Lively v. Baldoni 45 - FINE. If I Can't Sexually Harass While Making a Movie Then I Don't Even Want to DO IT

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:01 Clip: All rise. Court is now in session. Court is reconvened. I may be seated. Maintain order. The federal rise to face the jury and harken to its verdicts.

0:00:25 Thomas: Gavel in, gavel in. It is gavel, gaVEL, gaVELheads. I am Thomas. That over there is Lydia. How are you doing?

0:00:30 Lydia: Hello, I am very excited for today. Do you think we're going to get through the 17 point list?

0:00:37 Thomas: No!

0:00:38 Lydia: You don't? I don't know. I think we might. I think we may. Well, well, we're gonna start not on your watch. Yeah, that's true. That's true, if anyone on this podcast would prevent it from it just

0:00:40 Thomas: No chance. Not gonna happen. Not on my watch, baby. No way. I'll prevent it from happening. How dare you? What does that mean?

0:00:53 Lydia: You you have a lot to say and I like it that's all

0:00:56 Thomas: Well, we'll see. And then after the 17 -point list, what's that? Point 18? Point 19? I don't know. It's been so long, I don' t remember what to expect after that. Like, more stupid shit? Yeah.

0:01:00 Lydia: Yeah I know I know probably more ultimatums you know a variety of ultimatum that you

0:01:07 Thomas: Let me guess, more of the same nonsense horse shit about her stealing the film, blah, blah blah, we'll see. We'll take it on as it comes.

0:01:11 Lydia: Know may yeah yeah may or may not end up in baldoni's death and demise

0:01:18 Thomas: Some really interesting stuff in this one, and also some good insight into Blake Lively's actual talent, which is, there's some good stuff in here. I'm excited for you to hear it, and maybe perhaps a good reason why she should have been maybe in control of some stuff, more so than Baldoni, who doesn't seem to know what the fuck he's doing. Anyway, that'll be fun. We're going to start off with, I think there's some short points in the list that we can get through quickly, hopefully. So that's where we'll start. And then we'll be on our merry way. So thanks so much for listening and tuning in. Thanks most of all to our patrons who pledge at patreon .com slash gavelpod and get stuff early and avoid the ICE recruitment ads and talk to us. And when they talk to US, we give them ICE recruitment apps. So just so they don't miss out. We're like, hey, join ICE. It's the first thing we say.

0:02:02 Lydia: You might have missed this. Yeah, it's

0:02:05 Thomas: Because actually they have so much of a federal budget that now they can pay us personally to try to like recruit our patrons.

0:02:11 Lydia: Literally a check from Kristi Noem. Yeah. That we receive.

0:02:14 Thomas: We're swimming in ice money. God, I wish that were true. That'd be like one good thing to happen. We'd be Like, yeah, you got so much money. Like, can we like blow all your money? There's so much grift, you know, can we federal grift out of money that'll help them not be able to use it for like more sweeping up immigrants, you know, sorry,

0:02:23 Lydia: There is. Yeah let's grift on the other side of this. It's usually right wing grift.

0:02:34 Thomas: I didn't mean grift in the sense of the podcast grift. I meant government grift like there's like contract bloat and stuff. I'm saying can we do that and have it take from the pot of money they're supposed to use for fascism. And we're like, oh, we provide excellent fascism services over here at Serious Fascism Network. We are so good at ICE recruitment. Give us $11 billion and we will deliver you one ICE person. And they'll be like, damn. They'll be that's worth it. They're like wow, that's a better rate than we're getting, a better conversion rate than elsewhere. All right. So all we're going to need is one of of you listeners to join ICE in order for us to get $11 billion. That's the new plan. No, I'm just kidding. All that nonsense aside, none of that is real. Thanks so much for listening and avoid that. It's patreon .com slash gavelpod. Share the show. Hey, share the show with anyone talking about this case.

0:02:49 Lydia: Yeah I mean they give a lot of money to Elon Musk like like just throw a couple couple pennies our way yeah and then we'll give you some of the 11 billion dollars yeah definitely point

0:03:29 Thomas: We'd really appreciate it. Especially if you want to show your appreciation and can't become a patron, we get it. That'S a good way to do it. All right. After this break, we'll be on to this point something of this something infinite point list.

0:03:39 Lydia: 11 yeah

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0:03:47 Thomas: All Right. We've We've got some ones we can get through quickly, I think. Point 11, Sony must have a, well, here's Lively's version once again. Sony must haven't mutually approved representative on set for the remainder of rehearsal and shooting days, including on a closed set to actively supervise the production, including monitoring the safety of the cast and crew, ensuring compliance with the schedule and overseeing logistics, problem solving and creative issues. Once again, I know there's a minor thing, but if her whole thing is she's a lying fucking no good trying to take over, sure seems weird that she would want like a neutral, like Sony representative on Set.

0:04:16 Thomas: Why would that help her? And their response, what, why would that be their responsibility? That's already stupid. Well, we don't think it should be Angie because she might have other work to do. What? She works for Sony. Yeah. What? That just, again, reeks of bullshit. I don't know what that is, but it's fucking stupid.

0:04:18 Lydia: Yeah wayfarer agreed to the concept of having a sony representative on set whenever lively was on set though it gently pushed back on the idea that it always be angie giannetti who might occasionally have other pressing work obligations overall all however Wayfair agreed yeah that would be for Angie to figure out yeah I think Sony will manage that thank you it almost feels like if they're pushing back on it being Angie that tells me that they think that Angie's like in league with Blake like that they're it's a conspiracy right and they're gonna

0:05:01 Thomas: Yeah. Who knows? Maybe based on the tone of that call, you know, and that's the conspiratorial version. The other version is just like, hey, fuckers, what are you doing over there? Like, what's happening? Oh, yeah. Yeah, OK. She says Wayfair will engage an additional experienced A -level producer approved by Miss Lively to actively supervise the production, including monitoring the safety of the cast and crew, ensuring compliance with the schedule and overseeing logistics, problem solving, creative issues. So kind of similar language there. But she's bringing in again, this is this is good faith stuff. This is someone who is not trying to take control. This is somebody who's like, let's get some people in here and know what the fuck they're doing. Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's someone they all agree on. And she she wants to make sure she agrees but like it is ultimately someone they all agree on right hey there you go sounds like there's a cost to being as shitty at your job as you've been so again unless Sony is part of the conspiracy which if they were you would sure have expected that Wayfair would sue them if Sony was part of The Takeover of the film sir

0:05:08 Lydia: Collude yeah yeah point 12 yeah well not bringing on like Ryan Reynolds and being like okay here's your new producer like like it's someone that she does not yeah yeah exactly yeah uh wayfair pointed out that the additional expense and the contractual implications of hiring an additional producer would have detrimental effects on the production in the end wayfaire agreed as it would cost production more if lively refused to return to work yeah todd black suggested by sony and approved by lively was ultimately brought on as an additional producer right right

0:06:20 Thomas: Weird that they're not a party to that lawsuit so now we have to believe that if this is all Lively's plot to take over the film that Sony is part of it. They have to be, right? I mean, they suggested this person, this like either you're full of shit and this is just Blake making her best effort to just in good faith, try to get through this, which is the obvious truth. Or now this conspiracy goes all the way to Sony. Fucking Alex Jones ass bullshit.

0:06:42 Lydia: Well but and then and then they don't even have the guts to name sony in their lawsuit

0:06:49 Thomas: Yeah, that's what it said. That's why I'm saying that this is them lying. They know this is bullshit. They're just kind of hand -waving this. They expect no one except us to actually read through all this stuff and to see that like, hmm, sure looks like this is a genuine problem Blake had that she involved a third party with Sony that wouldn't like, there's no fucking way they're in the Blake Lively universe of conspiracy. That doesn't make any sense. And if they were, they would have sued, you know, Wayfair would have sued them.

