Milo Yiannopoulos Lied About His Immigration Status (And We Can Prove It)

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:10 Thomas: Hello and welcome to Opening Arguments. This is Vapid Response Wednesday. It's number 43. I'm Thomas. That over there is real life immigration attorney Matt Cameron. How you doing, Matt?

0:00:20 Matt: Missing you already. That was a quick visit, but a lot of fun. Good to have you here.

0:00:23 Thomas: Good times. And of course, producer Lydia, how you doing?

0:00:24 Lydia: Super fun. Feeling pretty good. Wish we were doing this from a tiki bar. Not that we did that last time in Boston. Well, we got to go to a tiki bar. It was fun.

0:00:32 Thomas: That's random.

0:00:35 Lydia: I don't know.

0:00:35 Matt: It was great.

0:00:35 Thomas: Us in the whole audience or just us?

0:00:37 Lydia: Next time, the whole audience. Why not?

0:00:39 Matt: Live from a tiki bar, live from Wusong Road. Let's do it. Yeah, good

0:00:41 Lydia: Join me. It'll be fun. Yeah, yeah, but doing pretty well. How are you? You don't get asked enough on this show.

0:00:46 Thomas: You know, doing fine. I am excited. Thank you. Now I'm just going to cry and talk for an hour about my trauma. No, I'm

0:00:54 Lydia: We all need therapy. It's fine.

0:00:55 Thomas: Really excited to hear. I know Matt's expertise is pretty much always useful, but this week specifically, Matt has kind of blown the lid off something that I'm excited to talk about. About. We talked about a bit last Friday in person, which was fun.

0:01:11 Lydia: Pretty cool.

0:01:12 Matt: Times.

0:01:12 Thomas: But now we're doing it virtually and we're getting even more into the lying psychopath that is Milo Yiannopoulos, right?

0:01:21 Matt: Sure wish we could keep a lid on this one, but we got to talk about it. The lid has to come off. So, you know, I just want to say, of course, I don't want to have to talk about Milo, as we said last week, but this is a particularly interesting deportation story and And the media really has not put the pieces together. And I think it's not quite exactly what I thought. I finalized the final pieces, I think, but it is very close to what I thought. And I don't know if it's going to be a good thing. I think that nobody's actually done the whole thing. And so the fun part about this is we're going to watch the Piers Morgan interview, which is not usually a fun thing to do.

0:01:49 Matt: So first of all, I want to get your take on his general demeanor here, because it's kind of interesting. But he's also going to lie a lot about his own situation, and I'm going to show you why it's a lie and exactly what I think his immigration situation has been. It's pretty interesting, actually. Lot of uh teaching moments in this milo story so

0:02:07 Thomas: And if he's lying about all this, maybe he was lying for the entire time about everything he ever said all the time.

0:02:13 Lydia: Yeah, his entire career in existence.

0:02:14 Matt: I don't know that's that's a stretch I don't now well

0:02:15 Thomas: That a bunch of people in the circles that we went in, like, you know, Sam Harris circles and all that took on and maybe should have known better than to trust the most lyingest person ever to exist.

0:02:29 Matt: You know he's not only a liar but he's really bad at writing books and so for a fun bonus today after we take on I pull apart this interview and explain basically why he's lying and what's going on we're going to take a look not just at his book that was cancelled right around the time that he was we're gonna look at the editor's notes on the book which are are so good and I can't wait uh well this is from a lawsuit because he sued simon and schuster because they canceled the book after he was canceled and they're like no guess what the book sucks like it's actually bad so they the editor's notes are so great and it's a conservative editor too you can't even say it's some woke editor like

0:02:33 Thomas: Could have guessed. Yeah. How do we have that, Matt?

0:02:48 Lydia: Great.

0:02:56 Thomas: Oh, wow. And they got to prove that the book sucked. Oh, that's, yeah. Oh,

0:02:56 Lydia: Wow. Oh wow. Yeah

0:03:04 Matt: It's actually somebody who publishes steve bannon and stuff so uh

0:03:06 Thomas: What was the result of that lawsuit or are you saving it for later?

0:03:09 Matt: Well we'll save it but you know the book did come out just not through them but uh I just thought this was a fun pairing because I remember I looked at this yeah that's right uh just a fun pair because you know we're gonna do this interview we have to hear from the man and now we can actually make fun of his terrible writing and you know I want to emphasize like nothing he says really triggers me I don't care like he's obviously he's awful obviously that's his job to be awful that's

0:03:14 Thomas: Well, thank God for that because the world needs to read that.

0:03:29 Thomas: That sounds like something someone who is triggered would say, Matt. He got to you, which means something. Something. If he can, by the way, if he can trigger you, that means he's right or something or weird, weird how that works.

0:03:33 Lydia: 3D

0:03:35 Matt: Gotta start with that yeah I've I've never been

0:03:40 Lydia: Chess. Don't know.

0:03:47 Thomas: They never did that step. Like, wait, why is that good? If you can say things that offend people, does that, do I lose the argument or is it just that I'm offended by disgusting, disturbing things? Why is that a loss for me?

0:03:47 Matt: Less triggered yeah it

0:03:58 Lydia: Yeah.

0:03:59 Thomas: How does that score one for you and not from it? Anyway, there's a confusing time, the 2010s.

0:04:06 Matt: Was it was revisit some of that but uh it'S a nice break from all the other nonsense we'll get back to the other nonsense later but this is pretty classic vapid response territory so um

0:04:14 Thomas: Well and it's interesting immigration stuff that like you said people aren't getting and yeah so I'm excited so no it's an oops all douche are we an oops all amuse douche situation here oh

0:04:16 Matt: It's real law too yeah this is one of those things where I just can't it's not even palatable to even try to have a sample of a douche up front because we're just feasting on it so sorry

0:04:31 Lydia: I do not want to think about feasting on Milo Yiannopoulos at all. That is the most disgusting image. We

0:04:39 Thomas: Well I'm excited to get to it we got to do our thing we always do though which is to thank our patrons at patreon .com slash law and we're going to thank those hall of famers these are the amazing people who pledge at that five dollar level and above they get that shout out every single time we do this and also uh they get all the benefits that everybody gets on patreon we get the no ads we get the lot awful movies oh we watched uh coyote v acme and that's going to be our topic for this is kind of an emergency because uh that was an idea I had and it turns out some of the uh listeners suggested as well and it's uh so much fun so a lot awful movie and it is not really an awful movie be. It's a law of movies thing that we're going to do with that. I can't wait. So patreon .com slash law. All right. Thanking our first third. Thank you to help. I am trapped in a Patreon shout out. Bewitched, beclowned, bewildered. My house is a mess, but I read a lot of books. Griff the Tired 2L. Matthew Cutler, autistic streamer, twitch .tv slash mtc underscore streams. Memes. A propensity for jokers. Romaine, Rom, what? Romanis undomus. Hmm. I don't

0:05:02 Lydia: Did. Latin?

0:05:47 Thomas: Know what that is.

0:05:48 Lydia: Latin?

0:05:48 Thomas: Yeah. Is that from like Life of Brian or something? I don' t know. Gary the Seagull, waiting for your Monica's Italian sub. Unremarkable. Amina. Donna Treadway, mother of Herodins. Mike Lapinsky. Cayman Island blue iguana. That's a new one. What's that? That? Cayman Island blue iguana, huh?

0:05:56 Matt: So good but

0:06:05 Lydia: Cayman Island blue iguana.

0:06:07 Thomas: And is that a reference to anything or just, okay.

0:06:10 Lydia: Someone else's show.

0:06:10 Matt: It sounds nice yeah maybe

0:06:12 Thomas: Cyanitis, Dean Doblin.

0:06:14 Lydia: Dean Doblin.

0:06:14 Thomas: Yes. Someone did Dean Dobbin. Oh, so appreciate it. Good old Arlo, man. God, Dean Doblin. Great preponderance of the evidence. Last train to Skanksville. Classy, misty, meaner. Apprentice of adventure and Charlie Kelly attorney at Bird Law. Thanks thanks so much. We'll take a break and then we'll get into the oops, all douche that is Milo Yiannopoulos. All right matt uh this this guy doesn't look is this supposed to be milo what happened to him

0:06:42 Matt: I I do regret going to video um every so often uh he looks like he got punched well

0:06:47 Lydia: Some boy man oh

0:06:46 Thomas: I'm sure milo regrets whatever happened to them yeah

0:06:51 Matt: He does actually he's going to tell you quite a lot about how much he regrets getting deported by ICE and actually how brutal they were to him, which I do appreciate.

0:06:53 Thomas: Well also is this part of he has to pretend to be straight now because wasn't that he he had to shill for christians and pretend that he cured himself of homosexuality so yeah

0:07:04 Matt: That does come up in this interview. You'll hear him address that.

0:07:06 Lydia: My god yeah

0:07:06 Thomas: So because if you remember he used to have like okay hold on let me show just for the record what old Milo Yiannopoulos used to look like uh you know what when was he big 2016 or something

0:07:19 Lydia: 15

0:07:19 Matt: He was so much older then, he's younger than that now, as Bob Dylan's saying. He is... No, he was actually a kid. He was a child, and he's always a child. But he's giving a credible sort of appearance of trying to grow up a little bit. He claims he's now working for lawyers. And by lawyers, I guess he means Kanye, because he's been doing...

0:07:20 Lydia: 2015 what

0:07:37 Matt: He's been on tour with comedy working with him

0:07:36 Lydia: Yeah

0:07:37 Thomas: Well here's what he used to look Like by the way um and even though he's an evil psychopath in both pictures he's at least happier here I think he yeah

0:07:40 Matt: Uh one of his many looks yeah uh

0:07:48 Lydia: It's a better look for him He looks more himself.

0:07:49 Matt: Apparently

0:07:49 Thomas: He should live his authentic life and not just ruin other people's lives uh but

0:07:54 Lydia: Hockey

0:07:54 Matt: He did not have time to shave after the ice custody he just went straight to from scraggly facial hair uh so we should I

0:07:54 Thomas: This is hoof yeah yeah he looks like Evgeny Malkin for the two people who will know that who that is a hockey player but uh yeah go ahead Matt

0:08:06 Lydia: Player. I'm one of the two people.

0:08:09 Matt: I was gonna say I wish this was a man who needed some introduction I think for maybe some people he does piers morgan will set it up we might as well let piers morgan introduction introduce he's been out of the public eye for a while and I would like to keep him that way I don't want to talk about him that much I don' t want to give him any credit it. I don't think he's funny. I don't Think he's a particularly good troll. I think that he's really played out and he does too. I Think he knows it. And I've had some theories about maybe he might have allowed this to happen to himself. I'm still on the fence about that one. But yeah, because nothing else is going to do it. Because a lot of the right hates him now. And with at least the MAGA, right? And he doesn't really have a constituency otherwise. So and now, of course, he's talking to Piers Morgan, who's also one of the worst people, you know, on

0:08:13 Thomas: I think think he does oh yeah yeah

0:08:33 Lydia: To try and be relevant again. Yeah yeah.

