DOD59: Show Me Your Phone

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:28 Tom: To Dear Old Dads, the podcast that's peeping while you're sleeping. I'm Tom Curry. I'm joined as always by Thomas Smith and Eli Bosnick. Hello, gentlemen.

0:00:37 Thomas: We now have a moral obligation to make the show about something else so that Tom sounds like a fucking creep.

0:00:40 Tom: This works! The damn it, you guys.

0:00:40 Eli: Okay. We were going to talk about consent on today's show, and that's the intro Tom wrote, everybody.

0:00:50 Thomas: That's the intro he came up with. This is going to be a weird conversation.

0:00:53 Tom: Oh, God. Someone else has to write these little intro blurbs. I've taken a lot of hate these days, a lot of hate. Oh, I

0:00:59 Eli: Well, get ready for more, Tom, because I would like to predict that this This is one of my favorite episodes of the show. This is going to be a T -T -Tom is crazy episode.

0:01:11 Tom: Don't think so I doubt it I doubt it. I'm curious. Yeah.

0:01:11 Thomas: Is it or is it? Yeah, well, Let's hold on, let's leave that as a teaser, because I need to tell people some personal news. Um, so that's a teaser, don't worry, we're gonna get back to it, but I wanted to tell everybody, because people actually have asked me quite a bit, um, officially got the Kaiser ADHD thing all set up, all good, they're paying, so you know how much goddamn money that's saving me. I was spending so fucking much, it was 150 bucks an appointment, and they have to, they make you do an an appointment every time because you can only get 30 days worth of fucking cocaine, or I had to do that every time. And then the prescription, God, the prescription, so

0:01:29 Eli: Is Oh, yep.

0:01:30 Tom: That's Excellent. Jesus. Christ.

0:01:47 Tom: Wait, so

0:01:48 Thomas: Much money.

0:01:48 Tom: Now you don't have to

0:01:49 Thomas: Now I don't have to do it. Yeah. Now it's all through my actual insurance because that was all out of pocket. So this is all, yeah,

0:01:49 Tom: Do these things Oh, because you went through like one of those like services, like a, like a, Yeah, Right, Right, right.

0:01:57 Thomas: I had two. Yeah, so it was

0:01:59 Tom: I gotcha.

0:01:59 Thomas: Fine when it was generic Adderall, but because there, that doesn't exist anymore, you can't get Adderall ever, at least where I am. I had to pay for the fucking designer, goddamn drugs that don't have a generic, and it's unbelievable amounts of money. So, uh, I, but I did it because, you know what, those drugs are really changing my life, like they really are. I, I don't know how, if I've emphasized that enough, how much this has changed my life. It really has. I'm not saying it's cured me, like I still have issues, and if anything, I still, I can have the hyper focus get applied to the wrong things. So that still happens, but I will take that over being completely frozen and unable to do anything, any day. Like, I, it's just, it gives me such a better energy for life and for doing things. Like, it's so much better. I cannot tell you. So, bit of happy news there.

0:01:59 Tom: Right. This is a great cocaine commercial, by by the way. This is an outstanding, this episode of Dear Old Dads brought to you by cocaine. Cocaine helps Thomas Smith produce the show.

0:02:51 Thomas: And that's And And that's why you should attend the magician party that Eli talked about. The bonus bonus story last episode. Make sure you pledged or you missed it. So or wait, what's that? Sorry. No, that was the regular.

0:03:02 Eli: Yes, exactly. No, that Tom story was the bonus story.

0:03:09 Thomas: Oh, that'S why we all should go to the cocaine magician party or whatever the fuck that was that Eli talks about last time.

0:03:15 Eli: Bring your kids, everybody, buddy, they can offer to fuck me.

0:03:18 Thomas: And one more bit of news. One more. I just want to say that I've already forgotten like eight times. And that's why I'm insisting now, because it'll be 10 years old by the time this comes out, uh, graduated college, no, um, one more bit of news, uh I talked about the screaming, Remy, Rmy has been fucking hard man, I'm not gonna lie, it's been really hard, he, he well,

0:03:23 Eli: Yeah,

0:03:39 Tom: That's because you had those decoy babies, Thomas Smith. Everybody gets a decoy baby. Everybody gets decoy. It lures you in, and then you think you're a good person, and you're not.