0:07:13 Thomas: So this I think is them trying to use the facts as they can without admitting what that would mean. You know, I think they, again, it's just for stupid people who don't read and who want to not believe a woman. Okay. 13, she said Wayfaire must empower any existing third party producer with appropriate and customary authority to actively supervise the production including monitoring the safety of the cast and crew ensuring compliance with the schedule and overseeing logistics problem solving creative issues so similar language again she's getting more people involved and we've noted it before who didn't seem to like blake very interesting

0:07:40 Lydia: This is specifically for alex sacks so she is the third party producer yeah one I think it was that she is just you know focused on

0:07:52 Thomas: Seems to be good at her job yeah way more evidence that this is blake doing good faith stuff not blake taking over a film why would she want to empower somebody who already didn't like her and was on kind of just inside of things

0:07:52 Lydia: Getting things done yeah right yeah at least in terms of the logistics non

0:08:05 Thomas: All right easy well yeah no problem solving creative issues like it's all the same language as the last one they keep doing the same same language because her problems are like that's a good indicator the language of the last three points are all the same and they're about bringing in other people who know what the fuck they're doing and empowering them and not in Blake people they're not Blake's family they're not you know it's like it's two of them are like more the other side really it's the Alex Saxons didn't black end up being kind of on their side in a weird way or

0:08:21 Lydia: -wayfarer people No, no. I mean, I don't know that I would characterize their side because I also wouldn't characterize Alex Sachs that way either.

0:08:34 Thomas: I wouldn't say side but like yeah someone right they're Not

0:08:37 Lydia: But they're just they are focused on producing the movie and getting it done. Yeah.

0:08:39 Thomas: Blake homers yeah they'reNotBlake's familythey'reNotwhatever The people who, if anything, I guess what I'm saying is, yeah, I should rephrase. If anything, they would probably have more of a bias toward the other side, is all I'm saying. Like in terms of, like if you were going to pick who's on what person's side, the producer that's already shit talking Blake, essentially to Justin, you would think that's like not going to be a big Blake stan who's going to like help Blake take over a film, right?

0:08:43 Lydia: They're like, knock it off. And yeah, yeah.

0:09:06 Thomas: That's all I am saying.

0:09:06 Lydia: I think it's just like the motivation is is not like on a personal sort of thing or anything like that.

0:09:11 Thomas: Well, that's what I mean is my whole overall point is this is her doing stuff for the good of the film, not for her. This is not for the Good of Blake. This is for the good of the film because the language for all of them was just to read that that repeated language for All three of these things was to actively supervise the production including monitoring the safety of this cast and crew Ensuring compliance with the schedule and overseeing logistics problem solving and creative issues. That was for all three of those points Okay, point 14 Lively's version wayfarer will engage in a list stunt double Approved by miss lively to rehearse and perform any scenes involving the character lily that depicts rape or any act of sexual violence Ms. Lively will only perform close -up work or other pre -approved shots for such scenes. This one's a pretty quick response, so how do they respond?

0:09:57 Lydia: Yeah. Despite not requesting this at the contract negotiation phase, Lively's pre -approved stunt and body doubles were

0:10:02 Thomas: Yeah, she also didn't request that you stop talking to her dead dad. That's not something she thought she had to do.

0:10:06 Lydia: Fully acceptable to Wayfair, and so they agreed, despite the fact that was an additional and unplanned expense to the film. Ultimately, no body doubles were used in the film at Lively's request. Lively and Baldoni displayed a courteous and professional relationship throughout phase two of production.

0:10:27 Thomas: All right. By all accounts, and this lends more credibility to her story, even by her account, okay, things worked out for the second phase. If she's making it up, why wouldn't she be like, ah, it was even worse. If it's all made up, weird. She says, we're on with 15 of 17, and then, you know, only 180 more pages to go somehow.

0:10:49 Thomas: I don't know what all that's going to be, but we'll see. Any rehearsal or shooting involving Miss Lively or any other performer depicting the character of Lily that involves nudity, including partial nudity or simulated sex, must be conducted strictly in accordance with the nudity rider and must adhere to the approved script.

0:10:49 Lydia: Dear god

0:11:12 Thomas: Hmm. Okay.

0:11:12 Lydia: Yeah I think they summarize that fairly in their narrative and then again quick response here this was an overstep an attempt to expand lively's right to her own nudity writer to assert control of the nudity rider for another actor the actor who portrayed young lily isabella fairer while seeing this as infringing on the young actor's independent right to her own nudity writer wayfair once again was forced to agree while informing lively that young lily had already filmed her intimate scenes pursuant to herown nuditywriter yeah it's interesting I wonder why would blake have felt like that was necessary not just for her own like like her as Blake. Yeah.

0:11:48 Thomas: Well, they interpreted that as young Lily. That's not said in the point. So maybe she's thinking that, but also maybe she is talking about this the body double and if somebody is going to be your body double, the viewing audience doesn't know whose boob that is, you know, so often that would be a weird thing like even if it's like, oh, well, it's not mine. Well, if the world, if you're somebody who is, you know, someone who doesn't want to show their body on screen, it wouldn't really make it better if it's like, well, we'll have a double do it. Like if the whole world thinks you did, that's not really like to that person, it's probably like, that'S almost saying like, Well, If I have AI make porn of you, that' s fine. Yeah.

0:11:56 Lydia: Stunt doubles, body doubles. Yeah yeah yeah. Mm -hmm mm -hmm.

0:12:26 Lydia: Yeah I think there's also an element of it too where it's like she knows how frequently her own boundaries were being crossed that it's almost protective in a sense of someone who is stepping in because she feels unsafe on set and so this person is now stepping in for her and and what she deems an unsafe position that she makes it crystal clear like they are afforded these protections as well

0:12:52 Thomas: Possibly it's also the thing where she said young Lily's, they're going to have her do an orgasm scene, even though she's underage. It's like maybe she's trying to like, Hey, I don't want be a part of a movie that's kind of doing that stuff. Yeah. So, you know, that was a quick response. 16. Any and all day players must be engaged through customary industry talent agencies, not and not through personal connections of the director and or producer. Hmm. Here we go. Okay. So they got a little bit of a longer response to this, but still not like too long.

0:13:14 Lydia: Yeah it's gross yeah so this is the doctor that's delivering the baby yeah yeah I mean it's like a full page actually okay so we have some mud slinging here I guess a little bit baldoni casting an experienced actor who happens to be a friend is no different than casting lively sister who was cast because she is lively sister the actor portraying the obstetrician is an award award -winning shakespearean trained actor okay with an mfa in acting from

0:13:39 Thomas: And there's only 40 million of those.

0:13:45 Lydia: Ucla yeah shakespeare and trained feels what does that mean because like there's plenty of schools where they do shakespeare and they do it badly and then there's schools where THEY DO IT WHAT LIKE SHAKESPEAREAN TRAINED WHAT LIKE

0:13:56 Thomas: Yeah it's not really about like the training like when you see who's in a movie you're not like well what training did they have it's like well are they good what have they done you know I'm gonna go see this movie because this person was trained in shakespeare at ucla

0:14:10 Lydia: AND IN ADDITION TO APPEARING ON NUMEROUS HIT TELEVISION SHOWS HAS TOURED NATIONALLY WITH A TONY AWARD -WINNING ACTING COMPANY AND ATTENDED OXFORD'S ACTING program on full scholarship this is so strange and bizarre yeah

0:14:19 Thomas: Yeah this is just a cv that could mean something or nothing like it could literally mean nothing this is one that's like the problem was casting him in a role that she felt was like right next to her vagina in a a delivery scene like that's the problem I don't think she would have cared that much if this guy was an extra the main thing is they quote lively's current complaint states that she was alarmed when baldoni introduced him as his friend and allowed him to play this intimate role in which the actress face and hands were in close proximity to her nearly new genitalia categorizing the experience as invasive and humiliating it is lively suggestion that a highly trained and an experienced actor would have an unseemly interest in being in close proximity to her nearly nude genitalia, which as previously established was not nude or exposed. Okay. Yeah. Yeah.