0:08:47 Thomas: Oh

0:08:47 Matt: TV regularly. If you read about how Piers Morgan actually got his start, it is so disgusting, like the tabloid stuff he was doing not just tablet stuff but like ruining people's lives to the point of like he there's a reporter that he was working with uh who drove not only a man who wasn't all that important to uh take his life but then drove his daughter to do the same within a few years yeah um yeah probably

0:08:56 Thomas: What wow was he part of the phone hacking stuff at all I can't remember I mean it was a different thing those british tabloids whatever they did a lot of horrible stuff wow but

0:09:12 Matt: That's I think the mirror did that right yeah but anyway uh so yeah pierce morgan of course trying to do some journalism and he's the first interview that he gets you know I guess within a couple days of getting off the plane from being deported by ice so he's going going to start off by talking about well we'll get there to the interview but he's going to talk about his horrible experience and I gotta say this part of course is all true I have no doubt well not all of it you'll hear some of it is definitely not true there's some very funny parts that aren't true uh but the part about the brutality and how they treated him I absolutely believe that I mean that's that's what I hear all the time and it's good for I think for maga especially to hear it from a white british guy that ice really is like this um I mean this is somebody who joked about like is it appropriate to masturbate during an ice raid and this is someone who talked about how how we have to keep deporting millions and millions and millions of people knowing at the time now I realized that he was himself was subject to deportation, perhaps. So it makes it extra strange.

0:09:43 Lydia: That's their bread and butter.

0:10:00 Thomas: So funny because it's awful I get it how funny because because it's awful, because being awful is so funny, is the thing, yeah, what a great world and internet, yeah.

0:10:03 Matt: He's just awful. Yeah. It's good times. We all love it. Can't get enough. America couldn't get enough until they did get enough and just remind everybody, of course, they got enough in 2017 when he made really inappropriate statements.

0:10:17 Thomas: They didn't get enough, they were forced to cancel him by, you know, and not acknowledge it, because again, it doesn't count when they do it, it's not, it is only a cancellation if it comes from the cancellation region of the left, or whatever, but no, they would have eaten it up, continued to eat it right up for a while, I'm sure.

0:10:28 Lydia: Think

0:10:35 Clip: The harrowing trial of child killer Lindsay Clancy. We'll begin with the return to the UK of a highly controversial figure who has for years manipulated the media against his enemies while facing claims of attention -seeking narcissism. But no, I'm not talking about Prince Harry.

0:10:37 Thomas: Is this on? Is this just YouTube? Or is this like a network show? I think it's just YouTube. Because there's no ticker thing.

0:10:44 Matt: Think it's his own show. Here it comes.

0:10:44 Lydia: He's on network. Work.

0:10:49 Clip: Milo Yiannopoulos was deported from the US over the weekend after being detained at an airport in New Orleans by ICE. And Board of Chief Tom Homan said this. He overstayed his visa, I believe his visitor's visa, but I'm not sure, but he overstayed the visa, he was ordered to appear in immigration court, he didn't show up, the judge ordered him deported. So once ICE gets an order of deportation from the federal judge, their job is to execute that order and that's what they did. He had his due process ordered removed by the federal judges and ICE removed them. It's that simple. Well, it's that simple, says Tom Holman, but many believe there's much more to it. Homeland

0:11:26 Matt: I said this on Friday's show, but I want to Say it again, that it is incredible to me that Tom Homan, who's of course the immigration enforcement czar, he's one of those czar types who's supposed to be sort of coordinating a bunch of different immigration roles. He just, like they often do, he just goes on TV and he's like, I think It was his visitor's visa. I'm not sure. That's very very findable I can't look that up but he can like that's not it's incredible he's wrong that's not what he overstayed um I'm sure of it at this point

0:11:49 Lydia: And he knows he's going on to talk about this specifically, like just take the extra two seconds to not even look it up yourself, to ask someone who works for you to look it up and to tell you.

0:11:52 Matt: And like you have an olivia I know you do well no you there's no way you have olivia but you have you have a press person you have you have your researcher you've got somebody who's that's right you've Got somebody's supposed to be doing research for you you're supposed to hand you a one pager on like what you're talking about about that day. Anyway, that's not the point. Let's go on.

0:12:02 Thomas: What are you talking about? You have a goblin who works for you.

0:12:14 Clip: Security made an extraordinary point of publicising his arrest and releasing this pretty unflattering mugshot. The right -wing commentator Laura Loomer, a close confidant of the president and who Milo used to work with, is taking all the credit. She posted this. I was the first person to report on the fact that Milo was in the US illegally, where he incited violence against President Trump and worked for Marjorie Trater Green. Green. Recently, Candace Allen is invited with this illegal alien into her home. When Milo called for me to be assassinated, I reported them to ICE and the FBI. Milo is going to be deported back to the UK, where he can live among the Muslims he's recently chosen to embrace. Today is a great day for America.

0:12:52 Thomas: What? Okay.

0:12:55 Clip: Well, it is Milo's association with the controversial Conservatives who recently turned against the President, which many believe led to his removal from the US. As editor of Breitbart, he was an early supporter of trump's first presidency and a significant mega media personality more recently he's wrote the figures like kanye yay west and marjorie tally green while accusing trump of betraying his base over issues like the epstein scandal and israel some think he's a victim of selective politicized justice others are enjoying the irony of a deportation cheerleader himself being deported either way most people believe this might be the end of the milo show show, but does he? Well, Milo Yiannopoulos is yet to say anything publicly, but he's here in the Uncensored studio in London, where he's been forced to come back to.

0:13:34 Thomas: That already ended a long -ass time ago. Oh, wow. Jesus.

0:13:43 Clip: Milo, first of all, how are you? I don't think I've ever been afraid before, like I was the last week. Maybe I've lived an especially cosseted life, but I think for the first time, I know what it feels like to be really really terrified um terrified of well I'd like to get to some of the claims that were made by um homing in a moment but uh I didn't really I didn'T really understand

0:13:45 Thomas: Looks not good yeah this is just andrew scott playing milo oh

0:14:16 Clip: The physical reality of of how institutionalized the brutality is in america the manner in which they arrest you they put your manacles your hands your feet chained together I mean like everybody's arrested is like an ms -13 gang member and it hurts a lot more than it looks like on television provision. I was put from a detention

0:14:22 Thomas: You didn't oh what were you cheering for before yeah yeah all this information was available to you before yeah

0:14:38 Clip: Facility to a correction facility. Every three hours they were trying to keep ahead of my lawyers so I couldn't, whatever. But no one would tell me anything. I mean, I know it's designed to be like that, but it was, sure, it was humiliating and it was disorientating and the rest of it. It was physically degrading. It was it was frightening it was frightening I don't think I've ever been frightened like that before just how emotional have you been through this period I've never been like this before I I tripped and kind of tumbled down the stairs a night or two ago and you know I'm a clumsy person so that it's not the rarest thing in the world but it set something off from from when I've been kind of you know shoved down a couple of steps and I was weeping like an old woman for an hour and I said oh I really have to go to get this out of my my system. I think maybe in the past I've been a little bit blasé

0:14:50 Thomas: Man did you masturbate to it yeah

0:15:37 Clip: When people talked about their trauma, a little of

0:15:38 Matt: A little blasé.

0:15:37 Thomas: I think I think in the past I think in the path I'm trying to remember I think you know maybe this isn't fair to say to to my past self but I think a bit like a little what's the word like a little in still just a little insensitive a little bit in the past to to people who might be getting deported just you know like a little bit and I think it maybe maybe I shouldn't have done that is that what is he seriously doing this right now

0:15:43 Matt: Did I say some things? He's doing this. And I want to point out he was in custody for less than 48 hours. I believe he got the benefit of being very swiftly deported. Now, he already had an order, and we'll talk about how that order came about. But, you know, again, I think it's very good that someone like this got a taste of that, obviously. And if I believe him when he says it was brutal and he hated it and that everybody was bad to him, and I'm sure that's all true. That's the most believable thing in the interview. But at no point is he going to say, and I am so sorry for my part in this, for creating this monster, or like perpetuating this, right? He's not going to Say that, obviously.

0:16:08 Thomas: My god yeah yeah no of course yeah yeah

0:16:35 Matt: But you know, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely.

0:16:34 Thomas: The whole subtext of this is I didn't know they could do that to white people it's fine when they were doing it to anybody else but But but to me, no.

0:16:42 Matt: That is. Yeah. And a lot of the reactions online too, of like, they treat white people like this. I had no idea. Yeah? No, they?

0:16:48 Thomas: He he knew he knew this was how it was. He just didn't care or or is lying now or didn't think it could happen to him. One or the other.

0:16:58 Lydia: Well he also like framed it as like perhaps he's lived like a very closeted life. He like couldn't even say the word like privilege. Like Like, that's actually the word that you're searching for, Milo?

0:17:07 Thomas: I thought I thought he was going to say that.

0:17:07 Lydia: I really thought so, too. And then he said closeted, which is also just very funny because of his conversion, I guess.

0:17:15 Thomas: Man. We play more.

0:17:17 Matt: Yeah let's pick it up.

0:17:19 Clip: Cavalier when people talk about stuff kind of lingering with them, but I get it now. And I wouldn't wish it on anyone. The thing that astonishes

0:17:28 Lydia: And now I'm going to be an advocate for everybody that goes through this.

0:17:29 Clip: Me, I have to say, is to see the

0:17:32 Lydia: Yeah, I wish.

0:17:32 Clip: Various bits of the American government, all the machinery of the government, kind of lining up to lie in the manner that Tom Holman just did. I mean, I want to be completely clear with you and with your viewers, like, I manage... I don't really do, you know, the right -wing provocateur thing anymore. I manage lawyers for a living. You know, I'm a pretty organised and together person when I'm not being silly on Twitter. And I'm married to an American. There's no reason I would take a risk like this. I didn't need to have a stay visa.

0:17:58 Clip: There were dozens of companies who could have sponsored me.

0:17:58 Thomas: Why is he doing Trump stuff like he's

0:18:00 Clip: And I married to a American. I didnít. Well, OK, so let's just get to some cold, hard facts about this, which obviously other people will be able to verify at some stage. So you're a UK citizen, right? I am. So you were in America under what kind of visa? Well, I entered legally under an O -1 visa, which is the... Yeah, I know, I've had one.

0:18:02 Thomas: Talking like you're doing? Doing all the Trump. One, it's very funny.

0:18:21 Clip: Yeah, sure, you have one too.

0:18:20 Thomas: He's doing a Trump impression. Am I crazy?

0:18:22 Clip: And in the course of...

0:18:23 Thomas: Well, I entered.

0:18:24 Clip: Which actually they call you an exceptional alien, is the way they describe that. Alien of extraordinary ability.

0:18:26 Matt: So let's stop for just a moment. He and Piers Morgan have both held called O1 Alien of Extraordinary Ability Visas. I just want to point that out.

0:18:36 Thomas: Jesus.

0:18:37 Matt: And we fight to get like Juilliard grads who are incredible musicians.

0:18:39 Thomas: Fucking meaningless. I guess words don't mean anything, Matt.

0:18:44 Matt: They are aliens, but everything else, yeah. So Piers Morgan, of course, very familiar with the O1 because he's had one. And now there's going to be some playing with the timeline here. So just keep in mind that ICE is alleging that he last entered the United States May, I believe, 14th, 2019. And piecing this together, and I'll show you some of the evidence here, it looks like he did actually enter most recently on his O -1, which is very interesting to me because his O1, that's the extraordinary ability visa. So now the O - 1 is an interesting thing because it is supposed to encourage talented people to come here and stay here. And some of these visas depend on your employment. So like if you'd had, as a journalist, if you've been hired on H -1 or something else by Breitbart, and just depending on Breitbard, then as soon as they fired him, which they did at the beginning of 2017, then he would have been out of the country. He would have had a 30 -day grace period to leave. But the O -1 is interesting because you can do it through your agent, basically. Your agent can be the person who's sponsoring you, and then you can get gigs in the United States. So basically, he turned into a gig economy guy, I guess, after this. And so I just want to kind of take you through the timeline because he's about to lie about a to make keep it all straight here um

0:19:08 Thomas: Sorry. What does that mean again? Oh, that's the, that is that one. Okay. Yeah.