0:03:41 Eli: I want to be clear, I think

0:03:42 Thomas: Arlo but that was Phoebe, I already, Remind you, I am on the third, so I had the decoy baby, because Phoebe was a perfect angel child, amazing, and then I had Arlo, who you know wasn't so I thought I already went through that but but I'm getting another, you only get one good one, so I'm on the second trick baby or whatever, you know, like I got The one good one and then I'm the second fucking kick you in the nuts baby and so I don't remember, I may be that I blocked it out from my mind, but I don't remember the other two being as impossible as this one because he is not only is he teething, he's got like 40 teeth already. My kids are just the fucking predator. It's the weirdest thing. My kids get teeth so early. He's four months. He has like a nine teeth. That's crazy.

Um, only is it teething, he also seems to have like a separation anxiety going. So this means we have a fucking contraption in our house. It like a psychological torture device. Imagine if you had a, like a fucking heavy box that every time you tried to set it down down somewhere, it screamed at you to death.

0:04:06 Eli: It Screamed Yeah

0:04:47 Thomas: Yeah. And you're like, oh, I get, it's like a Sisyphus, you had a Sisyphean boulder, like on your, like strapped to you. And You're like oh I, you're, like oh, I could just set it down here. Nope, you set it, down for one second, the boulder is yelling at, it's worse. Sisyphus is like, ah, thank god, I only have the fucking, the regular, the quiet boulder

0:04:52 Eli: Right But It Yells at you on the way down No Tom Thomas, I remember that that that couple of days where Max went through it as well, I think think it was like it, I think it was maybe even three days and Oh it was Hard on Anna, I

0:05:14 Tom: Dude I

0:05:07 Thomas: Oh Yeah Yep Yep It's it's bad, I'll so I really, it's been three weeks and there are times when I like it, like I want to, you know, sort of how people, I think got a lot out of Tom saying, you know, you had those, or maybe it was Eli, kind of the delayed attachment stuff, I think people connected with that. Now I, I don't have have that. There's no judgment there or anything. I am definitely plenty attached to this baby, but I do want to offer that I have reached levels of frustration and anger that I didn't know I had over this. Like it just, I, so my trigger is noise. Like my trigger is screaming. I don't know what it is. Maybe it's because I have one good ear. My other ear doesn't work and I'm really protective of my ear that actually works. And I work in audio. So it's like double. And I'm just interested in sound and music and like, it's what I care about for those reasons, or maybe just for random reasons, my my trigger point is

0:06:09 Eli: Can't I can't think of any other reasons, just to be clear, I have no other, there's no other a spectrum of reasons, but I can't think of any of them where you would respond to I

0:06:13 Tom: Oh

0:06:16 Thomas: Yep Yeah, you have to be on the spectrum for a blood-curdling scream directly into your ear, otherwise most people are fine with, they're like, I'm, this is nothing to me

0:06:20 Eli: Love It

0:06:23 Tom: Everybody Loves it, everybody Loves it, yeah, this

0:06:24 Eli: I actually Like It Yeah

0:06:24 Thomas: Yeah when I say trigger point, I mean it, I'm incredibly patient with my kids, I'm incredibly patient, this gets me to be like in the range of normal bad parent is what I'm telling you, it's not that I, I don't melt down and crawl under a thing, I just, I get upset, I'm like, fucking stop yelling at me, you know, yeah

0:06:35 Eli: No

0:06:36 Tom: Look I'm

0:06:42 Eli: I know, I'm just, I'm being so, it's funny, uh, after we did the first episode where we talked about the screaming and Anna heard it, cause Anna listens to the show, and it was like, you never got mad when Max screamed. And I was like, yeah, no, I don't remember it bothering me. And she was like, let me remind you. And I, um, I apparently selectively forgot some, She was, um, do you not remember being in a silent tantrum? So this is to make you feel better. I apparently once had a completely silent temper tantrum above Max's crib because he kept spitting out his passy and she watched it on the monitor because Max when he was little needed a passy, and he would spit it out and cry. And I forget what it was the 97th time he had spat out his pasy. And while holding the pack, cause you have to be gentle while very gently holding the passive, right?