0:15:08 Lydia: Don't know that it was established I think they're giving themselves a lot of credit there

0:15:12 Thomas: It's as agreed upon that it was barely covered. That is inappropriate and invasive and humiliating to the actor. To reiterate, Lively knowingly made a false statement that only a small piece of fabric covered her genitalium during the birth scene. In fact, Lived was was wearing briefs during the scene. That's just not true. And was covered by a hospital gown and was wearing a pregnancy suit covering her midsection. This was not in any way new to partially nude scene. Well, we did the thing. We went through the video. She's not wearing brief. Once again, Wayfarer agreed, despite being wholly offended by this accusation. So this is one that I think is like, I don't think she's going to be able to like prove this one thing is like obviously, you know, it'd be pretty hard, especially with, you Know, if they cast her her sister or something. I don't know. But I would imagine if she's able to establish with the jury the stuff like, oh, that set wasn't closed. Oh, Sarowitz was there. Like if she established, and I don'T know if she will be able to, I'm just saying like if she establishes that there was a atmosphere of like, ooh, come check out what Blake's doing, sort of like a bro -y thing. I think this would be one more troublesome part to it. ButI also don'T, like when was this casting done? How was the decision made? And I DON'T know If like this one thing alone

0:16:23 Thomas: Would be anything anything really, but it's just another, I don't blame her for being like, yeah. And it was weird and his friend.

0:16:29 Lydia: It's a tally mark in that column

0:16:31 Thomas: Yeah. I feel like this is one of those things. That's another factor that like the whole situation was gross. And this was one more thing, but I don'T, I DON'T know that like legally speaking, people are going to know people it's getting, you know, her sister was cast as something. I think it's Just somebody's going to be doing that role. If the allegation was like, he was arbitrarily put closer to her genitalia or whatever, and that might be a different story. But if it's like, if somebody was going to Be in this role, I dunno, I think this is more taken as like yet another reason this felt a little gross. I'm just saying, I think it would be hard to get a jury to care that much about this if none of the other stuff is really established. It's like, well, it's an actor. Sometimes you're going to know the actors. And final point here on this one, 17, hold an all hands in -person meeting before production resumes, which will include the director, all producers, the Sony representative, the newly engaged third -party producer, BL and BL's designated representatives to confirm and approve a plan for implementation of all of the above that will be adhered to for the physical and emotional safety of BL, her employees, and all the cast and crew moving forward.

0:17:09 Lydia: Yeah yeah you remember how they've like talked about this previously where they like show up binders in hand excited to like dive into phase to the production and oh my god

0:17:37 Thomas: Yeah. They brought their parents. Like they had an assembly of their kids and their families like, let's go, here we go. And then they were like assaulted.

0:17:41 Lydia: They were yeah they were yeah exactly they were attacked by these demands or whatever it's like it's very clearly laid out the purpose of this meeting

0:17:50 Thomas: It's like when Gaston was going to propose to Belle, you know? And then he was like, all right, let's start filming. We have the band. It was like... Yeah.

0:17:55 Lydia: Yeah yeah exactly it's the purpose is that meeting is very clearly spelled out in this thing that they received in november that all hands meeting was in january they were very very very much aware of what the purpose of that meeting

0:18:13 Thomas: That was lying bullshit. All right. Well, what's their response to this meeting thing?

0:18:18 Lydia: Was wayfarer understood this request to be a sincere offer to meet and discuss the needs and preferences of lively and other cast members to ensure comfort and security while filming a movie that dealt with difficult themes

0:18:26 Thomas: Let's see well then you're idiots I guess

0:18:30 Lydia: What you already signed a paper

0:18:32 Thomas: We understood that none of this sexual harassment was anything and we forgot we have memento disease and we decided that didn't exist

0:18:39 Lydia: Also preferences like it's just it's so dismissive in that spirit wayfarers readily agreed believing that an opportunity to discuss concerns openly and to plan resuming production would be welcome no you you already signed a paper saying that you would be doing all of these things. What do you think you're discussing other than like, yes, we've put those things into place?

0:18:40 Thomas: Yeah exactly comfort and secure it's stupid yeah yep yeah you're right you should keep reading just because it's so funny like there we were going about our

0:19:01 Lydia: Yeah. As will be established, Wayfarer's good faith belief could not have been farther from the truth behind this demand. Lively, with the support of her husband, in parentheses, used this demand to justify an ambush of Baldoni and Heath on the eve of the first day of filming in phase two of production. No it specifically is spelled out in the thing that you freaking signed that this is the purpose of the meeting this is not a surprise this is not an ambush this language is ridiculous so

0:19:11 Thomas: Business what yeah it's very Very silly.

0:19:34 Lydia: Looking at the timeline one of the meetings that they mention in this exhibit is june 1st when she returns from having covid and they say upon returning to production lively requested a meeting with baldoni and the film's producers during which she shared a series of grievances that she appeared to have spent the past five days overanalyzing from the outset it was clear that she had scrutinized every minor interaction and perceived slight from the previous week okay maybe you should have told her that there was a covid exposure on set maybe she wouldn't have gotten covid maybe she would have gone home and spent that overanlyzing apparently

0:20:06 Thomas: Here's me overanalyzing the fact that you gave me and my baby fucking COVID, assholes. That's stupid.

0:20:12 Lydia: So then we get you know after christmas and everything december 28th lively emails baldoni to request a meeting at her apartment with him and the team ahead of the start of production on january 4th 2023 2024 I should say they mistyped there which which is what they should have expected per the return to production requests that they signed. And this message from Blake to Justin, Hey, I hope you and your family had a nice holiday. Would love to set the time for our meeting before we start production. We'll be back in town January 4th. Does 3 p .m. work? We'll host in Tribeca. Happy to have just you. Not sure if Jamie will be on set, but he's welcome. We can also have the whole team, blank and blank, you prefer. Please let me know on all. So then January 4th, it says Baldoni, Heath, a Sony executive, a producer, the A -list producer, Todd Black, and the film's first AD met at Lively and Reynolds' New York apartment ahead of the scheduled production restart on January 4rd. The team arrived prepared, and here it is, with production binders in hand, eager to kick off the next phase of filming.

0:21:11 Thomas: Dewey -eyed. Yeah.

0:21:12 Lydia: However, Lively had different intentions for the meeting. She had the same intentions that she laid out in that document that you signed.

0:21:20 Thomas: It's interesting. In the timeline, there's an email from December 27th from Justin Baldoni to production team, which he characterizes as, Baldoni emailed his team of producers with notes on his revised script, expressing sadness and frustration over Lively's takeover of a film They had just spent years developing, writing, and funding, having no energy left to fight. He reluctantly declared he was waving the white flag and submitting, and would give Lively 98 % of what she wants. He also conveyed serious concern over handling the intimacy scenes, given the accusations inherent in Lively's return to production demands. No, they're just in there. They're not inherent. It's just part of it.

0:21:54 Lydia: Yeah yeah

0:22:03 Thomas: Baldoni asked his producing partners for guidance, stating he was rightfully afraid that something innocuous or not to lively standards would very likely be used against him as it already had. Adding that creativity is impossible in an environment shrouded by fear. A producer responded, thanking him for his thoughtful breakdown, especially considering the circumstances.

0:22:05 Lydia: She explicitly says yeah is that jamie oh no it says cc jamie dang I was like oh it'd be hilarious if it was jamie to justin I'm guessing that's todd honestly

0:22:24 Thomas: Yeah, that'd be funny if it were. Yeah.

0:22:30 Thomas: What's the timing on this? Because if this is talking about how she has these demands for production, none of those are around writing. He says, everyone knows how I feel about all this and how angry I am that Blake has taken over our film and somehow rewrote a movie. We spent like, yeah, yeah. We've covered that.

0:22:36 Lydia: No somehow you told her to yeah somehow geez

0:22:50 Thomas: Also, by the way, he's waving the way I'm

0:22:51 Lydia: Yeah he's he's releasing it he relinquishes the white flag W -A -I

0:22:57 Thomas: Going to wave the white flag.