0:19:10 Lydia: That's extraordinary. Mm -hmm. Mm -huh. Yeah.

0:19:51 Matt: Of course we remember that he got canceled in 2017 because he made a bunch of statements about basically pro -pedophilia and maybe it's not so bad if little boys have sex with older men um and so what he did after that to save himself was he registered this company and milo inc and I have the registration that I found in the florida secretary of state the details and the funders of this company are all secret apparently there's like 12 million dollars invested in it the idea was to be like a live touring entertainment company that was going to go around and provoke people and do troll stuff I guess I don't really know but I just want to point out the date on this registration because you know it basically coincides with around the time that he was publicly canceled, as we say. So Milo Yiannopoulos registers Milo Inc. on April 17th, 2017. And that's significant because, yeah, known by shorthand as Milo, and one thing that is very funny is that now on the Breitbart website, whenever they refer to him, they call him Milo inc. because they don't even want to use his full name because they hate him so much it's

0:20:37 Thomas: Milo Entertainment Inc.

0:20:50 Matt: Great even in the headlines it's like milo inc announces or milo whatever um I think they don't want you to be able to find him I guess maybe on their site or whatever but um yeah he resigned from breitbart february 21st 2017 he opens this company after getting some backers so there is actually a kind of a timing issue there I guess he got the o1 anyway but it does seem like this kind of like maybe you have 60 days but um he managed even then though if he resigned of the date I have is februar 21 that he resigned from Breitbart. So that's more than two months. Anyway, regardless, during and this time, he is negotiating and Simon & Schuster shuts down his book. He ends up, there's a, Hate Not Hope has an incredible piece, which we'll link to, which gets into the amount of debt he's in, which is just incredible, unbelievable amounts of debt because he spent so much money. But my point is, this is the basis, almost certainly, and again, this is what I've been able to piece together. This company is the base for his visa. Now, you can't self -sponsor uh an o1 visa but you could set up a company that has a board that appoints you that you know basically they can sponsor you as long as you're not you can't start your own company and then sponsor yourself but you can do this and if you have enough money you can pretty much do anything so

0:20:53 Thomas: That's so funny. Hmm. Interesting.

0:21:51 Matt: It is his own company he's the founder but he's going to have I'm sure a bunch of people running it that he so he doesn't have like the full ownership I'm Sure that's what he probably had to do that's the only way I can explain how he still had an o -1 visa in 2019 because I don't I couldn't find any kind of employment history he's basically working for himself this entire time, they're not saying he was undocumented before 2019. So what he did at some point as he leaves the country in 2019, he travels on his O -1, which is fine, and he comes back in, and then after that point he overstays because presumably the O - 1 is for three years, and I'm guessing that it just ran out and he didn't continue to use it, but I think what he did instead is he switched over to a marriage visa. Now we know for sure that he got married in 2017, I think at the end of 2017. So he marries a US citizen, and as we've discussed this relationship there's allegations which are very credible especially based on the text that I've seen that this was an abusive relationship in many different ways

0:21:51 Thomas: This isn't his own company. Milo being the abuser.

0:22:47 Matt: Yes yes very important so interesting to me that he marries a U .S. citizen and does not immediately seek residency through that and the timeline does not show that he tried to do that like he was relying on his O -1 visa a non -immigrant visa possibly in hopes that the company could sponsor him for a full permanent visa. You know, again, the marriage was up and down. There were a lot of problems. It may or may not have been. I mean, he said in a text later to the man that it was a green card marriage only. They could have been out of spite. But certainly, yeah, yeah, it's, yeah. So there's some context there for the timeline that we're talking about. And now when he's talking about re -entering, he doesn't specifically say that he entered the E -1 visa. Now he's also going to say something that I think is just not true coming up about how he's also come and gone from the country. I think either he's misremembering or he's just lying, because I think this is probably true, what they're saying about the last entry from everything I've been able to piece together. Because if he had re -entered on what's called advanced parole while he has a pending marriage case, that would have been a different category in the way that he was charged. I don't think he would have Been charged in the notice to appear that we're going to see. My working theory right now. And so we can hear a little bit more, and we'll get some more context.

0:23:10 Thomas: It's a bad document. Right. Well, first we're going to take a quick break. We got to take our second break before we get to more Milo lying while looking like Evgeny Malkin. Okay. So let's thank our second batch of Hall of Famers. Thank you too. Probably a real person. Nick Fish. Who's a bigger idiot, Matt Walsh or Tim Pool? I'd say Tim Pool easily. Tim Pool is just an idiot. Matt Walsh is an awful troll, but I think he has a little bit more of a brain, right? I mean, give him some credit yeah

0:24:19 Lydia: He's a little more evil, too, yeah.

0:24:20 Thomas: Yeah a negative phenomenon sir render you gotta fight for your right to ex parte jay sank vml's truncated patreon name now extended thanks to that's kind of funny just cuts off omg you're too generous oh

0:24:38 Lydia: That's what that's what it was by the way it was happening in the patreon comments because because that patron said what do you want it to be changed to like what do you want me to extend it for and then vehicular man's laughter said oh my god you're too generous and then they said weird request but okay yeah fun community

0:24:43 Thomas: Gotcha

0:24:51 Matt: We Yes. I

0:24:53 Thomas: Good stuff I love it well Well done. More patrons should band together. Unionize, you know, to accomplish that. Theodore Bipirinium. Today's episode is brought to you by the letter something. David Souther, Thomas Freeman, Cajun Killa, Cavalry, FraudfishyHatesEverything, Chris Simpson, WorstTimelineEver, AnonymousAquila, and check out GalenaComic .com for a cool web comic. All right. Thank you, top patrons at Patreon .com slash law. We'll take a quick break and then we'll get to more lying. Not us, Milo. Should I hit play on more lying doing a weird trump impersonation

0:25:32 Matt: If it means not looking at this screenshot, then please, by all means.

0:25:35 Thomas: Well it's not much better than that like

0:25:37 Clip: It always makes me laugh. So you were there so when was that which actually they call you an exceptional alien is the way they describe that alien of extraordinary ability right so it always makes me laugh so you there so when was legal too in other words when did it expire um so I've had a couple of them uh and the last one I think would have expired in 2019 but long before that happened in 2017 I got married to an american so I filed for an adjustment of status um uh basically to to switch tracks from a visa to a green card and that's what I did went to the interviews and that was what I had but and you got a green car yes but when

0:25:41 Thomas: What was that

0:25:49 Matt: Me too. Yes. No,

0:26:16 Clip: So if you have a green card on what basis have they thrown you out of the country they sent notices to an address they knew I didn't live at anymore two addresses ago in Florida almost 10 years ago in order to get an in absentia hearing which is uh basically they show up with a judge they tell the judge you didn't show up, you didn't respond to the notices, and they asked the judge to give them an order. That's what happened. They had previously cancelled my work permit without telling me, they excluded my lawyer, and the ICE agents who arrested me in Louisiana told me this. I don't know if they were supposed to, but they told me that my lawyer had been deliberately excluded, and I said, well, how do you even know that I have one? He said, because I've got his name and phone number right here, but he didn't send him the notices. And they didn't send you the notices they sent to an address you don't live at. When you get served with this stuff from immigration, it doesn't come via FedEx or a process server in your hand or anything like that. They just mail it. And if they mail it to an address you don't live at, they can have a whole... That may not have been deliberate. That could just be an admin error. But I'd had notices from the... Not just from some vague immigration-related bit of the government, but from the precise agency department that sent these notices, that had notices at two new addresses of course I had because I've been giving them my is your green card still valid no uh because they

0:27:41 Clip: Cancelled it without telling me uh

0:27:42 Matt: Just take a moment.

0:27:44 Thomas: A lot going on here this

0:27:44 Matt: There's a lot going on here. So first of all, I really seriously do not believe he ever held permanent residency. And I can pretty much prove that. So we can go to the Deportation Data Project, which is an amazing website. And I want to show everybody how to use it because I've just learned how to do it. It a little bit, from some exceptional reporting from Jonathan Gerdson that we'll link to. He really did the, I didn't have time to do this kind of thing, he really went deep on trying to figure out some of the history here, but he didn't Have the immigration knowledge. And we were talking about trying to figure out how to interpret some of this. So if you pull up the deportation data project, I want to show everybody how to use this site. Yep. So what you can do is if it's up in the top there.

0:28:18 Thomas: Thing first off what is this deportation data .org like who is it

0:28:24 Matt: So yeah, this is incredible. It's using FOIA, it's using public information, I actually don't know I should know actually who's sponsoring

0:28:31 Thomas: But it's not a government thing it's like they're taking it okay you

0:28:34 Matt: Using government data yep and so up in the top there in the in the title bar you can change it to immigration court data um I just want to step everybody through this

0:28:43 Thomas: Want me to do that what cases

0:28:44 Matt: So there's an option for immigration court yeah

0:28:46 Thomas: That's what I'm already on I think right

0:28:47 Lydia: Cases. Yep. Yep.

0:28:48 Matt: Great okay just want make sure you're on that and then you can start to filter so now you can filter it down to milo basically because it's got millions of entries you can't use his name you can use his alien number because that all that stuff is private but you if you know enough about him his birthday is very findable we know uh basics about you know we know then we know the allegation about what date he came in uh so if you start by uh put in nationality so on that see the filters there on the left yep so you can select uh yep yeah you can do you can use sex and nationality so you can do UK obviously

0:28:50 Thomas: That's revealing feeling to milo wow yeah uh okay uh column oh nationality sure nationality is is it under united kingdom yeah okay okay missing

0:29:24 Lydia: Is fun.

0:29:21 Matt: And so there's all the british people who are in court yep and And then we can add, yeah, but he's going to be there. And then, we can Add Filter, and then, we can Ad Sex Male, or allegedly, Sex Zero, according to him these days. That's what he's telling people.

0:29:25 Thomas: Value detective oh so some of them are missing as I was warning me okay yeah okay sex male yeah birth

0:29:42 Matt: Right, and the next one is, and then we an add the birth year is 1984, yep, getting closer. We're narrowing it down. Now, the thing that can really do this is if you do, yeah, so you should, yep. There's one more piece of data that should be able to narrow this down the year they should have an entry date yeah if you make it 2019 so we're gonna end up with a very narrow field of people all now you can go to explore because we've narrowed it down to not very many data points so so that'll give us the actual spreadsheet data now we just need to find the one it's

0:29:44 Thomas: Year no okay this is crazy language

0:29:54 Lydia: 37 rows.

0:30:00 Thomas: No No, entry, entry date, yeah, entry date, entry - dash, nope, I see. This is crazy.

0:30:01 Lydia: Entry date?

0:30:17 Matt: Very cool and it's a little blurry for me but uh oh

0:30:20 Thomas: Yeah, I'm trying to... I can try to zoom Entry date.