0:07:02 Thomas: Yeah Oh my god yep yep yeah you can't dram it in his face yeah exactly yeah

0:07:33 Eli: While very gently holding them as the Anna's just watching me have conniptions with every other part of my body. Just every other, every other

0:07:41 Thomas: Same dude, same, he, Remy's our our only pacifier child, other kids didn't like it, he loves it, and they do the thing where it's exactly what you're describing, there's nothing that gets more on your nerves than like, hey, I know this fucking pacifier makes you happier and for some reason your instinct, Remy, is to spit it out every time or in the process of trying to suck on something because you fucking want a pacifier, you, he'll like reach his hands in there and then his hand will interrupt the pacifier and like pull pull it out. And you're like, so you double wanted to fucking suck on something.

0:07:43 Tom: Yeah

0:08:01 Eli: Don't spit it out, push in hell, I'm

0:08:16 Thomas: And then you, you screwed yourself. Yeah. I'm in hell.

0:08:16 Eli: In hell yep oh and

0:08:16 Tom: Yeah this is why it's a good thing that you can drop them off at the fire station, I'm just I'm just saying like this I'm not even actually 100 kidding because they're like, you can reach a level where a rational, loving, decent person is like, I don't, I don't I don't want to do it

0:08:22 Eli: Yep oh the things I bought

0:08:30 Thomas: Yeah, I want to tell you this. This is hard for me because I genuinely, my identity that I care most about is, is like to my kids. This has really pushed me. I's not going to lie. Like it's, it's when you get screamed at, when you don't get to sleep and you're getting literally screamed, the ringing screaming in your ears the second you set this child down like this, it just it really gets to you like it, it's it's hard, it's fucking hard

0:08:55 Tom: I don't

0:08:55 Eli: And you start you start to self punish for your own thoughts which becomes a spiral right, because you're in your head and they're spiraling, you're like, I fucking hate, oh, Thomas killed himself there, it was, we lost him forever ever sorry

0:08:59 Thomas: Yes sorry I just bumped my desk sorry, yeah, it's just a gunshot, yeah he's like, and now the show is complete and he just disappears, cheers.

0:09:12 Eli: There it is, I found it, everybody no fine, I've done my task, agent Remy, you can stop, Operation Siren, 40-year-old guy puts a cigar in his mouth, man that one took a while, but no, you, I remember being in my head and being like, I fucking hate this, and then the word him, like just poking in some little angel on my shoulder being like, do you hate him, and then me being like, how dare you think such an evil thought what a terrible man you must be, right? All of a sudden Javert starts singing about what a bad dad I am for whatever reason

0:09:39 Thomas: Yeah. Yep. Yep, yep, yep. Yeah, yeah. My version of that, I don't have exactly that, but my version is the thing I talked about the other day where I get mad at him for doing it, where I'm like, in my mind, I'm, like, you're doing this on purpose. Like, there's no, the human mind is not meant to comprehend random acts of screaming in your ear. Like it has to be for a reason. And your brain is like, no, what, what? Why is he doing this? What?

0:09:59 Tom: Yeah yeah

0:10:09 Eli: Yep I

0:10:18 Tom: Well you had other kids, like for me with Amen, like I felt so competent and confident, and then all of a sudden I get this kid, it's like he's just gonna scream, what do I, I'll do this, and why, babies don't just scream, they're just gonna scream, and none of your tricks matter, and none other things you do work, and the kid just of screams all the time and eventually you're just like, all right, well here's the deal, I don't care about you except for legally, until you stop screaming, like until you stopped screaming my heart is a fucking brick inside my and you don't want to feel that way you don't want to feel that way, but it's just like, it's like all right dude, we'll make a deal I'll