0:22:57 Lydia: -V. Yeah. Sorry, Justin. Shouldn't be spending the time doing that. But yeah.

0:23:03 Thomas: Yeah, that's like a thing where he's supposed to have to have a physical white flag was like, I'm waving that. So I just have to wave them stupid. Stupid. Anyway, yeah, I'm going to give her 98%. I'm sure none of us have the energy to fight anymore. The, the team, the, the other team who has been working their asses off, working their ass off needs a shooting script on January 2nd. Yeah. This feels like when the police shoot somebody and then the citizens are like, no, don't shoot people. And they're like, well, no, we can't even do our job.

0:23:22 Lydia: Just one ass.

0:23:36 Thomas: And then they quit. It's like a toddler.

0:23:36 Lydia: Yeah yeah it does feel like that.

0:23:39 Thomas: I don't even know how to do this. I can't even, how do I do a movie if I can sexually harass? It's impossible. Look. And then they just like tip over the camera and there's a fire and stuff. Can't even do it. It's a hundred percent what this is. The big issues are going to be intimacy, how and what we are shooting up for those scenes and how the script is going to Be presented to her and with what notes to that, that wasn't any part of it really. Like that wasn'T part of her complaints. Yeah.

0:23:55 Lydia: No it's it's the paranoia that comes when you've been me too'd. It's like when me too is really like gaining a foothold and stuff and you would hear from men who are like well how am I supposed to

0:24:09 Thomas: I Can't can't even talk to women yeah

0:24:15 Lydia: Even like like yeah I can't even talk to women. How am I suppose to engage with anybody at work. And it's like we just treat people like people and it's fine and this is the exact same thing it's textbook yeah

0:24:22 Thomas: Just do normal normal stuff yeah and it's also keep in mind if if he's emailing the production team this is him putting on a little show well she's making all this crap up now I don't even know what to do because it'll be made up and used against me just pathetic yeah okay 124

0:24:35 Lydia: Especially with new people on there right if todd black is is new he gets to create the story he wants for someone who wasn't involved from the beginning so irritating right

0:24:48 Thomas: Yeah this is something that he doesn't give us any proof of but he says before returning to production lively had even more script notes and changes beyond what was was already performed during phase one of production. So in that email, it did, you know, that's what I was saying. Like he claimed she did the script thing. That wasn't any part of her demands. And also he didn't provide any proof of this at all. Maybe it happened, but yeah, I don't know. We don't have any proof. So that feels kind of bullshitty to me. Like if he's providing all this other documentation and then he's like, she had all these demands for the script, but he doesn't document that. Like, I don'T know.

0:25:22 Lydia: Not even in the exhibit either like you look at the exhibit and it jumps from january 5th 2024 when production resumed to February 22nd when he is beginning his edit so if there were things in which like she changed the script you would think that it would be documented

0:25:34 Thomas: Yeah. You would think they're not not in person. You know, they're not talking in person about it. The only thing he has is in 126, it says, as producers continued to request the final shooting script, as they were just four days before commencement of filming, Baldoni worked hard with very limited time to rework the script and direction to meet Lively's demands. Well, what though? Recognizing that they, quote, would be in a negotiation for what the final script looks like. Lively demands continue to cause additional work. Yeah, well, don't sexually harass. It was a lot of work to not sexually harass, like whatever.

0:26:08 Lydia: Yeah and well and then his proof for this is January 1st before the January 4th meeting by the way

0:26:15 Thomas: Yeah. Small rewrites. Sounds like small rewriters. Yeah, you're not having this child orgasm. You're not.

0:26:16 Lydia: Hey buddy unfortunately it looks like we're not going to be able to send anything until Thursday night or so I'm not quite sure how to handle but I'm doing these small rewrites and I'm going to Be sending back to the producers and all And then they are going to send it to Blake. And then we will be in a negotiation for what the final script looks like. Small rewrites. And Blake is probably just looking at it, making sure like, oh, you're not trying to insert an orgasm. Yeah. I don't think it's significant. I do not think it is anything that is actually going to cost any money.

0:26:44 Thomas: So yeah, I think they're trying to pull a fast one with the 98 % of what she wants, you know, like make that I think, I don't know, I guess that was in the email. So who knows? But I feel like people are kind of meant to take away like, wow, she got 98 % Of the script was like, these are small rewriting. It might be like three things.

0:26:51 Lydia: Yeah, yeah.

0:27:04 Thomas: All right. Well, that's all we get. That's all the proof we get we don't get anything from her, which makes me think that her demands are the ones we already know about that we see in the 17 point list. And it's just a little stuff around like, make sure these little sex things don't happen or whatever, you know, just like minor things. And he says small rewrites, he even says it himself in his own document. So that's that I think they needed to try to bolster that to make the film takeover thing. And I actually think at this point, it's highly likely they were already working on their excuse being the takeover, because that's that's what you would have to say. Like in that moment, as you're embarrassed by how fucking dog shit your set has been and all this complaints.

0:27:04 Lydia: That is it. I know. No. Right. It's embarrassing. Yeah. A hundred percent.

0:27:42 Thomas: Yeah. And right away, they're probably going to point to like, well, she just wanted control. She just wanted to control the stuff.

0:27:55 Ad: [Ad break 2 — ad music]

0:27:55 Thomas: OK, so let's see where we go from here.

0:27:57 Lydia: Yeah, we get details about the January 4th meeting, which we talked about.

0:28:00 Thomas: List of grievances read aloud by Lively that were as troubling as they were fictional. We've kind of gone through this. It's the meeting, the Ryan Reynolds yelling. It's the person saying that I've never seen that before in my life, you know, that kind of stuff. And 131, I mean, he keeps trying to say there's been some switcheroo with the 30 list of items, but I don't think she ever said that.

0:28:21 Lydia: Also, I can't remember if we, I imagine we've done this, where we compared the 30 point and the 17 point. And it's that, I think so, the 30 point just enumerates different examples that are summarized. Like the 17 point is prepared by lawyers the 30 point is blake being like I felt this when you did this right like it's very much it's a more like personal and explicit examples right

0:28:27 Thomas: Oh my God, we did, didn't we? I'm pretty sure we did. It'S just a little bit more. Yeah.

0:28:41 Thomas: Yeah, well, it's no, no, actually now I'm remembering the 17 is more forward focus. So the 17 IS more like, like, don't do this. Don't do this. The 30 is more like, here's why we're saying that. It's more like remember when you pretended to talk to my dead dad, you know, like that shouldn't be that shocking that that exists when there's a demand saying, stop talking to my dead dad going forward.

0:29:06 Thomas: So crazy. I love how he has no response to that, you know, cause yeah, it's weird shit he's doing. Like it's, and it's you wouldn't make that up. That's nothing that she would make up. There's nothing anyone would think of to make up out a whole cloth.

0:29:15 Lydia: Yeah well and it's interesting too because in this paragraph 131 it says though lively crd complaint misleadingly suggests the parties agreed to a list of 30 items many of the items listed on the crd complainant were new entirely based on lies and neither read nor nor provided to any of the parties, let alone agreed to.

0:29:29 Thomas: What? I don't think that's true.

0:29:32 Lydia: Well, if she read you the 30 point list in the meeting, then yes, it was read to you. Like, I don't think there is anything that I can recall anyway, and I'm happy to be corrected on this, but I can't recall anything that happened within the CRD complaint.

0:29:42 Thomas: It also doesn't, it it just doesn't matter.

0:29:49 Lydia: Right, exactly. You can allege whatever you want when you are making a CRD complain. It doesn't have to be that you forewarned the other parties in detail in advance. You could be like, oh, and also this claim. I'm like, that's perfectly acceptable. So but I also don't think that she did.

0:30:05 Thomas: I'm trying to find the CRD complaint.

0:30:07 Lydia: Yeah, because they lead with 30 point list

0:30:09 Thomas: Discuss in detail the inappropriate conduct. And she's saying after the list below was reviewed and discussed in its entirety, all parties present agreed that the outline conduct would cease.