0:30:22 Matt: Start my entry date yeah so we're looking for the 2019 entry date that was what we were so wego 514 that's him so we we found Milo. Now we don't, again, that identification number is an internal one. It's not his alien number, which would have allowed us to do this much more easily, but that's not public information. So now we can learn a lot about him from this field. And there's some very interesting stuff. And so this is very interesting. He's going to talk a lot more about his lawyer and his lawyers. And I want to point out that there have been no statements from any lawyers. Nobody's publicly talked about his case as his lawyer and really interesting thing about this is the notice to appear which is the charging document that puts you into immigration court issued in 2025 and there's going to be a date for that on this field and you had no applications filed removal and there was an in absentia as he mentioned he didn't go NTA date so there's the notice to a peer

0:30:26 Thomas: Yeah, it's this one. Okay, all right. Right false interesting did mm

0:31:08 Matt: Date you can see 2025 so August 6 2025 the NTA issues now that's very interesting for reasons we're going to talk about. But here's the really important part. The charge is under INA 237A1B. And if it were going to be a termination of conditional permanent residence, which is what, as you know, you receive if you've only been married for a little while, know you get the two -year green card and you get the chance to come back. And he's going to talk about the two year green card. He's going going to get it completely wrong, so I'll just tell you right now. You get a two - year card and then you come back and remove conditions and get a ten -year card if you're still married or you get divorced for reasons they can accept. So if if he was in termination proceedings, if they wanted to terminate a green card that he already held, he would not be charged under 237A1B, he'd be charged in a 237 A1D. And these are things that I know from heart because this is basic NTA stuff. So 237, 237 -A1 -B is a big catch -all basically for overstaying a visa. And so they have actually charged him. This is where I realized that it probably isn't actually marriage fraud per se. They haven't actually charged them that way, but that either, there's some interesting stuff going on here all around, but I just want to show show you the hard data here. Now, John was also able, and we're not going to go through, there's a whole bunch of other analysis you have to do to get this far, but he was able to find that the original hearing date was supposed to be scheduled in several years, in 2028. And here's the really interesting thing. Somebody, probably Milo himself, because he doesn't have a lawyer, somebody filed a motion to move the date up. And it would really have to be Milo, because they wouldn't have just accepted from a random person. The data up, the date of his removal hearing. Now he has, at this point, as far as we know, his marriage is, he's in divorce proceedings. Like he's at this point his divorce is not final yet, but he is as of 2025 in divorce proceeding. So he can no longer rely on a marriage to get residency. He has no defense to deportation at this point. He's just, the judge is going to be reviewing this. My guess is he wanted to move it up because he wanted just take voluntary departure and get out or at least end this.

0:32:55 Thomas: Like we kind of talked about on friday moved it up himself possibly

0:32:58 Matt: Right. And so it was moved up and then it was moved up again unexpectedly, but but he is the one who asked to move it up. And it was moved up to November of this year. And then it was moving up to July 22nd. And the really interesting thing about this is he may have actually been a victim of what we call the mega masters. So that's the phrase we've been using. The master calendar hearing is just the status docket. It's just like the regular show up and talk about your case, see where it's going, schedule a final date, make sure everything's in order. And they've been doing this very sneaky thing that's not that different from what he's talking about, where they basically schedule and they say, well, you know, you thought you had a court in 2028, you know, jokes on you. Turns out you actually have court next week, show up next Tuesday. And if you haven't kept your address up or you're not checking online, or if you don't have a lawyer, now again, if he had a lawyer none of this notice stuff would matter because the lawyers get notice and we have an electronic system, we have a portal, we can see all our cases and if your lawyer missed it then your lawyer is just committing malpractice at that point. So he did not have a lawyer and we know that from this data that we just looked at. It said lawyer false, nobody's entered in the case.

0:33:57 Thomas: So his whole bullshit about like they uh my lawyer and then they didn't contact it like that's all just gotta be lies yeah

0:34:03 Matt: And what he's talking about when he said that we can see your lawyer's information. It's probably because ICE had his lawyer's information. That's different from the court having it. So what you're looking at right there is court records, immigration court records which is again an administrative department of the Department of Justice. And there's still some unknowns here but I'm pretty confident about most of this based on what he's saying. But he's kind of like if you go back and hear the way he's talking about it when Piers Morgan asks him so you had a green card and he's like yes yes right yes I did.

0:34:28 Thomas: The way that seemed like an obvious lie I was like

0:34:31 Matt: He's just kind of skipping through.

0:34:32 Thomas: What does

0:34:32 Lydia: Before we we actually go there I and I don't know if I'm am I looking at this correctly matt I don' know if you clued on on this but there is a custody column in here and it says never detained for his

0:34:43 Thomas: That mean well

0:34:43 Matt: Right so that's probably outdated I'm guessing it hasn't because they released these monthly so I'm guessing that was current as of august probably

0:34:48 Thomas: But didn't it have another date that was oh current as of sorry what august oh

0:34:52 Matt: Probably but I'm I'm guessin because he was actually detained right at the very end of augus so they probably released him if he does that's my best guess or that might even be the july data I don't know but it is what whatever is most recent um but

0:34:58 Lydia: Gotcha okay so so there's no indication that he's been lying about that piece of it like that he actually he was detained

0:35:05 Matt: He was definitely detained yeah oh yeah well and also by detained I think he was never on the detained docket which would be different now he already had a removal order and remember this is very important because the case was moved up to july 22nd he didn't show up up. Now, I can't believe that somebody who, you know, again, he's reasonably well educated. He's not he's an idiot, but he's not stupid, stupid. Like he can he can look at his own case if he wants to. All the stuff about the mail doesn't matter, because if you want to, there's a website you can check your own immigration court case anytime. If I had filed a motion to move my case up, I would want to check and see if it had been moved up.

0:35:37 Matt: But at the same time, if I had a lawyer, then my lawyer would be notified that, oh, it turns out it's actually going to move up to July and not just November. And maybe you wouldn't check it again. Maybe it's possible you missed it. I don't know. This place in Doral that he owned, I guess, was huge. I hope not hate us a lot about it. And it's, I think this is one of his previous addresses maybe, but it's also his responsibility. Now the reason, okay, to be clear, the reason they would have that address is either because it was attached to the O -1 originally when he filed, which would make sense because that was when he had all the money that when he was sponsoring himself, the O1, or it could have been on a green card application. Now, again, I believe him and I going through, unfortunately, I had to look at a lot of TMZ for this, which has been covering this quite a lot.

0:36:15 Matt: TMZ got a hold of a lot of his divorce proceedings and information from that. He's saying that his husband said that he's not going to go the interview, that he is going to withhold, that he needs more money or whatever. And so it sounds like the interview either kept getting pushed out or that he withdrew the petition at some point. But I don't believe that he ever was granted residency based on that marriage. And then by 2021, basically, he's saying, we're just housemates. And he's publicly saying that he's no longer gay. And this is because I treat this guy like my brother, which would be the end of a marriage case, obviously.

0:36:14 Thomas: Sorry

0:36:44 Matt: If there's public statements saying that we're not actually in a relationship anymore, then that's not much of a wedding. That's not a marriage case. So he tanked it for himself anyway, even if that's the case. And his spouse had made comments, or he had made comment to the effect of his spouse was going to call ICE on him at some point. So maybe that is what actually happened. I don't think that Laura Loomer did it. I just don't. I don' t think she was responsible for it. I think she just wants to take credit for it because it's funny. But let's listen a little more because the way he keeps going here is pretty funny.

0:36:43 Thomas: Boy

0:36:43 Lydia: Man

0:37:10 Clip: I've been leaving them is your green car still valid? No because they canceled it without tell me when uh that I don't know but but what period of time could it have been cancelled well it must have been cancelled sometime in the last year I mean you presumably have you traveled to and from America I happen not to have done it in the last year but that's when was the last time you entered America probably two years ago two years ago I think and you came from where I wasn't here I think probably Europe maybe say Hungary or I don't recall but you entered not using the O1 visa but using the green card right but is that right yes that's correct and you were allowed in yes I I had my little green card.

0:37:42 Thomas: It's so hard to remember yeah yeah he's like a comedian playing someone who's lying like that's how oh where

0:37:44 Lydia: That's a lying face yeah

0:37:55 Clip: They took all of those things from me when they arrested me. How long is a green card valid for? Well, you can either get it for two or ten years. What did you have it for? So I had two years, and I was renewing on a two -year basis. And was it, had

0:37:53 Lydia: Yeah

0:38:08 Thomas: Was it yeah

0:38:07 Matt: This is it. Let's stop for a second. This is actually, I think he's actually either willfully or just intentionally confusing his work permit for his green card. Those are very different things. You do get a two -year work permit while you're waiting, and you do get to renew the two - year work permit. And I'm guessing what happened, and this happens sometimes, his marriage case just became torturously long. The Miami field office, I'm sure, is very busy. They have a lot of immigrants in Miami, and I'm Sure, they're pretty backed up. And I'm sure that his husband may be withdrawing or canceling or rescheduling. You know, it sounds like there was some back and forth about this. But he had a work permit that was good for every two years. But you don't just renew your green card every two year. As he said, you get the two-year conditional, and then you remove the conditions, and you get a 10-year card. If you've been married for more than two years by the time they issue it, as he would have been, then you would just get a straight tenure um so

0:38:16 Lydia: Which

0:38:50 Matt: None of this makes any sense

0:38:51 Lydia: We talked about on that lamb for our way when we did green card but

0:38:53 Matt: When when uh right when you guys uh and and also when we had your interview uh it was a lot of fun with your green card interview

0:38:59 Thomas: That's fun so so he's just talking about his work permit thing yeah

0:39:03 Matt: I'm sure of it and he didn't re -intern it yeah if

0:39:05 Lydia: But but then but also like him okay in in the real world like like not a milo world like what would that actually look like you're married to somebody and not necessarily that like I don't know like does the green card remain valid even if you are divorced you get to kind of stay on the green card

0:39:26 Thomas: Matt said if you divorce for reasons that the government accepts or whatever or

0:39:30 Matt: It's if it so legitimate you know you gave it a try and it didn't work out versus like you walked out the day you got your green card never saw the person again as depicted in the movie green card uh but you know the

0:39:41 Lydia: And you get to continue to renew it even though you no longer are married

0:39:44 Matt: Right you can but and here's the thing though because he never actually had it it was pending the whole time when he's saying oh they canceled it never told me what he means is he didn't realize his work permit was canceled maybe that's what he mean I don't know he was relying obviously on his

0:39:55 Thomas: He knows he never had a green card and that's his excuse maybe for not having it really

0:39:58 Matt: But they don't just cancel it out of nowhere and not tell you they give you a chance they give you a notice of intent to deny they're gonna they say we think we're gonna deny this explain yourself you have a chance to respond you can litigate this you have back and forth you would have known this unless you've just completely checked out of your own immigration case which is certainly possible. And I'm sure he did have a lawyer for the USCIS portion of all of this, and maybe that was the last person that might have received notice, maybe not. Not necessarily. Our clients get these things without us being notified sometimes. It does happen when they refer things on. There's a very interesting long gap, though, between he gets married in 2017, his O -1 is essentially up in 2019 when he re -enters, and I think he just has a pending marriage case for a lot of this time. It's just getting yanked back and forth. And he's saying that he's been renewing his work permit all that time. And again, it is possible that you could have a marriage case that could take that long it absolutely could but I think that you know just all the drama with the spouse and the back and forth um but you know nothing that he's saying and the other thing is we just looked at and I wanted to pull that up and put it on so people understand that I'm not just pulling this out like this is real data about the charge that's on the

0:40:59 Matt: Notice to appear under 237 a1b and that tells me that they are not terminating if they were going to be terminating your green card they would have to put to the 237a1d even if they put it as a second or third charge but there was was only one charge on there, and that was the A1B. So that just tells me that it's an overstay, and they're treating him as an overstay. We don't know exactly for sure because I haven't seen the actual papers, and I want to be careful as a lawyer not to say anything until I've seen the papers, but I have enough evidence here all in one place. And so it could also be that they tried to proceed and they were forced to withdraw for one reason or another, but they just never went forward with the application. But you do get a work permit while your green card is pending, and that's what he's talking about. But he's interchangeably, I think, using green card and work permit here. And I think Piers Morgan even kind of knows it, and he's pushing it a little bit. But I mean, he definitely knows something about the immigration system.