0:10:43 Eli: Exactly

0:10:35 Thomas: Yep. Yeah. It's like, seriously. Yeah, it's, you can't, it'S impossible. Yeah! Try, hey, everybody, set, here's what I want, if you don't know what I'm talking about, here'S what I ask you to do. Set off your smoke alarm right now, stand one foot from it, and think, I have to protect and love this smoke alarm with all my heart right now. And do that for three weeks. Just do that FOR THREE WEEKS. And the minute if you go anywhere away from the smoke alarm, it goes off again in your ear, and just think, no, I would be amazingly, perfectly competent on never having a negative thought about the smoke arm, no, you're gonna have some, it doesn't matter how much you love smoke alarms, or the mean, the meaning of your life is the smoke alarm, doesn't mater, you get this one, it's fucking, it's it's killing me and yeah

0:11:05 Tom: Yes

0:11:08 Eli: Don't put it down right and and every TV show is about how much everyone loves their smoke alarms and every book, and you swore to yourself you were gonna love your smoke alarm the most and modeled a tremendous amount of your life about being a good smoke alarm owner, mm

0:11:32 Thomas: And I and I

0:11:42 Tom: And Your last smoke alarm. You just reached out and pressed the button and felt very good about how you understood Oh, you know, I know how to work Look at me, I'm confident with the smoke alarm I'm basically like a smoke alarm whisperer, motherfucker

0:11:47 Eli: -hmm oh

0:11:46 Thomas: Oh, You just uh changed those batteries Yeah, it's good have you tried turning it off and back on?

0:11:55 Tom: Right? You're judgy about other people bitching about their smoke alarms Yeah, dude, I fucking feel you, man

0:11:58 Thomas: Yep yep, yep

0:12:00 Eli: People People offering you advice that you have very obviously already tried is there's always like Is it, am I capable of murder? I'm capable of mass murder. If I had a nuke when Max was spitting his passy out, you'd all be vapor right now, every single one of you. You'd be, be vapor in the wind for the amount of people that were like, try

0:12:06 Thomas: Yes yes well

0:12:07 Tom: Oh, that's great Great. I love that.

0:12:21 Thomas: I look I don't want to call you guys out, but I said it in the fucking chat. I was like, like, I don't try anymore. And I didn't exactly mean that, but it's kind of true because I know, look, I know that this screaming, and this is important. This is actually helpful as a parent. I know the screaming is nothing. I know it's nothing. I know it is anxiety. I have checked everything. Every time. Imagine I have gone through this for fucking, again, it is at least three weeks. It could be months. I don't even remember. Time loses all meaning.

I am in a fucking, you know, I'm in the worst situation. I, time, I check everything, but that diaper, fed, whatever, it's nothing. He doesn't, the issue is his teeth, which you can't solve, you know, he's just having teething, or it's the set, I think more accurately it's a separation anxiety, I don't even know, it might be both, but like, based on how he reacts, I know that it's nothing.

And I know that scientifically the thing that you're supposed to do is do your best, but if it gets to you, you, you put them in a room and you go away.

0:12:27 Eli: Yeah yeah

0:13:18 Thomas: You do because it is better for your child that you don't murder them than it than it is that like you your best. But like I have gone through this so many times with Remy, and this is what I feel guilt about. I've kind of stopped doing the part where I'm like, "Oh, maybe I can soothe him," because I can't. It just, and he's screaming in my face. How many more times am I going to try the Lucy with the football of him piercing my my eardrum to where I don't have any ears left. So I've gotten to the point where I'm just like, "All right, buddy, I got it. Sorry. I got to put you in the quiet room for a little bit." And I feel fucking horrible. I feel horrible about it. It sucks.

0:13:20 Tom: It's the only safe thing to do. Yeah.

0:13:42 Eli: Yeah. Right.

0:13:54 Thomas: So anyway, if anybody had gone through that, I just want to say like, you're not alone. And, um, love him. I don't have any, you know, I'm comfortable psychologically with all of that. I know that it's not my fault. I know that, you know, it's just what it is. I love, I totally do. But I just feel guilt about the feelings of anger I get from this screaming at me. And it's really, it's just got to get through it, you know?