0:30:18 Lydia: By way of the signature that they already provided on the return to production list in November.

0:30:23 Thomas: Yeah so yeah and it's not that different. We've gone through this before. One is no more showing nude videos or images of women including producer's wife to BL and or her employees. Yeah that's covered. Pornography addiction, covered. Personal experience with sex, covered Times physical consent was not given, that's covered Descriptions of their own genitalia, that is different, I think, right?

0:30:45 Lydia: Yeah, that that's not spelled out by the lawyers in the 17 point list.

0:30:47 Thomas: Yeah, that interesting It also probably already like is covered enough by like don't talk about No more jokes or disparaging comments

0:30:52 Lydia: Yeah, right. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Missing the H .R. meeting. Right. We talked about that.

0:30:57 Thomas: Yep, yep Oh, this has the weight stuff She's representing that this was discussed at the meeting They agree that this, that she had this at the meet So I don't know what the disagreement is here other than they're trying to make some sort of thing out of like, well, we only we only were this shitty. We're only were 17 shitty, not 30 shitty, but not really. Yeah, we did cover this because I did an episode name when that was that.

0:31:21 Lydia: I guess I just want to say, OK, so you didn't sign a thing saying that you wouldn't talk to her dead dad. OK. Fine. But you signed a thing saying you're not going to sexually harass or retaliate in response to any of this. And then you did. So here we are.

0:31:36 Thomas: Not only that, it was that the signature came after this, right?

0:31:38 Lydia: I think so. Yeah, there's a Dropbox sign ledger basically sent for signature 1 -19 -20 -24. So it was after the meeting.

0:31:46 Thomas: Yep. Two weeks after the meeting.

0:31:48 Lydia: Yep. Viewed and signed the same day. Within two minutes of when it was sent.

0:31:51 Thomas: Well, but they sent it before that.

0:31:53 Lydia: They did. They They did.

0:31:53 Thomas: But this is like the Dropbox signed version, probably.

0:31:56 Lydia: And here's the other thing, too. So he signed this after they had already resumed production. So here's a good faith effort by Lively that they've had this meeting, this discussion, and parties agreed to this. She didn't say, like, I'm waiting for your signature before I step on set again. Yeah. Yeah, she was like, I will engage in post -production because we've had this conversation.

0:32:11 Thomas: Yeah,. Like with the nudity writer thing yeah yep yep

0:32:18 Lydia: I've laid my cards on the table. You know where I stand. And this is what what I expect, and engaged in good faith and participated in two weeks worth of filming.

0:32:20 Thomas: Wait are you sure it says as lively admits filming resumed the following day but it says

0:32:31 Lydia: Yeah. January 5th. That's what it says in the exhibit. It says January 5 to February 9 is when they did phase two.

0:32:38 Thomas: Oh okay okay the uh the narrative kind of because it talks about the january 19th thing and then it says the next day so

0:32:45 Lydia: Yeah, yeah. No, it's the following day from the meeting. Yeah? Yeah.

0:32:46 Thomas: It made it seem like it was that oh okay gotcha I wonder if that's intentional I mean it's a minor thing but Yeah, okay, yep. It was good after that—after we were forced to fucking sign something that's so embarrassing and so damning—lawyers were involved. After we were forced to stop sexually harassing, at pain of legal action, we stopped sexually harassing. Congratulations, quote.

0:33:07 Lydia: Now I have a question in paragraph 131, where it says, you know, the only document presented to the parties was the 17 point return of production demands presented on November 9 and signed over over two weeks after this meeting on January 19th.

0:33:19 Thomas: -unquote meeting because now we're denying it was a

0:33:20 Lydia: Yeah, like, quote-unquote meeting. Do they think that's a gotcha for Blake? That, like—that they didn't send it over sooner for signature? Or what?

0:33:25 Thomas: Meeting. I, I don't know man I think they're trying to make hay out of they're try to make it seem like she's being deceptive and really when you look at it it's entirely intelligible from the standpoint of well here's a list of things not to do going forward here's the behaviors we're making another another list for the meeting. That's like, here's the example, the more tangible examples. Like if you, if you went into a meeting with no tangible examples of the things you're talking about, they're going to be like, never, you know, like that's not going to work. So the 30 point list is what presumably she discussed as the reason for all this shit.

0:34:03 Thomas: It's just not really like a deception. There's nothing going on here that really matters.

0:34:07 Lydia: Yeah, and I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the 30 -point list is what she started with when she was discussing with her lawyers. And she was like, hey, here's everything that's been going on. And then the lawyers distilled it into the 17 -point lists.

0:34:17 Thomas: Possibly could be. Yeah. Now that it let's read 133 and then we'll go into f here

0:34:26 Lydia: Now that Lively had unleashed Reynolds on Baldoni and Wayfarer, you know, actually, I don't disagree with that word choice. It does feel like Ryan Reynolds definitely feels like a person that you could unleash. Yeah. Yeah. Kind of a part of.

0:34:33 Thomas: So funny he's like juggernaut from the x -men movies that he's kind of a part of they don't keep

0:34:42 Lydia: They felt powerless to oppose the couple.

0:34:44 Thomas: Going powerless we could take on one of them but with both their powers we can't do

0:34:48 Lydia: Yeah. Just as Lively Had warned in April 2023, nine months before, Reynolds would ensure that Lively's demands were met at every turn because he's her dragon, right? That's what that has to do.

0:34:55 Thomas: It what's that about that's what that fucking has to do oh come

0:35:01 Lydia: I'm pretty sure that's that's what that's referring to.

0:35:04 Thomas: On keep going this is so

0:35:06 Lydia: From then on, Lively would get her way or else. Unmistakably, Lively would use her carefully constructed paper trail to destroy Wayfarer, Heath, Baldoni and the film. Why is there a dash there?

0:35:09 Thomas: Good or else she would hold me accountable for the sexual harassment I did oh my god dude I don't know I don'T know wafer heath baldoni

0:35:22 Lydia: Just from like a like a sentence construction perspective. I don't get that.

0:35:27 Thomas: M dash or whatever you call it in the thing in the film yeah it doesn't make any sense all right but what's the next thing which is the next things she

0:35:28 Lydia: Yeah. And the film Lively completes her usurpation of the

0:35:36 Thomas: Does phase five let's see how it went yeah phase

0:35:39 Lydia: Film phase F. F. Well,

0:35:42 Thomas: Up oh it's this is the editing we've done how am I stuck in a time loop I don' t know we' ve done everything so many fucking

0:35:47 Lydia: I think I think they've talked about this in The New York Times, right? Because The New York times was their first the first attempt at this. Yeah, that's probably true, too.

0:35:51 Thomas: Times well no I think we talked about this in this one already I don't

0:36:01 Lydia: God, I can't remember. Listeners, do you guys remember?

0:36:02 Thomas: T think the New York Times had this edit based stuff like I don't think it went into that detail yeah listeners are you outside the time loop can you see

0:36:06 Lydia: I know. I feel like we're in a cave and we're not allowed out.

0:36:08 Thomas: Us we're in like a weird magical thing that they can see us in there just like going over this complaint over and over they're like god those poor souls they're stuck going over the same two fucking things we're not even half we're not we're a fourth of the way through the fucking third of theway through

0:36:14 Lydia: I know over and over and to be cursed with a memory that like will not allow them to know whether or not they've talked about this before.

0:36:26 Thomas: Yeah yeah so this is about the editing stuff I mean again if you think it's a big gotcha that the woman who forced you with with lawyers to not sexually harass her was then like, well, I guess I can be in the edit bay with you. Is that a big gotcha?

0:36:40 Lydia: Mm -hmm. Mm -huh.

0:36:42 Thomas: It's just not the gotcha you think it is. You know, like it just isn't.

0:36:44 Lydia: Yeah, it's the same tired, tired, tired, tired things that we see in all Me Too cases.

0:36:50 Thomas: Yep, we're all workplace harassment. Well, after she was okay being in a meeting with me. Yeah, because it was fucking work and she had to.