0:41:48 Clip: That elapsed? No, no, I had not. No, I did not. So your contention, just to be clear, my lad, is that your green card was still valid at the point that you were deported? Well, no. Because I think they cancelled it without telling me. In what period of time? That I don't know yet. I've asked for my complete file. I've ask for my complete records. I don' t know if I'll even get them.

0:42:08 Clip: But everything about what happened was very, very off. And, you know, in my life I've been called a right -wing conspiracy theorist and the rest of it. So I'm not going to... I'm going to try to keep this as sane and sober as I can. Well, the point is that I'm watching this interview so anything you say which they can contradict with evidence, they're likely to do. Why would I lie?

0:42:08 Matt: Please share it. I'd love to see it. It

0:42:30 Clip: It's going to make it even more difficult for me to get back to see my family back to see my my pets my so what family do you have back in america at the moment your wife well I'm married to an american I've got uh dependents I've um cats I've you know employees I have a whole life there I've been here for 10 years um you know everything is there you're married to an american woman no man um um I don't know pride I don I know you I mean you're a gay man and you're married to a gay man I yes I don't I don't do the sex stuff anymore but yes okay I'm only asking

0:42:29 Lydia: What

0:42:38 Thomas: What don't

0:42:40 Matt: Was a slip. He is getting three

0:43:03 Lydia: What

0:43:04 Clip: Because I just want to know what family you have left america yeah where is your where is your spouse living in the same in the house in the other at the other end of the of the corridor um in which state is this this is in California in Calif in LA yes right and so they had to wait until I left California um to kind of uh scoop me up and and everything about this is peculiar Because, you know, the guys who arrested me, they said, they didn't tell your lawyer about this. And they told me, the ICE agents that picked me up in Louisiana, they said three of the five mortgages they sent were returned to sender. Address the unknown. So the government knew I wasn't there. The government knew that I was a victim. The government didn't know I wasn'T getting these things. It

0:43:05 Thomas: Do the sex stuff anymore sure

0:43:44 Clip: Knew thatI had no idea what was happening. And they did this anyway. And then when they did it, the way they didit, you knoW, they um this was faster rougher and nastier than perhaps any deportation when was the first you heard that you were going to be deported when I got off the plane in Louisiana um when was that uh thursday night right for a work trip and you'd had no warning at all absolutely

0:43:44 Matt: Of the five, huh?

0:44:04 Lydia: A claim oh

0:44:13 Matt: One second. It's a

0:44:15 Clip: Nothing so you get off a plane from

0:44:17 Matt: Faster, more brutal and nastier. It'd be a good second book for him probably. So he is talking about in absentia, which is when you don't show up and you get an automatic order. He's saying the agents told him three out of the five notices, which, you know, it's not bad. The immigration judge is not going to sustain a deportation if he thinks that it's been, and this was a man in this case, I'm saying that, if he things, and I was told actually when I asked around about this, this judge in particular will not order an in absentian unless he is sure you got notice. And so if he sees a return to sender in the file, they're going to give you another date. They're goingto figure it out. And give you one more chance but at the same time this is a man who knows his own alien number who knows how to check it who has allegedly has access to lawyers um and you know it does matter where they send it the notice is very important by law but the mail isn't everything you can still find out your date it's not that hard but they don't just cancel your green card out of nowhere with no warning and just send a notice to appear and suddenly you're deported that's just not how any of this works and the reason it was such a swift deportation is because they didn't want to have him in custody for very long I think you know he's like reasonably you know I don't know maybe not famous but like he's somebody that people might recognize and

0:44:22 Lydia: Interesting yeah right

0:45:20 Matt: Like you just want to get it done and also because he's British it's pretty easy to get him on a plane uh to the UK it's not that hard to arrange yeah

0:45:26 Thomas: He's not he's now getting deported to a dangerous you know country or one on the list of countries you're not supposed to deport people to or whatever

0:45:30 Matt: It's Not Cuba right and we have a pretty good relationship still for some reason with the UK so it's Pretty easy to arrange this stuff uh he's going to say one more very funny thing yeah

0:45:40 Thomas: I just want to note for the record I think maybe I meant anjay kopitar you know I think that's a closer this is a closer like he looks like this guy I don't know what happened yeah it's like certain angles uh of it it'slike all of a sudden he looks Looks like Andrzej Kopitar.

0:45:49 Matt: Whoever that is that's I can see it he's

0:45:56 Lydia: He wishes he could grow facial hair like Andrzej Kopitar, but

0:45:59 Thomas: Yeah. Very weird.

0:45:59 Matt: He cannot it's he's proving that it's

0:46:01 Thomas: But, okay. Sorry. It was bothering me. I had to solve that. We can go back to Andrzejs. He had a great career. We can get back to his interview.

0:46:04 Matt: Okay there's yeah there's there's one

0:46:09 Thomas: Here.

0:46:09 Matt: More funny thing coming up that anybody who doesn't you don't need to know immigration law to know what he's going about to say is a lie it's very funny that

0:46:14 Clip: Louisiane to la I've never even been arrested before um I've I've never been in trouble with the police. I'm a, you know, I have a big mouth, and, you know, and I say a lot of things that, you know, that upset people, but I don't break the law. I'm not a violent person. I'm no thief. And I'm very careful about my paperwork precisely because, you now, I've got a gob on me and I don' t want to give people, you know, easy routes in, you kno. I don''t want to get people easy ways to get at me that aren't necessary.

0:46:18 Matt: Is true also correct here

0:46:43 Clip: The first I heard of it was when 15 agents swarmed me at Louisiana Airport and I didn't get any less theatrical from there on I was moved I was I didnít eat for 24 hours I was promised a nurse that never came I was promise a phone call that never cam I was promised all kinds of things that never come just about everything that you hear that people are supposed to have as far as rights and abilities when you get arrested I did not have nobody would tell me anything thing. And the really telling detail for me is that two of the ICE agents during this process recognized me from 2016 when I was a big supporter of the president.

0:47:21 Thomas: It's that I'm white. Okay.

0:47:29 Clip: And one of them said something along the lines of, yeah, I'm not doing this. And another one said something around the lines if this is not what I got into this for. And at least one of them, and I think two of them walked off the job because they didn't want to do it.

0:47:24 Matt: It comes that

0:47:45 Clip: And, and, and another one of the them, I think, two of then walked off job because because they didn't want to do it.

0:47:42 Matt: Might be true yeah that's the part I

0:47:42 Thomas: That definitely happened. Lost their job. Sorry. Walked off the job. Yeah.

0:47:50 Clip: And another pairing of vice agents who took me to the airport in Houston told me that they were getting calls from Washington

0:47:45 Lydia: Walked off. Okay, that's the line too far for those ICE agents, right?

0:47:53 Matt: Think that's fair I yeah

0:47:56 Thomas: I think what would be funny, though, is if that was actually true. You're like I didn't get into this to deport white people I did come on I only got into

0:47:59 Matt: And to report a white guy that I like yeah and honestly if his name were john smith like maybe you know whatever but like his name is Milo Yiannopoulos. Even if you don't recognize his face, which looks very different than it in 2016, as soon as you see that name, you're like, oh, I remember that guy, if you're a MAGA person, right? So I believe that it's possible that some guys recognized him, but then he goes on at length, he's all here to talk about how more people recognized him and how important it was that he was recognized, because that's the point of the story, really, right?

0:48:26 Thomas: Yeah I love when he's like and he said something like trying to think of something he said well

0:48:31 Lydia: Thank you for your service.

0:48:32 Thomas: Anyway it was sort of yeah it was like sort of like you're a hero sir I can't you know like such bullshit yeah

0:48:36 Lydia: Ridiculous

0:48:37 Matt: Yeah, bootlicking, just while you're in manacles, boot licking, yeah. A little harder when you're tied up, but yeah. And this is very funny, too. DHS had a pretty funny response to this. They said, that these are blatantly false claims, a sad attempt to demonize the same law enforcement officers that he publicly supported until the shoe was on the other foot.

0:48:56 Matt: Yeah, but of all the things that didn't happen, I don't know, two officers resigning mid -shift, I think that's just, but also I'm

0:48:54 Thomas: Fair yeah yeah they left walked off the job because that would be the line like they're fine with like just shooting people deporting people and leaving kids stranded places but but deporting a white man named Milo Yiannopoulos too far maybe

0:49:14 Matt: Willing to believe that they did say this isn't what we got in it for. I'm sure that's possible. They didn't quit though.

0:49:19 Thomas: Yeah no there's no way it's so funny and

0:49:20 Lydia: That's so bizarre though that's yeah

0:49:22 Matt: They also claimed that he was given the chance to call his spouse, which is kind of funny, the guy that might've reported him, but that's his his only friend

0:49:28 Thomas: He's like no thanks

0:49:29 Lydia: Well he still claims in his family too he's like that's my family you know my my husband

0:49:33 Matt: Yeah that's true yeah yeah um my housemate that lives down the hall yeah they're

0:49:37 Lydia: Divorce

0:49:37 Thomas: So so wait are they actually not divorced or what I can't

0:49:41 Matt: In divorce proceedings it's not final yet so they certainly can't rely on the marriage fees anymore um all right there's a few more things and we can move on maybe a little more

0:49:41 Lydia: Proceedings yeah Yeah. Yeah.

0:49:42 Thomas: Gotcha hmm sure what

0:49:49 Clip: Me they were getting calls every 20 minutes. Where is he? This was not a normal, lawful process. If I overstayed and if I had messed up there would have been a process I would have been arrested but what's being reported is that you overstayed a visa obviously if you're a green card holder married to an American citizen that gives you a completely different status to stay in the country married in September 2017 in Hawaii but the point is this even if their story was true there's an opportunity before they take you anywhere else for you to have a lawyer to file a motion to um ask for your for your case to be reopened to say sorry I didn't see the notices I didn'T know your honor I apologize can you at least hear me out and chances are in those circumstances if you've ever stayed you get deported anyway but none of those things right and you believe the motivation

0:50:07 Matt: This was it this was the process which

0:50:08 Thomas: Was a process

0:50:25 Matt: It is actually I'm

0:50:31 Thomas: Man what's the what's the laughter specifically

0:50:49 Matt: Doing this right I I didn't know I could I file a motion for I apologize I won't do it again that's new I didn's see the notices is. I mean, yes, you technically have the opportunity to file an emergency motion to reopen if you're taken into custody. And maybe I don't think anybody tried to do that, but like it could be done. But you don't actually have a right to it. When you have a removal order, he had a final order. They grab you, they throw you out of the country. That's how it works. He also, I want to point out, flew into the Louisiana airport, which I've been down there, Alexandria is a little closer, but it's as close as you can get it to a major airport to the largest ICE detention facility in the country, which makes it extra funny to me. He claims he's going to go see this Kanye show. He's been hanging with Kanye apparently, but I just

0:51:06 Thomas: Maybe

0:51:26 Lydia: He's like, like, legal, like he helps coordinate his legal counsel or something. I was saying. Yeah?