0:14:15 Eli: And and what we're here to say on Dear Old Dads is that you should, right, you're a bad dad and you just haven't tried hard enough. Um, I remember, I just tried, what I did, I remember this so clearly, I just like really thought about it, you know, like really taught about it, and then I figured it out and he was fine he was actually fine you

0:14:31 Tom: Such a dick.

0:14:24 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. You know, there's one more thing I do feel obligated to say, which is this is not, I'm not describing crying. I want to be very normal. Like when he just cries.

0:14:41 Eli: Are describing crying.

0:14:42 Thomas: Yeah? No, I am not. When he just cries, I like, oh, that's the best. It's a vacation. Patient. When he is just crying like a normal baby, I could play a clip. It's, I'm telling you, it's literally like, you know, a horror movie scream of a woman going like it's that, but a baby you that's not crying. It's not the, you know, like that I can take that hurts. It hurts my heart, but that's like, Oh, poor baby. Oh, this is so hard. And it's, you know, I can handle that all fucking day. This is an ear shattering scream that rings. It literally does ear damage. It It's so fucking bad. It's the worst. Just had to clarify. It's not that he's just crying.

0:14:47 Tom: No, you're just screaming. Yeah.

0:15:22 Eli: You're making it up again, I just, I feel like for loyalties. Eventually.

0:15:25 Thomas: But okay, here's the better news. There's better news is the reason I brought this up.

0:15:29 Eli: He'll die smart.

0:15:30 Thomas: No, eventually I'll die. No, here, here's why I brought this up, I was dreading sleep training for this reason, I was like, God, this is gonna be fucking, oh, God is the worst he came and sat him down for a minute, you know, and I kind of was insistent, and I want to take a little bit of parenting credit because I was like, you know, we just need to do this. Like I can already tell that because he does this screaming, we're going to get in a pattern where we're soothing him too much, you Know, and then he'll never be able to sleep on his own, all that shit.

0:15:59 Eli: Yep.

0:15:59 Thomas: And I was like, You know what?

0:15:59 Eli: Smart.

0:15:59 Thomas: We're doing it. I the fucking crib. I put it together, you know, because we're in the bassinet now. But I was, like, no more bassinet. We're done with that shit. No more bassinets next to our bed. I got the monitor, which the kids had broken, like two of of our monitors just from playing with. So I bought a new monitor and I was like, we're doing it. I'm going to follow the fucking rules. I looked up all the rules that we got to follow. And I was just insistent. I was Like, we have to just do this. We have to, because otherwise we're going to die. We Have two other kids to keep in mind. And if one, if this baby is murdering our entire being and taking up all our time, we are not going to be good parents to our other babies. And I Was insistent and you know what fucking happened? Day fucking one. He was perfect. Day day one.

0:16:00 Eli: Smart. Smart. Yep.

0:16:13 Eli: Max.

0:16:39 Eli: Max sleep trained, we. We did wise and Bluth for one day, and one, after one day, and again, I know it's just one kid, I know everyone has. Different experiences.

0:16:40 Tom: Right.

0:16:47 Thomas: It's just luck. This is not, yeah, this is not. Yeah.

0:16:48 Eli: Yep. It's. We. Just. Rolled. Those.

0:16:49 Tom: Yeah, this is not like...

0:16:50 Eli: Dice. But no.

0:16:50 Tom: Right.

0:16:51 Thomas: To make sure I'm not trying to shame anybody whose kid didn't sleep well.

0:16:54 Eli: Course.

0:16:54 Thomas: Yeah, like, yeah.

0:16:54 Eli: Different. Different strokes, strokes different folks, all that. Now, here's where I will say, and you know me, I am the king of we don't care about facts on this show, give your baby a whole bottle of Tylenol, right? Really? Because I don't want to become the show that weighs scientific papers, right? It's why.

0:17:09 Tom: Right. No.