0:36:56 Lydia: Because it's work and she had to and she had to get it done and she wanted to make sure that you weren't trying to sneak in naked stuff of her potentially.

0:37:04 Thomas: Oh, maybe, but also I think this is more about just like, I personally just think she doesn't think he's very talented and the movie's going to suck. Like, to be honest with you, I think that there's not for nothing and I would feel the same way. Like this is a very important project. I've said it before. All right. So, she wants to edit or get in the editing process we've for sure covered this before god yeah

0:37:23 Lydia: Here's the other thing. We have an element here that I don't know that we've talked about before. In 135, it says, Lively requested through producer Todd Black. So here we have a mediator. Where if she's being wholly unreasonable he's in a position to potentially advocate on behalf of wayfarer as well right and like mediate the situation come to an agreed -upon solution if it's lively extorting wayfarers you don't extort through this independent party like they're not they're nichtorting

0:37:52 Thomas: Well also hold on not only that if part of the claim is like oh she's totally fine being in thing why is she speaking through a producer todd black she

0:37:59 Lydia: Right rather than talking to them directly yeah yeah and we saw that with jamie as

0:38:11 Thomas: Was totally fine having someone tell me stuff like yeah maybe because she doesn't want to fucking talk to you

0:38:16 Lydia: Well like the text conversation where she's like anything you need to say can you know go go through my lawyers she's done she's done yeah this is so gross to me moving on in 135 just towards and notably despite her allegations that Baldoni made her uncomfortable Lively insisted on working closely with him through this process and we get some text messages

0:38:28 Thomas: Yeah I don't I don'T really I mean all he has is proof is blake lively's response to his thing saying hey thank you for the note I appreciate it. I'd love to be in the passenger seat with you as soon as possible. I don't need you to formally present anything. I understand you've just seen the first assembly and have a mountain ahead of you.

0:38:45 Thomas: I'll be invaluable to you in recall alone as you put together what you're looking for. I've also been rewatching all the dailies, tons of nuanced gems. The sooner we put our heads together, the better. Very excited to dive back into the work. Let me know. So she wants to be involved. She wants to do it.

0:38:57 Lydia: There and just to be clear the message that she's responding to Justin's message here says what I would love to do is bring you in on the 18th and have us work together until you leave then once you're in Italy this is for another simple favor simple favor to as things progress you can jump in on any free days or even on days you have a long wait between scenes I'm also happy to send you progress scenes etc with any big changes that are made as we all know things change all the time during a cut so he's again what we saw with the writing we're seeing it here too he is saying like you are part of this you are collaborating with me and even though I know you have another project here are all the ways that you can still contribute even when you're on your other project. It's not shut down. This is a collaborative effort and he's done nothing to indicate it's not going to be collaborative.

0:39:37 Thomas: Maybe I should have read that because I was trying to get through it. But now I agree because he says, Blank and I, which is Todd, I think, because it already says elsewhere, Blink and I had a great chat the other day and he let me know you'd like to come into the edit before you leave. And I think that's a great idea. I agree that we work very well together.

0:40:03 Thomas: And with all you've put into this film, yeah, OK, he didn't have to say that, didn't have to sit. And once again, that's interesting, because once again we get the text the day before with the editors where he's like completely telling a different story. So editor one just checking in hope you're hanging in there we're going to get through this damn it justin baldoni thanks for checking in I've sat with it and I think the best path forward spiritually and what's best for the movie is that I suck it up and let her in I sent a message requesting that it start on the 18th oh so it's that day I guess oh wait it's in better quality in the complaint itself stupid suck it off and let erin I've sent a msg requesting that start on 18th and then we would just let er in until she leaves and then her cuts and updates oh I think he missed send and then send her cuts and updates throughout the process. I'll let you guys know what she says. Thanks for being awesome, Dream Team. Hmm, that doesn't sound that bad. We got you, Editor 2. Editor 1, I think that sounds like a very good plan on all fronts. Side note, I offered for her to join on the 18th, and she replied she would like to join now because she will be invaluable to me as she knows every take. I'm going to stick to the date and see how that goes and what comes next. Editor 1. Oi, Editor 1 and Editor 2, stick to it. Editor 1 when you get a moment, could I please get a deal?

0:41:11 Thomas: Okay. All right, well, that's him saying I'm gonna stick to it. So what happens?

0:41:11 Lydia: Okay if we have anyone who is still listening that is team Baldoni in all of this if you're still listening at the very least can you admit that he is the fakest person in the world? Can you at least admit that if nothing else he is so freaking fake god it like drives me insane yeah

0:41:29 Thomas: Yeah yeah then he includes a text exchange with the dream the editing team that's nothing I don't even know what this is supposed to be it's like completely reasonable oh here's how we should prepare for maybe working with blake and they're like cool I don t okay I didn't know what this is

0:41:54 Lydia: I don't know either unless it's like where they're trying to find ways to limit her influence there on the next side by side for Blake should I say 930 to 3 each day and that gives you guys three hours for extra notes and other things or 10 to 3 yeah 10 that gives us wiggle room for any powwows don't even get me started before we meet with her either works for me it would be be good to have time before and after is what they say

0:42:06 Thomas: That's more time yeah so it's more times so they're just like working with her I don' t know what the point of that is uh okay I remember reading this before though Paul Daly incorporated seven pages of her notes into his edit at the very start and consistently kept her involved in every subsequent edit despite having absolutely no obligation to do so Lively was not satisfied with merely collaborating with the director she wanted to be the director well it's already directed she was editing it's a little bit different it's actually a different credit in

0:42:39 Lydia: So yeah no I actually kind of like in this text they're doing like computer spying because it says from blank this is editor one to justin from blank fyi blake started watching movie at 8 30 a .m today on pics she did not watch it this weekend and justin says yes she just texted she was starting but but that is oh god wow, that is such like a workplace thing.

0:42:43 Thomas: Fact huh she texted she was yeah okay yeah

0:43:07 Lydia: You're trying to catch somebody you don't.

0:43:07 Thomas: And the editor's trying to snitch and importantly, she hasn't lied, which is kind of funny.

0:43:12 Lydia: Yeah. It's so interesting too, because like the texts that they show in the narrative on page 78, for example, folks are following along the second part of page 78. There's a text March 14th, 2024 paired with April 18th, 2024. And I think like the casual reader is not looking at dates that are assigned there. Like you kind of read it as like a steady flow of things. So So just keep that in mind, folks, if like if you're reading along with us, that those are things that are very important. A lot can happen in a month, just going to say. This is actually interesting because if you skip to Jamie's reaction avatar here that he has, where it's like the person not wanting to look, but kind of looking through their fingers, you know, and then Justin says it is a sprint. Someone needs to tell her she doesn't get it. And I'm sure thinks I don't get the fact that she's not promoting it until she gets what she wants. It's like a cordial Mexican standoff where the fighting is going to happen behind the scenes. But then you, like, look at the messages that he sent to Jamie, and it's mostly Baldoni wall of text.

0:44:16 Lydia: There's very, very little that Blake has said. And so what are they reacting to there?

0:44:16 Thomas: Yeah, it's funny. It's so weird. I don't fucking know. This is this. I've been we've edited out 40 minutes of just sitting here being like, what are they trying to prove with any of this? There's an exchange where she's like, hey, we'd love to hop on with you in the music supervisor today to share context and intentions. It's nothing. Oh, I'm out of whatever. It's not. Okay. Okay.

0:44:23 Lydia: The only thing that she said. Yeah. Yeah. Only time I'm unavailable to talk about this is from this time to this time. Two -hour time slot, by the way.

0:44:43 Thomas: And then 50 years of Baldoni texts, which we can't read because they're unreadable. They're like all blurry. We can kind of read some of it, but it's not, there's nothing really. And she says that works great.

0:44:56 Lydia: And then Justin and Jamie have this conversation after. And I don't get it.