0:51:30 Matt: I don't understand what he's

0:51:31 Lydia: I don't know. He and Yeah, they're very close.

0:51:31 Matt: Doing but um but if you wanted to get deported this is the way to do it is to fly into new orleans where they're they're gonna have space for you they'll take care of you yeah a little more just

0:51:41 Thomas: His job is like he'll be the go-between between Kanye and anyone Jewish because Kanye is such an anti -semite he's like here no I'll I'll talk to them for you or something God Kanye is the worst

0:51:48 Matt: Won't talk to them yeah

0:51:53 Lydia: Man. Yes, he is. He really, really is.

0:51:56 Thomas: Should we go on here yeah

0:51:57 Clip: This is political and in fact we don't need to be you know Hercule Poirot to work out who may have been instigated because the instigator has proudly claimed credit. It's Laura Loomer, who's this pretty bonkers character in America on the pretty far right, who has an extraordinary influence over Donald Trump, and who posted this on X, breaking illegal alien Milo Yiannopoulos has been detained by ICE. I was the first person to report on the fact that Milo was in the US illegally, where he incited violence against President Trump and work for Marjorie Taylor Greene. Recently, Candace Owens invited this illegal alien into her home when Milo called for me to be assassinated. I reported him to ICE and the FBI. I told you all that Milo was an illegal alien. He was detained in Louisiana by ICE. Milo is going to be deported back to the UK, working among the Muslims.

0:51:57 Matt: Just another minute or so no

0:52:49 Clip: He's recently chosen to embrace the laser grade of America. So I read that earlier, and it's worth recounting her words because let's just go through her claims in this post. One is that you incited violence against President Trump and worked for Marjorie Taylor Greene. Now, what is she getting at? I don't see how they're connected. What is she Getting at by the incitement of violence against Trump? I don' t really know. I certainly don' T recall ever doing that. I don'' T think that I ever did that. That sounds like a crazy thing to do. Do you oppose to anything threatening or it could be taken threatening? No, I've certainly opposed to things that are insulting. Like what? You know, I'd probably call him a fat ginger idiot. I'd Probably call him, you know, a traitor. Not a traitor but I probably called him a uh you know uh somebody's betrayed his base I probably said that he's a coward um but none of that rises you know remotely to the level of uh of a threat of violence I

0:52:55 Matt: It's not never his

0:52:55 Lydia: Filler without

0:53:15 Matt: Eyes yeah that's uh that's more that's milo and uh pierce morgan uh

0:53:43 Thomas: Just for it's it is so hard for us to follow our immigration attorneys what's your final final theory of what went on like if you were to say at least as much as you can you know say and And I guess this.

0:53:57 Lydia: Seeing his file kind of thing yeah them

0:54:00 Matt: Based on everything we know and the fact that what has come out in divorce proceedings and the statements he has made about his husband and the statement his husband has made is about him. Best I can say is that they did at some point apply for residency based on the marriage and they either had to withdraw it or it was abandoned because they didn't go to the interview. That's what seems to have happened. They may have refiled at some time. At some point, he had a work permit based on pending application, it sounds like, for quite a while. But there is absolutely nothing in this record that would tell me that he ever had residency. And he's welcome to disprove that. He can certainly show a picture of his green card anytime he wants to. To. He knows also that USCIS and ICE can't actually release very much personal information. I will say the other reason that I'm sure about my theory is in response in that statement when ICE talked about how he was demonizing them, they said, they made a point of saying that just a pending application does not give you status. And a work permit is not a green card. They said all that in response to this interview. So that to me is pretty much like I think that they're telling us without

0:54:55 Matt: Telling us yeah yeah so I think that's pretty safe bet there um and he's just kind of and like the way as you said he was going along with the idea of green card and not like he's just kind you know I don't I don' t think he ever did

0:54:55 Lydia: Signaling yeah yeah yeah

0:55:07 Thomas: More than that, he said that they took it as a dog ate his green card. You know, that's why I can't. So and then the part like the part that's more like kind of a suspicion is that like he might have moved it up himself and tried to do all this for the purpose of attention or what? Or what, but

0:55:10 Matt: He may yeah there's

0:55:11 Lydia: Confiscated it right

0:55:27 Matt: A real outside possibility that he knew that date didn't go and then just took his chances or intentionally even maybe walked into the airport who knows I mean I'm just speculating this this guy being who he is being the provocateur being you know needing attention as badly as he does he does having been so long. I wouldn't put anything past him at all.

0:55:43 Thomas: The, so the requesting it sooner is so specific. Like that's the one thing that like, why would he do that? You know, like,

0:55:49 Matt: Well, you don't want to be in removal proceedings forever. And maybe you just want to get it over with and take voluntary departure and, you know, do something. I don't know what his other plan was, but he has, you know... He's getting divorced. So, yeah.

0:55:57 Thomas: So I'm saying, why would he do assuming were telling the truth here is what I'm saying. So like, if he's telling the truth and this was all, oh, they mailed it to the wrong place and they, all that crap, like that's not really consistent, right?

0:56:09 Matt: Well... And you... That's a great point. Because when you file that motion to move your court date up, you have the opportunity to change your address at that point. Like, you need to... You're required by law, actually, when you're in removal proceedings to update within five days. And they're really trying to enforce that now. So that's on him if he didn't at the time. And if he had anybody who resembled a lawyer advising him on that, they would have told him to make sure he kept his address. Not that it matters. He can still check the date. But I just don't believe anything he's really saying about the in absentia or really about his status at all, because it just doesn't add up. None of this makes sense.

0:56:39 Lydia: Interesting yeah

0:56:40 Thomas: Right. Well, let's take our last break. And then we've got a little, I guess the opposite of an amuse douche. It's like the the post what's the word for that I don't know what's this yeah

0:56:50 Matt: Digestive, I guess. I hope it'll go down.

0:56:51 Lydia: Mitchell

0:56:53 Thomas: But let's thank our last batch of hall of fame patrons thank you to bob blah blah's law podcast et philly basement bar says we should take off and nuke the site from orbit it's the only way to be sure elect thomas smith president american honky tonk bar association balticate phil kaiser the fear of palindromes is called uh ibophobia hmm uh corin lan a string of unpronounceable characters malika chandler david in brooklyn ronda the dork .com milo mead song argues the plural form of footnotes kind of like attorneys general should be notes feetsies uh chris wall trip big easy blasphemy hors d 'oeuvres in the court before report sam denow fred r grothius classic libtard and mitchell our champion for the time being thank you so much hall of famers you're you're the best. Let's take that last break. And then I think Matt's got something pretty fun for us. Right, Matt. What's exhibit B. Why are we looking at exhibit B?

0:57:47 Matt: This is so good exhibit b is Milo Yiannopoulos's entire manuscript for the book dangerous which was going to be published by Simon and Schuster in 2017 and

0:57:54 Thomas: Wasn't it dangerous F slur, but then they had to change it maybe.

0:57:56 Matt: I think it was just dangerous oh yeah probably yeah I

0:57:59 Thomas: Yeah. Well, his tour was the dangerous F SLUR tour or whatever.

0:57:59 Matt: Think this this that's right yeah there's lots of f slurs in this book uh so funny thing about this this lawsuit where he sues simon schuster saying you should have published my book even though I was canceled and they bring back exhibit b here's how much we hated your book

0:58:13 Thomas: Like here's the pile of shit that was your book. Oh God, so good.

0:58:16 Matt: So the editor here uh this guy is really great mitchell ivers I looked him up so he's runs basically the conservative imprint it's called threshold of simon and schuster and he has published pretty much everybody we hate if you put a dinner party together of all the people who's punished steve bennett uh public steve ben and ben shapiro and everybody else like just a long list of conservative people

0:58:36 Thomas: Specializes in piece of shit, asshole books.

0:58:38 Matt: Yeah and like so he he's ready for this kind of thing and he look at his email look what he says here

0:58:42 Thomas: Here

0:58:42 Lydia: And just here you go

0:58:42 Thomas: You go.

0:58:43 Matt: You go period duck

0:58:43 Thomas: And it's, the attachment is dangerous edited to Milo. So he's sending it back to Mila.

0:58:47 Matt: So this is his final set of edits now what I'd like to do for the purpose of this bit is thomas can read milo and lydia can read the editor I think this will be fun uh there's some good stuff in here table of contents

0:58:56 Thomas: First, first thing is we got to look at these chapters. Yeah. Table contents. Yeah, that's so stupid.

0:59:00 Matt: Table of content's so good also notice that the editor underlined added the preamble because he wanted to add something serious at the beginning that'll give the next page he's

0:59:08 Thomas: Preamble on freedom of speech and political correctness. Yeah and then prologue the art of the troll uh and that was that was my uh one why progressive left hates me chapter two why the alt -right hates me with a comma by the way there interesting uh editor didn't get to that one uh three why twitter hates me four why feminist hates me five why black lives matter god what a what a boring fucking person god here's how much of an asshole I am here's why uh uh everyone hates me yeah cool man that's so you're so edgy so eddy and

0:59:11 Matt: Making him do it Yeah.

0:59:30 Lydia: We get it. We get it, yeah,

0:59:32 Matt: And then seven. Oh, no.

0:59:43 Thomas: Then the editor made some changes here instead of why other gay people hate me it's why establishment gays hate me which it does flow better eight why establishment republicans hate me nine why muslims hate me he cut editor cut 10 why ugly people hateme uh why don't why gamers don't hate me. I love that.

0:59:44 Matt: Good call.

0:59:56 Lydia: An entire chapter. Oh, my

1:00:03 Matt: We know.

1:00:04 Thomas: And, uh, why am I college tour is so awesome in the epilogue, how to be a dangerous F slur, even if you're not gay. Uh, cool, cool. So what do we want to look at now?

1:00:13 Matt: So the preamble, he doesn't write the preample for him, but I just noticed it's blank. And the editor's note of the preample is kind of funny. He just, on the side there, just comment.

1:00:19 Thomas: Where is it? Oh, sorry. I'm trying to, ah,

1:00:21 Matt: Yeah, you don't have to read the whole thing, but you can see the first paragraph there.

1:00:18 Lydia: Add

1:00:22 Thomas: Here. Oh, Sorry. I was trying to zoom in so people could see. Okay. Uh go ahead, hon. You want to read that?

1:00:27 Lydia: A short and serious statement here that sets out why you do what you do without trolling, without bombast, without name -calling, and without ego. This will make for a stronger opening than playing to your core audience.

1:00:35 Matt: Good luck. So yeah, well, let's keep going.

1:00:39 Thomas: There's no way he's doing that. That. Narrator voice, he's not capable of doing that.

1:00:41 Matt: Yeah, there's some really funny stuff in here. He's trying to take him seriously, and he's trying but as as it goes on the editor continues you'll see he just falls apart the editor hates him so much by the end there is a comment that is just in caps delete, ugh there's a point at which just that there's a point which he deletes an entire chapter

1:00:58 Thomas: That's awesome. Imagine if the editor added a chapter that was like, why my editor hates me.

1:01:02 Matt: All right zoom in a little bit here the art of the troll um there's some really funny commentary yeah

1:01:09 Thomas: What do we want to do? Tell us what to, you want to read?

