms are important are wrong. Right? They're just wrong. We live in a society. We should not be dismissive of things. And I know you're not intending to, but I just want to make the point. We should not be dismissive of things being important because they're socially important right those things are going to be necessary for the kids to like integrate into the world successfully and without ridicule oh

0:36:10 Thomas: But we should just be aware of the history of one at one time same -sex couples were looked at as that and what you know like I was just trying to like

0:36:18 Tom: I know I wasn't pointing out that you were yeah

0:36:19 Thomas: No I was trying to find where that like is and we need to be aware that like today's things that seem like well that you wouldn't do that in front of kit like who knows if that's tomorrow's thing where they're like I can't believe they didn't let people do this in front of kids so

0:36:33 Eli: That's my line I'll get canceled all the way to friday if max is like uh this is my wife you can see she's got her eternity collar I'm gonna be like first of all you were supposed to marry arlo second of all gross

0:36:43 Thomas: Arlo's wearing the eternity collar by the way

0:36:46 Eli: Exactly he got it he got it when he heard the episode so he thinks in advance but yeah no I I let me take that one step further and say something that and again this is sort of what the tiktok conversation was about that like exposing kids to sex stuff too early is sexual abuse right you don't have to put your hands on a child or make a child put put their hands on you to be sexually abusive and so uh think it's actually really important because and again I always refer people to thomas's serious inquiries only episode it's like one of the ways is that people who do abuse children open that door is by like talking about sex to kids or having those inappropriate conversations

0:37:22 Thomas: Changing in front of kids or do they push those little boundaries and see if they can get away with it yeah doing

0:37:30 Eli: Exactly and and turns out the the person in the tiktok actually talked about they ended up being a victim of abuse because that that sort of environment was going on and the mom was busy doing their own thing but But like, I think if you don't draw hard lines around what your kids are exposed to and the sort of the importance of the innocence of childhood, because this is something that I know we've talked about backstage quite a bit, is like, there especially in the social media age, to like talk about everything with your kids. And you absolutely should not do that.

0:37:41 Thomas: A water fucking ceremony oh

0:38:04 Tom: No yeah yeah like the eternity collar you something like that. And there are other kink -related examples of that. That a show for the consumption of people who are not that pair, right? Eternity collar is being worn 24 hours a day, seven days a week. That's is a visible show for me to consume.

0:38:22 Thomas: Man yeah there's another ceremony they do that's like a freaky one where they get up and they're in front of like don't know some religious guy and they are like put this eternity collar on your finger and forever, you wear that shit all day in front of everybody.

0:38:35 Tom: That's great example. Thomas, that's a great example, like in communication studies, these things are called artifacts, right, because they communicate things about us to other people and like an eternity collar is not a communication like we shouldn't lie about it it's not a medication from the dom to the sub or the sub to the dom only it is worn in a place where it's visible to everybody so everybody who sees it knows what it is understand so it is involving other people in that communication intentionally right and that's fucking gross like inviting other people into your sex life that may or may not want to be invited into your sex life is a fucking weird gross impulse right it's

0:39:17 Eli: At Quiznos. At Quiznos is weird, right? Because the thing about sex is like, but

0:39:22 Thomas: Take your wedding ring off before you go into a Quiznos, everybody.

0:39:25 Tom: But that's not your sex life you know that's like

0:39:27 Thomas: It's not your sex life? Ha ha ha.

0:39:32 Eli: If pegged, right, like I should take that off at Quiznos. And this is something that I think Tom's touching on that's really important is like the key to all of this sex stuff is consent, right. Right. So if you go to the pineapple hotel and you wear eternity collar and Tom's there because the rates are affordable, that's on Tom.

0:39:49 Thomas: Haa. Ha ha -ha -ha.

0:39:51 Eli: Right. I don't like doors when I poop.

0:39:50 Tom: That is on tom yes I

0:39:55 Eli: They just burst open anyways from the sheer force.

0:39:55 Thomas: Haaa. Ha haaaa.

0:39:58 Tom: Should have read the reviews

0:40:00 Eli: The yellow ball said five stars. I just look at the rating. That's not to me. But like that's the thing is like the minute I mean, Blaine Kapach has the great great joke about it, like about bringing someone to jimmy john's in a leash and it's like I feel like you're just ruining a perfectly good sandwich um like that's the thing is like I think and I think this is true of of pda as well and I I Think this is speaking to what which is like the people that you're involving with that display are not consenting right while we can understand that that is something that's okay to be done privately which which speaks again to thomas's point and right that may shift right kink relationships there are people and god oh tom maybe for a bonus episode I will just share with you like kink pride posts because there are people who are like kank pride and gay pride are the same thing and I I obviously do not feel that way but but like maybe may be a time where that is considered the same as being allowed to to kiss your boyfriend or your husband and like I said that will be the day I am very happily canceled

0:40:51 Tom: They're not It's not the same

0:41:05 Eli: For whatever whatever that's my uh my dawkins line that's when everyone will be like oh bosnick was so great but now he just tweets about how people shouldn't wear eternity collars and I hope one of you kills me that's all I can say all right gentlemen before we go I hate when when people say age is only a number because it's very obviously a word hey

0:41:39 Thomas: Really bad yeah

0:41:43 Clip: Want to meet sexy DILFs in your area? Email the dads at DearOldDads.com or, better yet, send us a message on Patreon. You can follow us on all social media by checking the links in the show notes. And if you need more podcasts in your life, you can find Tom on Cognitive Dissonance, Thomas on Serious Inquiries Only, and Eli on Godawful Movies and all the Puzzle in the Thunderstorm shows. Dear Old Dads is edited and produced by my favorite DILF, Tom Smith, who also wrote and recorded the intro music, which is used with his permission. This podcast is a production of Daddy Issues LLC. Copyright 2022. All rights reserved.

0:42:23 Eli: When there was gay oil and but what about the demon and the mountain no

0:42:27 Tom: Over the clothes not touching your genitals not touching like not like grabbing a boob like like know arms around snuggling like not fucking like like an hour -long make out like these

0:42:37 Thomas: Technical place where the sex happens versus now she's going to do my testicles. Oh, God. Is this a friendship or are you getting it on and

0:42:47 Eli: Pegged, right, I'm gonna lose the oil and I'm going to lose all over your face and chest. And bad at math not a pedophile what is the difference