0:44:59 Thomas: After that, it's a sprint. The whole, I don't understand. It's like they do this weird thing where whatever she says, they're like, yeah, she's going to murder us or something. You know, it'S like, what? Also, she didn't say anything. It was all him. But it sounds like, okay, this is where like, if we even want to go ahead and grant just for fun at this point, Grant Baldoni's version of whatever's happening here. And let's say it's her threatening to not promote the film. Now, here's what's interesting. Actually, yeah, let's read that here because now I'm on the timeline, the exhibit, March 15th. Baldoni, keeping in mind Lively's threat to not promote the movie, continues to encourage Lively to share thoughts with him.

0:45:39 Thomas: Once again, his hands are tied. She's making him tell her to share these thoughts. It's just all the time. He just has no ability to shut the fuck up and not actively encourage her anyway share thoughts with him and the editors while keeping her updated on progress all in an effort to keep her happy in the text he also shares a comprehensive working update of the film based on the notes lively provided so I want to note something if the whole again alex jones conspiracy theory about blake which it's bullshit but just once again in case we have like one baldoni listener if the whole plan is she's trying to take over the film why did he say the threat is to not promote the the film because that sure is detached from anything else that could have happened if there was no sexual harassment if there was no 17 point list there's no anything at all she could just say well this thing sucks I'm not going to promote it unless you know and maybe she again maybe she'd be an asshole you can you're free to think that maybe she would be oh she's exerting too much control whatever but the threat is to not promote it the threat does not well keeping in mind that she had made up all these accusations and she's gonna she's told me I'm gonna go to the new york times with my accusations. No,

0:46:46 Thomas: It's not connected to that at all. It's not because he knows it's not. She knows it'S not. It's not connected to that. Now, he can say he's like maybe feeling and it might be a human thing to do, a sexual harasser thing to do, to feel a little bit of pressure to keep her more happy than you might have otherwise because you sexually harassed her. That's kind of on him, though. Like, I don't know. It still seems that it's fully within his ability to draw lines in places and to say, ah, no, we're going to go with this. And he just doesn't do it. He can say that he, well, I was so afraid, but you never tried it. You don't, he never, okay, correct me if I'm wrong. And we'll keep this in mind. Here's what I want to, I wantto know. Is there any place where he says, no, I just don't want to do that. And she's like, well. Oh, what's that Megan Chewy? Hold on.

0:47:34 Thomas: What were you saying Baldoni? Oh, I've got, oh yeah. I've done all kinds of things to say about my experience. That never happens. Never happens there's never a time where he even tests the theory he just says this is why I believe it's retconned he may have been feeling some amount of pressure given the fact that he sexually harassed her but he never tests that theory

0:47:40 Lydia: That never happens yeah well and I was thinking about it too and I was like man they were still texting here and there about stuff I never see anything that where she says that there's a threat to not promote the film yeah nothing nothing that you could

0:48:01 Thomas: Sure would be a shame yeah none of that never one time now you can say that and I've said this a million times I'll say it a million one if you want to say she's an asshole she's a diva she's whatever for saying hey I want this film to have a little bit of my touch on it here I want to go certain ways in the edit or I'm not promoting it now

0:48:06 Lydia: Even potentially tie to it yeah she wouldn't be the first in hollywood to do that yeah

0:48:23 Thomas: Wouldn't be the first in Hollywood to do that by the way if you didn't want her to do that what's the contract that you signed with her what did it say did you maybe not negotiate a good enough contract or did she negotiate because she specifically wanted this freedom to be able to do this I don't know that's kind of on fucking you you don't get to pretend to be some naive child just with a heart of gold doing Hollywood stuff this is Hollywood stuff this is how they do it this is what happens all the time yeah and if you want to say well I guess she's not gonna promote it well then I don't know maybe that wouldn't even be that big of a deal I don't know. I don't know how much her individual promotion mattered relative to what really matters. I think is like the studio budget and buying ad space and previews and stuff like and ads and all that. It doesn't matter that much if she's fucking tweeting it, you know, it does a little bit, but it's not like,

0:48:46 Lydia: For better for worse right yeah well here's the thing too it's it's like I have never seen as much press tour for anything as I did when we had been prepping for this stuff. And part of that is because we're like seeking it out. But like I was reflecting on it. I was like, I don't know that I've ever seen press tour stuff in the moment for anything.

0:49:24 Thomas: No, I never see it ever

0:49:25 Lydia: I always see it after the fact. Like, oh, look at this terrible answer that, you know, the super cut of things that Ben Affleck looking depressed.

0:49:31 Thomas: Because it's unimportant. It's absolutely unimportant, that's my point. What is important is previews, commercials.

0:49:33 Lydia: You know, I never see that stuff. Yeah. Yeah. No.

0:49:40 Thomas: That's all stuff you just buy and do. You don't, I don't think you need her permission really for like any of that. I mean, there might be, I guess if there could be something in the contract about that, but I don't. So like, that's even not, not even that big of a threat. I don'T think like it's a threat, but it's not, you know, she also wants the movie to do well. I think this is like, again, his inability to draw boundaries if he wants to, his inability to be a director and fucking just take control and do what he wants, or maybe she has good ideas and she's doing it. He seems to kind of talk out of both sides of his mouth.

0:50:09 Thomas: So we can't really be sure what the truth is here. Cause he tells her that these are great ideas and okay, good. Good. And then he tells the editors, yeah, shit talks are, but the editors seem fine for the most part with it. Like they're kind of like, keep in mind, this is their boss too.

0:50:09 Lydia: And then he shit talks her. Yeah. Yeah

0:50:23 Thomas: So it's not as though you get to read him talking to the editors as that's the gospel truth because they are working for him. And if he's unhappy with them, they get fired. So if he was like, oh, she wants us to do this. They can be like, Oh man, boy, that sure sucks. Anyway, we could probably do it this way. And they just do it.

0:50:41 Thomas: You know, there's no, this is not, I'm not saying I know for sure what's in in anybody's hearts here I'm just saying this does not prove fucking shit because it's once again him talking to employees and them kind of agreeing but for the most part like they're pretty cool about all this there's like a little bit where they're like uh you know I want her to just be happy and feel like she's gotten what she needs out of it yeah that's kind of what an editor would do right they would just be like well I want to make sure the person who's telling me what to do is happy

0:51:04 Lydia: Well what else are they supposed to say yeah

0:51:06 Thomas: I know yeah it's like they don't get like they'RE NOT IN CHARGE OF THE

0:51:10 Lydia: Nope they do what they're told they have their marching orders to put together edits and to kind of gather up resources and assets of the scenes that have been shot and that's pretty much

0:51:14 Thomas: MOVIE oh but I started this by making the point that they're not promoting the film I think that just gives away the game Again, it's not about this alleged fake sexual harassment thing. And it seems clear from that that she didn't even need to do that. If her whole ploy was to take over the film, she didn't need to do that, she apparently could just threaten to not promote it. And that was enough for Baldoni to be like, I have no choice.

0:51:40 Thomas: So it's all, it's bullshit in 70 different directions.

0:51:38 Lydia: It right right here's another question if she had threatened to not promote it and they just kind of called her bluff there and then now she's the person that's not involved in the press tour and everybody else is

0:51:51 Thomas: Good point. Yeah. That would have been way better for them. I think that that's bullshit. I just

0:51:53 Lydia: That would have changed the conversation yeah exactly yeah yeah

0:51:57 Thomas: Don't think that's really what's happening. I think that there could be something there, but it's not. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think we should read this just for fun. So they've given us in their own thing. Justin Baldoni says, hi, Blake. This is March 15th. So somewhere kind of in the middle of all this. Let's see. I'll go back to in the narrative of the complaint. We're kind of going back a little bit because of the dates, as you pointed out, they jumped ahead to April.

0:52:00 Lydia: It's grasping at straws it's so

0:52:23 Thomas: And the timeline, yeah, I don't really see anything significant here. So this is just by all accounts, them working together as they like, fine, as they said, you know, and Justin says, hey, Blake, Like, if possible, could you send over your rooftop scene thoughts as we never got to them?