1:01:11 Matt: Just do the first just just to get a taste here we're not gonna do all of it yes

1:01:14 Lydia: Careful, careful that the egotistical.

1:01:16 Thomas: Or do you want me to read the book part and Lydia to read that part? Okay.

1:01:16 Matt: Read the book and then yeah yeah that's right

1:01:20 Thomas: Okay. OK, so prologue, the art of the troll, I'll assume as much as I can, but you have it up yourself, right? OK, the year 2016 was in more ways than was in More Ways Than One, no comma, the Year of the Troll. And as one of the world's most famous trolls, that means it was the year of me.

1:01:20 Matt: Yeah it's fun great

1:01:41 Thomas: We got a note on that.

1:01:40 Lydia: My God. And the editor editor chimes in. Careful that the egotistical boasting that your young audience finds humorous doesn't make you seem juvenile to other readers, especially here.

1:01:50 Matt: Opening sentence note it's really setting the tone here

1:01:52 Lydia: I already got a problem.

1:01:53 Thomas: What does it mean to be a troll? If you stray too far into whiny crybaby leftist circles, especially feminism circa 2013 -2014. And there's a comment on that.

1:02:03 Lydia: Avoid parenthetical insults. They just diminish your authority throughout the book. Your best points and he spelled it's the wrong your oh my god it's you apostrophe re your best points seem to be lost in a sea of self -aggrandizement and scattershot I say it wrong every time and scattershot thinking expand

1:02:11 Matt: Unfortunate that's

1:02:16 Thomas: Aggrandizement. Lost in a sea of self -aggrandizements. Oh, boy.

1:02:24 Matt: A good book title too uh

1:02:25 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah. All right. Should we skip a little bit?

1:02:28 Matt: I keep going a little bit more and all

1:02:29 Thomas: Trolling has many elements. It's often about telling truths that others don't want to hear.

1:02:34 Lydia: On the idea of trolling as truth -telling that's something your critics have never considered

1:02:38 Thomas: Okay. Yeah. Yeah, sure. Sure, we haven't. Page

1:02:41 Matt: Right let's skip down uh just for just for example on page uh page 11 of the pdf page 8 of the manuscript um I

1:02:49 Thomas: 11 of the PDF. Sure, sure, sure... This one?

1:02:51 Matt: Like this yeah the highlight it's funny nope

1:02:54 Thomas: Here's the sentence. Mischief -making musicians, actors, and writers love me, but only in private because they fear reprisals.

1:03:02 Lydia: And editor responds can you offer proof

1:03:06 Matt: Uh page 10. This is a really funny one. All these statements are facts.

1:03:07 Thomas: Nope, he can't. Which PDF page? Okay.

1:03:15 Lydia: 13

1:03:17 Thomas: All of these statements are facts. Facts wait which statement oh yeah 97 percent of workplace deaths are male rates of rape and domestic abuse are far higher are far höher in muslim communities than non -muslim ones the black community has a huge problem with crime and drugs all these statements are facts yet in today's america introducing them to the conversation instantly causes hours cut

1:03:18 Matt: So he makes some ethnic statements. Very unfortunate.

1:03:39 Lydia: Editor chimes in citations needed oh

1:03:43 Thomas: Like telling old people there's nothing in their mouths and they can stop chewing or informing cab drivers that curry is not a deodorant wow

1:03:51 Lydia: My god wow and he the editor crosses that out and says delete irrelevant and superfluous ethnic joke that's terrible oh

1:04:01 Thomas: Boy what

1:04:02 Matt: Yeah, let's keep going. And then he goes, of course, on and on about Ghostbusters, because it's very important to him that you know about his role, the woman woman ghostbusters that he hated so much um

1:04:09 Thomas: The what the female go okay oh yeah that okay got this guy the

1:04:16 Matt: Uh middle of page uh 15 on the pdf uh the and again these are basically footnotes you know I can't I can'T get enough yeah which

1:04:20 Thomas: Ghostbusters oh he was titling it the ghost busters left as in like that huh but then the editor changed it to the ghost busters story story

1:04:32 Matt: Makes more sense

1:04:32 Lydia: If you're going to tell the ghostbusters story here you have to tell them the whole story here including the fact that people doxed her and sent her Harambe pictures. Move material from page 49 here.

1:04:39 Thomas: That's interesting so that's why wouldn't this tell you like maybe uh was this simon schuster maybe you don't be publishing this like why it because it just strikes me so silly to be like yeah milo tell the whole story including the bad parts about you it's like that's his his whole thing is not doing that why would you think he would do it I don't get it oh

1:04:51 Matt: But the conservative one right right and what you caused yeah right yeah yep well like and look at the comment on the next page on top of page 16 when the thing he deletes and the comment on it I

1:05:11 Thomas: All right um this coupled with the fact that the trailer was limper than a frat boy's penis at a fat acceptance rally huh it

1:05:22 Lydia: And editor deletes that, obviously, and changes it to boring. And then further says, in a book that will be read by people who don't share your POV, avoid gratuitous insults. They detract from the overall point you're making. Again, a lecture or a Breitbart column, the audience already shares your POV and sense of humor.

1:05:25 Thomas: Just puts boring wait

1:05:40 Matt: So there's a I think

1:05:40 Thomas: Man what are you doing simon schuster like you know that did why did you sign this guy to a book deal like this is what he does yeah

1:05:47 Lydia: I know.

1:05:45 Matt: Well remember the email here you go period like this is where this mind's where this man's head is at by the time he finishes his manuscript he gets increasingly angry as he's reading it as you know it's just like if like this ist so terrible uh skip down to page 17 and what you can see this is really funny um so yeah and he's trying to talk about the left he's trying to give you a history of the left and there's a really funny thing about how you know he's saying well some you know bernie sanders and jeremy corbyn they still are with the working people right and then look at the highlighted sentence here about there's no reason because

1:06:04 Thomas: Of the pdf here okay there is no reason why the left had to abandon its old blue collar base

1:06:22 Lydia: He responds, the reason was partly that the base abandoned the Democrats during the 1960s because the Democrats voted for civil rights legislation.

1:06:31 Matt: The democrats because the people that you are now whipping up supported you know didn't support them anymore um yeah I just love the history lesson in here and then yeah and then we you know and supportable charge word for word um oh yeah uh but is

1:06:33 Thomas: That's so funny oh my god yeah this is funny barack obama's infamous 2008 Quip that former working class communities, quote, cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people who aren't like them or anti -immigrant sentiment or anti trade sentiment. And then the highlight is just word for word.

1:07:01 Lydia: Word for word?

1:07:03 Thomas: Like, like, was that the quote?

1:07:03 Matt: That really a quote don't think that's what he said uh yeah and then uh top of page yeah

1:07:09 Thomas: If you're going to quote Barack Obama, a famous statement he made, like maybe get it right. Oh, boy. Sorry. Top of what?

1:07:17 Matt: Top page 20 in the pdf so bad so bad it

1:07:20 Thomas: This is so fun. All right. So this is all crossed out, but it was. I can practically hear science fiction authors currently suffering an incursion of social justice feverishly writings. What the fuck? Okay. Sorry. It's all crossed outs.

1:07:36 Matt: Doesn't make any sense Antonio

1:07:37 Thomas: It is hard to read, but I can't grasp the sentence going on here. Here. I can practically hear science fiction authors currently suffering an incursion of social justice. I'm guessing there should be a comma there. Feverishly writing stories about a traveling through time to bump off Antonio before he wrote anything influential.

1:07:57 Matt: Gramsci is talking about the uh political theorist but but the comment I think is very appropriate that you just say for the whole book like that's really the whole thing just

1:08:00 Lydia: And then the editor, yeah. Unclear, unfunny, delete. Yeah. Yeah, right.

1:07:59 Thomas: What the fuck? Okay. Yeah. Yeah, just highlight the whole thing and just have that one.

1:08:09 Matt: Say that right okay so

1:08:09 Lydia: What if that was the title of like the file name?

1:08:11 Thomas: Like control a comment unfunny

1:08:13 Lydia: Unclear. Unfunny. Delete. Man.

1:08:14 Thomas: Uncleared leader yeah oh my

1:08:15 Matt: Very funny point on page 20 of the manuscript if you just keep going uh he deletes two paragraphs which are ridiculous paragraphs not even like trolling ridiculous just like why did you write this ridiculous yeah

1:08:27 Thomas: Wow okay so when so it says when social conservatives started going after harry potter for promoting witchcraft it became embarrassingly clear what side had won the culture wars speaking of witchcraft this is the part that's crossed out speaking of which craft the clintons have turned into such villains that That the demons summoned through their spirit cooking sessions take notes on them.

1:08:49 Lydia: What the?

1:08:51 Thomas: What? It's like a master class in demonic behavior. The demons wonder how she has done it all in one human lifetime. If you want a great example of media bias, imagine if the Trump campaign was participating in satanic rituals involving blood and semen. The closest thing Donald Trump has to an occult ritual is his infamous habit of eating KFC with a knife and fork. But even that I think is one of daddy's elaborate trolls oh yeah he called him daddy I forgot about that so stupid you have to feel for poor bill every time he hears gender and gap in the same sentence he gets hard and then sees hillary's crossed eyes and evil smile and he's booking another flight on the lolita express wow okay well a broken clock yeah

1:09:16 Lydia: Ew. Freaking weird. Wow.

1:09:18 Matt: So gross editor's comment and

1:09:34 Lydia: All of that was cut. Yeah and the editor says this entire paragraph is just repeating fake news. There was no blood, no semen, and there was no Satanism. Delete.

1:09:37 Matt: Incredible

1:09:46 Thomas: Why why are you doing this like why yeah

1:09:51 Matt: Yeah um and then you know you just like he points out in the next page that actually the left did not immediately go on to gay marriage uh he's the whole section we go on and on um so

1:10:02 Thomas: Where's some other highlights here this is great a

1:10:03 Matt: You get the there's actually um vanity fair no excuse me go on we'll keep going well I'll come back to that um so top of page 29 the pyramid of oppression that he talks about yeah uh you can just read that part of the sentence over the left is committed you know can't

1:10:17 Thomas: Pdf page oh yeah god they love to do that uh all right priorities my own left very different because of their intellectual pedigree and angry blah blah the left is committed to defending a worldview which arranges women minorities and gays in a pyramid of oppression with straight white males as the least oppressed pressed at the bottom.

1:10:40 Lydia: Editor responds, see pyramid reference on page 51. You construct this metaphor very badly, especially when you reverse the pyramid on page 29.

1:10:50 Matt: Even keep your pyramid straight come on what are you doing

1:10:52 Thomas: Now I have to see that. Reverse the pyramid. Okay, where is 29 here? Where's the pyramid?

1:10:52 Lydia: Just decide.

1:10:54 Matt: It was 28 actually yeah so the yeah straight white males yeah yeah I think he just he was too angry to yeah

1:11:01 Thomas: It was 28. Oh, maybe it got... Yeah. Yeah. So this was the new identity driven left doesn't just hate white... Okay, it's crossed out. I don't know which part I should read, but doesn't hate only white men. One of the consequences of replacing the old working class Yes, bourgeoisie dichotomy with the myriad identities of intersectional theory is that everything has become much more complicated. Yes, straight white males are the most oppressive at the top of the pyramid.

1:11:09 Lydia: Yeah. What

1:11:35 Thomas: But how do you order everyone else?

1:11:33 Lydia: A

1:11:37 Matt: Speaking of mess page 31 oh

1:11:39 Lydia: Mess. And

1:11:42 Thomas: And the comment was, see bottom of pyramid reference on page 49. Sorry, what?