0:17:09 Eli: We let Tom talk about how colleges don't matter or whatever the fuck he thinks, right, lets his kid not take the AP exams, whatever he wants to do, it's fine, we're not here about facts, here's what I will say, the, what the hill I will die on, there's two hills, hitting your kids is bad, there's. No. I.

0:17:23 Thomas: Yep. Oh, that's fine.

0:17:24 Eli: Have, have no compromise about that, all the science is in my favor.

0:17:27 Thomas: 100%. We a show. That's our position. 100.

0:17:29 Eli: The. Other.

0:17:29 Thomas: % no.

0:17:30 Eli: Hill I will die on, and this is something that a lot of people have fallen for, is that sleep training is not bad for your kids, I.

0:17:38 Thomas: It's not, yeah.

0:17:39 Eli: Have done tremendous amounts of research on this, I know the study that people are going to be like, well, have you seen this study, no, that's from a Romanian orphanage where they left kids alone for 12 hours at a time, I'm sorry, you can't.

0:17:51 Thomas: 100.

0:17:52 Eli: Read papers right, but there, I, I need. You to know, because there's a tremendous there amount of shaming, and because of the thing that goes on in parenting communities where they're like, whatever works for you and your family, it opens the door for people to be like, well, what works for me and my family is not neglect and abuse.

0:17:54 Thomas: Yep. Yep.

0:18:10 Eli: And I. Want to say, the official position of Eli Bosnick LLC is fuck those.

0:18:11 Thomas: Yeah. 100.

0:18:17 Eli: People. Fuck them. Fuck them.

0:18:19 Thomas: It's. Exactly like. I love your joke, which I think you told, and it's barely even a joke, of I wish the anti-vaxxers would just admit they don't want to give their kids shots, same. Same fucking people, they just, and I don't blame it hurts, it fucking hurts my heart to leave my screaming or crying baby in another room, it does, every time I do it, I question, I'm like, fuck, is this right? But yes, as you said, scientifically, it's fine. It is. It is fine. And in the long run, it is so much fucking better. The people who don't do this are sleeping with their 16-year-olds and still breastfeeding them because they can't. It's so.

0:18:27 Eli: Yeah.

0:18:54 Thomas: Much better.

0:18:54 Tom: So. Wait. We shouldn't be doing. That still, they. Just.

0:18:56 Thomas: No, no, you shouldn't.

0:18:57 Tom: Fucking. Giant like double family bed kings and. No, that's weird.

0:18:57 Eli: And I And I Want to be clear, I'm not so far the other direction. I'm not saying you must sleep train your child. If you want to sleep in the same bed as your 16-year-old, awesome. My parents never sleep trained me and I had terrible sleep problems all throughout my childhood.

0:19:01 Tom: Yeah.

0:19:17 Thomas: Yeesh.

0:19:17 Eli: I turned out fine, that is a choice that my family made, is what they wanted to do, you may want to do the same thing with your family, that may be your comfort level, there is no judgment here from me, what I'm saying is that we are making the choices for our family, and they are not, and we're not crossing the.

0:19:35 Thomas: Yeah.

0:19:35 Eli: Line into.

0:19:36 Thomas: You're. Not hurting.

0:19:36 Eli: The. The other. Person's.

0:19:37 Thomas: Your. Baby.

0:19:37 Eli: Decisions. Right.

0:19:37 Tom: Right. Yeah.

0:19:38 Thomas: By. By, it's one of those times where you would think it would be like a, oh man, our parents' generation really didn't know anything about kids, and that's mostly true, like it's, it is true that. Like there's a lot of things they fucked up, this isn't one of them, the cry.

0:19:38 Eli: Yeah. Yeah. They.

0:19:51 Thomas: It. Out.

0:19:51 Eli: Just. Got. Lucky.

0:19:52 Thomas: For. One. Night, yeah, they got lucky, they got luck in that the laziest option actually is the best, the option of let your baby cry themselves to sleep is actually a completely viable plan, it is, it.

0:19:52 Eli: Yes.