0:52:23 Lydia: Good

0:52:38 Thomas: Stuff coming to you this afternoon. Yes, I was going to tell you that. Yeah, go ahead.

0:52:38 Lydia: Can I read Blake please hey the rooftop is a scene we're going to just have to get in there on it's nuanced and too many things to write down so I put a pin for when we're all together working live an overarching note from memory would be to see lily think and process so we feel what ryle sees and feels as he takes her in. Another way of saying it is, I think the fundamental shift is to consider this. The rooftop is the scene the audience falls in love with the hero. That's the goal of the scene. The goal of The Rooftop isn't the scene where the audience fall in love with our hero's love interest. That will be earned as we go and comes later. The current edit feels like it's trying to achieve the latter.

0:53:25 Lydia: Or maybe both. And that becomes muddled. For a book that that may work, but for a film, this is the hero hook. From top to bottom, the rooftop is the scene from the first word to the last that is Lily's first date with the audience. Keep the sparkle and charm everywhere you can. It infuses much -needed energy. This note will help you tighten other moments, I .e. from Ryle's entrance to ledge. Ledge? It should be quick, shocking, mysterious, and buried. This man is enigmatic, to be fully explained later as we go. I can be more helpful when we're in the avid let's get into it when we can happy to wait until after this preview since it's a mammoth scene I believe there's a cut that crackles and is also much shorter we'll find it

0:53:48 Thomas: Yeah. Right, right. Yeah. Wow. It sounds like he's doing like this is about Ryle and how amazing he is. And she's like, hey, maybe maybe you don't have it be about like the abuser and just entirely by the abusing. Maybe she'd be about the like, you know, the main character of the movie. So yeah, that could, I mean, I think this explains a lot of maybe what her motivation is. Like he might've been doing a shit job.

0:54:11 Lydia: Yeah no she's got it figured out she knows she yes that's a different movie then make a different movie justin baldoni yeah yeah yeah

0:54:32 Thomas: Yeah. Does that all sound like Blake centric?

0:54:34 Lydia: I totally agree I love her response there well

0:54:35 Thomas: I mean you, you could argue that it's like, oh, well she just wants her character. It's a main fucking character.

0:54:39 Lydia: And here's the other thing too this is like a master class in providing constructive feedback he needs to take a lesson from this I love everything yeah yeah exactly she's like hey this is kind of what I'm seeing in the edit and this is why I think it's not working

0:54:48 Thomas: She didn't say, well, I, man, I love your enthusiasm anyway. Sit down. I'll give you an edit. It yeah and

0:54:59 Lydia: And it's not that we're not going to get it

0:55:02 Thomas: She's talking about them working together later yeah it's not my way or the highway

0:55:04 Lydia: Right so like to find this exactly this is just like it's such a well well -done text message about what she's trying to get across here.

0:55:07 Thomas: Totally reasonable yeah it honestly feels like she just knows what the fuck she's doing way better than

0:55:15 Lydia: Yeah. Yeah. Maybe it should be her movie.

0:55:17 Thomas: Justin yeah yeah

0:55:26 Ad: [Ad break 3 — ad music]

0:55:26 Thomas: And we are leaving it there for now that was really interesting like I'm still thinking about just how insightful she is on the edit and I'm not saying I don't know I'm saying she's an all-time film talent or anything I think this is good insight but I think more than that, more than just like even if it weren't perfect artistic insight, even if it were just like, okay, artistic insight. What it is is 100 % focused artistic opinion.

0:55:52 Thomas: You know, it's like, here's what she's doing here. She is giving her earnest artistic opinion, which sounds pretty good to me. I don't know that like what the cut was before, but it seems insightful. It seems pretty good. And even if it were bad or something, it's not her saying, I want to take over the film I'm better I need the it's like very detailed point -by -point artistic analysis that is clearly her motivation here like she wants to make a better movie

0:56:17 Lydia: All in service of the storytelling. It's not in service of Blake Lively, the person, or the character that she's playing. It is clearly in service of the story that they're trying to tell, which they should be united on, which clearly they were not. But I'm happy that we spent so much time on that piece of this. And so I guess ultimately, thank you to the Wayfair parties for including this entire appendix.

0:56:38 Thomas: All this evidence that isn't good for you

0:56:41 Lydia: Yeah, it was really interesting to kind of see the behind the scenes on that piece of it and kind of how Blake Lively, the actress, the actor, approaches the producer, the creative individual, and how

0:56:46 Thomas: Thanks the producer even the editor yeah yeah

0:56:54 Lydia: She approaches her craft. I just found that from like a, sort of like a meta perspective, like just really interesting too. So it humanized her, I think, for me.

0:57:04 Thomas: I think it's just so clear that this is pretty much entirely retconned bullshit like there's it's retcon from something it's not retconmed from nothing but it's also like by the way keep in mind the normal base ace level sexism in that when a woman talks for 10 minutes in a meeting, people think she talked for an hour. There's those studies where it's like, if women... I don't remember the actual numbers, but it's depressing. It's sad. But it's something like they talk for essentially far less and are perceived to have talked for far more. And so think about that vis -a -vis relative to this perception that she's taking over the movie, even to the extent that that was genuine. I mean, and it might have been genuine because in a company dominated by no talent, ass clown men, a woman talking for five minutes might be perceived as 50 minutes. You know, I don't know. And so I think it's just so clear that there might have been some there there in terms of people thinking or feeling like she was taking control too much. Clearly, Alex Sachs expressed something like that. So I'm not saying that didn't exist, but I think it's just blown out of proportion of what it is because the times that he's like, oh my God, I just in the complaint. He's like, I knew, I feared for my life and the lives of my children if I put up any fight. And then the next paragraph will be like, anyway, I told her I wasn't going to go along with that.

0:57:22 Lydia: Yep. Yep. Mm -hmm. Yeah. Mm hmm.

0:58:19 Thomas: And her text will be, like, okay, sounds good. Like, it's just nothing. Like, you're just trying to make a fake storyline out of something. Like, imagine if whatever your worst text fight was or something, you could, like. Just write a dissertation on every message and how you were right and they were wrong. And, like present it to people that way. Like, yeah, you could come up with some pretty bad shit easily worse than this. I could do better than this, actually.

0:58:21 Lydia: OK, I understand. Yeah. God. Also, you'd be the worst person at a party if that's the kind of person that you are. Jesus Christ.

0:58:47 Thomas: Yeah, well, that's every lawyer. So that's why they're the worst person, literally the worst people at parties.

0:58:51 Lydia: I think that's a great point, though. And like if you had people who are purportedly feminist and an ounce of humility, I feel like they would have been able to actually reflect on this experience in a way that could have been really eye opening, taking into account the research that's been done about women in spaces where they're not necessarily expected to or allowed to have power. And then when they do, how disproportionate that is. I think that's really interesting and could have been so, so great for Justin Baldoni's brand, honestly. Like even just from a marketing perspective, like just I don't care about you as a person, but if you want to keep building that brand, that would have been great, too. But no, we're not there.

0:59:28 Thomas: Maybe I'm not sure. I'm not sure you could get out of it that smoothly, but possibly. But anyway, there's more of this to go through. And like we said at the beginning of a few episodes ago, we'll see how like when we transition over to like a half and half approach, I think we need to get through this complaint. So we'll see how much more there is, including the fact that we're probably can skip a lot of it since it's the New York Times stuff that we've gone through.

0:59:51 Thomas: We'll see. You'll be the first to know if you're on patreon .com slash gavel pod. All right. Thanks for listening, gavelinos. Gavel out. Gavel up. No, we're gaveling out. No, We're done. We're putting away our gavels for a moment. Gavel down, everybody. Gaveled down. Lower your gavel. Gavel it down.

0:59:59 Lydia: Gabble up I don't know like suit up oh okay oh we okay Gavel down

1:00:34 Thomas: Fucking Alex Jones ass bullshit. Yeah, she also didn't request that you stop talking to her dead dad the viewing audience doesn't know whose boob that is How do I do a movie if I can't sexually harass? It's impossible Look