1:11:46 Matt: We're gonna get there uh

1:11:46 Thomas: Did

1:11:47 Matt: Yeah so we're gonna let's go down to uh pdf page 34 uh even snoop dogg good

1:11:52 Thomas: You notice, by the way, that these stroppy and crossed out whiny celebs uniformly threatened to move to overwhelmingly white countries? Even Snoop Dogg, who promised to move into Africa, said he would only go to South Africa.

1:12:10 Lydia: Then the editor let's not call south africa white

1:12:15 Matt: Advice he also encourages him not to use nazi analogies ever and the next thing what other people do that

1:12:15 Thomas: White countries, yeah. Oh, wow. Well, it turns out that the Hollywood left is even more racist than the high level Nazis, many of whom settled in shock horror South American compounds after fleeing Germany. I don't like using Nazi analogies ever. Let other people do that. No, he is the other people, though. Milo is the Other People you're talking about. So this is so freaking bad.

1:12:32 Matt: Page

1:12:44 Thomas: This is good stuff. Can't be accused of being homophobic. Only the the laughable charge of self -hatred which most ordinary people accused of it instinctively react to with an eye roll and given my penchant for black men oh he had denizens of the dark continent I can't be accused of being racist either I'm the left's worst nightmare yeah that was his whole shtick

1:12:43 Matt: Page 37 page 37 yeah

1:13:01 Lydia: My god yeah and so then editor rephrase this obviously about denizens of the dark continent um dark continent will irritate in the wrong way it sounds like quote darkies and then

1:13:17 Thomas: No that's the point that's that's

1:13:18 Matt: That's what he wanted it's

1:13:18 Thomas: What he's trying to do was

1:13:19 Lydia: I can't be accused of being racist either the editor responds major point having sex with black people does not prove someone is racist you will have to address the charge of racist yeah you will Have to address The Charge of Racism clearly and with greater depth preferably early in the book when you discuss Leslie Jones more fully yeah

1:13:28 Thomas: Not racist but yeah he's not going to do that what book do you think that you're getting here like you yeah like what do you like this is the character that you hired to write about I know maybe the editor's not the one doing the hiring and the editor is the one they hand this off to but even still like the editor like I'm sure they would have talked to the editor and been like like there's no worth to this editing because it's going to turn it into a book. That's not the book that anyone would possibly be buying. I don't, I don'T get it. Matt, we're over time but this is I mean these highlights are hilarious this this editor is it's just so funny to read him trying to

1:13:39 Lydia: You signed the guy you know who he is yeah yeah no

1:14:01 Matt: Not my law yeah

1:14:13 Thomas: Deal deal with this hmm

1:14:14 Matt: I just to to really I'm going to send you now uh this is incredible harper's did a mashup and it's called the elements of a vial which is fantastic and this is just all of the best comments so we can just skip to the good stuff here and this makes it like a very funny review of the book uh so they and they're saying it's by mitchell ivers because it's all of his words even though he's not you know it's

1:14:30 Thomas: Awesome oh my god this is great okay here I'll get this up for people this is why didn't we start with this man yeah

1:14:34 Lydia: That's funny oh that is so smart

1:14:35 Matt: So good oh because I wanted I want to give you the format first so you can see how it fits in.

1:14:40 Thomas: Fair enough but it's pretty funny okay this is the elements of vile by mitchell uh did you well Well, they misspelled his name. It seems like they have two.

1:14:49 Lydia: You know what it is is because the l for mitchell the second l for michelle got combined with the last name

1:14:49 Thomas: What? The second L is combined. Yeah, that's funny. It's had the space in the wrong place. Okay. From editorial notes given to Milo Yiannopoulos, a leader of the alt -right by Mitchell Ivers, a vice president at Simon... Vice president at Simonshoester on his manuscript for Dangerous. Last year, Simonschoester canceled Yiannapoulos' book deal. He sued for breach of contract. Ivers' notes were submitted in December to a New York state court. Oh, this is great. All right, hon.

1:15:16 Thomas: Why don't you read some of the best ones here? Here this is so good like

1:15:16 Lydia: This is a lazy way to begin a manifesto you use the phrase quote bathe in the tears of my enemy on page 232 okay so just like reiterating

1:15:28 Thomas: A repeat of it yeah

1:15:28 Matt: Repeating yourself

1:15:29 Lydia: Yeah uh let's see the use of a phrase like quote two -faced back two -face backstabbing bitches diminishes your overall point yeah

1:15:39 Thomas: This is so good oh I like this too important a chapter to be scoring points against glenn beck the

1:15:45 Matt: Also, the Threshold publishes Glenn Beck too, so I think there's a little bit of conflict of interest there, but that's funny.

1:15:50 Thomas: Threshold wait what the oh

1:15:52 Matt: So when he's vice president of Simon & Schuster, he's the vice president who's in charge of this imprint of threshold imprint yeah the decor was all conservatives yeah it's

1:15:54 Lydia: The imprint. Yeah.

1:15:55 Thomas: The imprint oh wow that's great paris hilton is not the best authority to quote here stick to camille pacquiao

1:16:01 Matt: Like which he was also pretty conservative now uh I'm

1:16:05 Lydia: Stick with virgins. Quote, perverts is unnecessary. If you want to make a case for gay men going back into the closet and marrying women just to have children, you're going to have to employ a lot more intellectual rigor.

1:16:17 Lydia: The next one, leave the lesbians out of it.

1:16:17 Thomas: This is amazing this is so good so these are just all the different like comments that he put in there

1:16:21 Matt: Sure they'd appreciate that it's

1:16:25 Lydia: Yeah. Stop spreading fake news. No couple gay or straight has ever wanted to serve pizza at at their wedding. Oh, you can't say ugly people are drawn to the left. Have you ever seen a Trump rally? Oh, Mitchell.

1:16:33 Matt: More fun with our context even in

1:16:40 Lydia: Okay. Let's see. This is not the time or place for another black dick joke. Oh, boy.

1:16:41 Thomas: Boy how did I miss this back then this is so good

1:16:51 Lydia: If that headline is hate speech, this whole book is hate speak. Speech.

1:16:55 Matt: Caps which it is bring it home bring it home it's

1:16:59 Lydia: This entire argument is ridiculous. This would never happen. This is not true. This is not true either. Delete.

1:17:05 Thomas: Delete in all caps oh wow

1:17:09 Matt: So good and this is a guy who's used to editing conservatives like this is not me doing it

1:17:12 Thomas: We got what was that we got to see what was the delete about. I at least need to see that part of it.

1:17:17 Matt: Yeah we have to find that on the page

1:17:18 Thomas: Oh yeah, I'll find it. A lot of delete.

1:17:19 Lydia: You search delete, if you search, delete, that helps.

1:17:22 Thomas: My God. Actually. Yeah. Let's just go. Let's just go through a search of delete, shall we?

1:17:26 Lydia: All right.

1:17:26 Thomas: Oh, there's only, there's only 10. Okay. Delete. Not worth explaining why the Kardashians are anti-black.

1:17:29 Lydia: Well, the, yeah.

1:17:34 Thomas: Oh, let's go delete. This section feels phenomenally petty after the well -researched material previously. Delete. That's in his thing. This gets in the way of your point here. Delete all caps. Delete entire chapter. The book is better overall without hitting these quote ugly people notes in the other chapters and better overall by deleting this one. This is a stupid way to end a terrible chapter. Not worth keeping in. Delete that. OK, so that's it.

1:18:01 Thomas: Maybe I'll do the last paragraph. In today's feelings focused is defense shy culture. Being hot is becoming rather like disagreement. Its mere presence is enough to disturb the left. I sometimes wonder if the reason so many leftists retreat into safe spaces when they hear I'm coming to campus is because of my supposedly offensive views or because they simply can't bear to gaze on such Adonis-like beauty. Hotties of the world, tear off your chains.

1:18:02 Matt: Then it uh

1:18:26 Lydia: God. So obnoxious.

1:18:28 Thomas: Delete entire chapter. Oh, man.

1:18:28 Matt: It's a oh

1:18:33 Lydia: That's all I see. I'm not seeing the delete.

1:18:34 Thomas: I don't see delete. I wonder.

1:18:35 Matt: I I found it it's on that manuscript page 84 uh

1:18:39 Thomas: Yeah. How did that not?

1:18:39 Lydia: It didn't show up, I guess, because of the all caps, maybe. Interesting.

1:18:43 Thomas: Boy. Yeah. Yeah it's it's oh, where's it start? Still, I suppose the lesbians need somewhere to go. Look at any gender studies faculty in america and you're likely to list you're you're like what you're likely to a list that goes something like uh d slur d slurm d slurb divorcee d slurp d slurf genderqueer lesbians should be thrown out of academia altogether and put back where they belong porn god hates f slurs but he hates feminists more and that's the delete hug oh

1:18:44 Matt: It's almost unreadable that

1:19:15 Lydia: Wow, that is crazy.

1:19:15 Matt: Finally earned him a delete ugh it is awful and it's not triggering awful it's just like gross like what are you doing it sucks it's even well written like we We deserve a better class of criminal here. Come on.

1:19:22 Thomas: It's just bad just plain bad oh man what an idiot no but we were all too triggered you see but then when he said the things about the sex with underage then it wasn't triggering that's just fine you can cancel him for that but not for all this stuff because then that's just us being triggered

1:19:41 Lydia: We triggered or were we just shocked by his Adonis -like features of his beauty?

1:19:45 Matt: That's true. Can't take it.

1:19:47 Lydia: Yeah.

1:19:47 Thomas: And was the does the right just triggered when they canceled him for the the other stuff like it's it's stupid the whole thing was dumb it was a lie at the time I'm so glad this guy is not relevant anymore but it was dumb at the same time and then people bought it and they still buy into this idiot frame

1:19:51 Lydia: Ridiculous. Yeah. And they still were going to give him a book deal. I mean, they still gave him a Book Deal before they canceled it.

1:20:01 Matt: Well, they didn't. So Simon & Schuster

1:20:02 Thomas: Did

1:20:06 Matt: Did cancel it. The suit was dismissed, so that didn't go anywhere. So he self-published, and I think he made a bunch of money self - publishing it, but probably not as much as he would have.

1:20:13 Thomas: He keep in all this we should do a comparison see how many of his notes he listened to that'd be so funny

1:20:16 Matt: I'm sure he probably had. Yeah.

1:20:18 Lydia: But I just don't want to give them any money for it, though.

1:20:20 Matt: No, don't want to look at it.

1:20:22 Thomas: All right well we went over oh well that was worth it this guy was the worst thanks matt uh that was fun really interesting thing about the immigration situation are we ever gonna know more you think or is this pretty much it interesting

1:20:34 Matt: Only if he voluntarily releases the file he says he requested. But we'll find out. Maybe his husband will tell us a little more sometime. Time but uh I think I I feel pretty good about I can stand behind what I've said today so

1:20:44 Thomas: All right and thanks producer lydia thanks so much for listening everybody uh and for pledging and we'll see you for rapid response friday

1:20:57 Clip: This has been Opening Arguments, produced by Thomas and Lydia Smith, with editing help from Peter Baird. The intro is by Thomas Smith. This outro is by Matt Cameron. Support the show at patreon.com/law. Contact us through Patreon or openarguments@gmail.com. Make sure to follow our Bluesky at OpenArgs. But most of all, please share the show. Thanks for listening.