0:20:04 Thomas: Just is, I don't want to fucking hear it.

0:20:06 Thomas: I'm with you, Eli, on this, it just is, yeah.

0:20:08 Tom: The. Only thing I would add to that, the only thing I want to add to the caveat, that you've got to do that with a baby monitor, like, like, like, I really. Think you've got to do that with a, with a video baby monitor, because some babies and I, and, and Aislinn was this way from what Haley said, some babies will cry until they throw up.

0:20:15 Thomas: Yeah. Yep.

0:20:16 Eli: And. Of. Course, yep.

0:20:24 Thomas: 100.

0:20:24 Tom: So you've gotta, you've Gotta be able to keep eyes on your kid.

0:20:24 Eli: So. Did. Max.

0:20:24 Thomas: % yeah. Totally. Yeah. This. Isn't. Go to. The, you know. Set. Your baby. Down, go to the casino. And let them fuck.

0:20:29 Eli: Yeah.

0:20:28 Tom: Yeah. Yeah. But like, I never had a video babe. I never, I just didn't have one. I never million years old. I didn't, I didn' have a video, baby monitor. So but I would never do this knowing like because of some kids, they'll just they'll cry hard enough that they'll make themselves sick, especially if they're prone to spinning up or whatever.

0:20:30 Thomas: Yeah.

0:20:31 Eli: Oh.

0:20:37 Thomas: They. Didn't. Have of video. Back. Then, yeah, yeah.

0:20:46 Eli: Max. Max. Did.

0:20:48 Thomas: That's. How Jimmy. Hendricks.

0:20:48 Eli: It. Until.

0:20:49 Thomas: Died, yeah.

0:20:50 Eli: Like seven seconds ago, every time Max cried he threw, threw up, so every, he, he would be like, and I'd be like, hey buddy, look, no heroin, you. Want some heroin, you wants a memory, because if he cried for 10 seconds and then I was, then he's still crying and there's vomiting, it was a fucking nightmare, but there's one other thing that I want to say to parents who might be going through this or might be preparing to go through this, because I read it, it's a quote in the book Precious Little Sleep, which I highly recommend, even if you don't want to do sleep training, she's got a bunch of strategies in there that are not, not sleep training based, that are not cry it out based. And I know that's important to a lot of people, but there's a quote in that book that just solidified it for me, which is, your child will cry for a lot of reasons.

0:20:50 Tom: Yeah,

0:21:00 Thomas: Yeah. Yep.

0:21:00 Tom: That's

0:21:34 Eli: In their life. They will cry because they got their heart broken. They will Cry because they lost the big game. They Will Cry because They've Been Moved or Because They've been Betrayed or Because They're Not Popular or Because they're Not Liked. There will be a million reasons your child will cry. And just as you would not prevent them from playing in the big game or prevent them from falling in love, you need to let them cry so that they can learn to self -soothe. You are doing this for your child, not in spite of them. And that quote, man, when I realized like, oh, this is for him, that was the solid steel that I needed. Actually, the solid skill was anapostic because I would have folded in about 10 seconds. But that was That quote was the solid steel that got us through sleep training.

0:22:13 Thomas: Yep. Good, good advice, I will tell you, it's just, I wanted to leave that happy note, he's been great now, and I also will, another.

0:22:27 Tom: Great.

0:22:27 Thomas: Thing, be ready for the regression, and it happened to us on like day three or four, he had a hard night, stick, stick to your guns. That's.

0:22:33 Eli: Yep, stick to your guns.

0:22:35 Tom: Thomas, which is better, the sound of Remy's screaming or the auto ads?

0:22:40 Thomas: The auto ads, I'm sorry, I love the bit, but this is the one time where I'm like, no, I'll give me the auto ads. I don't, I just, I can't go with the bit. There's nothing worse in the world. Than the screaming. Guaranteed.

0:22:49 Eli: But Thomas, Did you know that if you're a patron over at patreon.com/dearolddads, your sleep training too will only take one night. That's right. Guaranteed. Or Thomas will personally PayPal you your money back, your sleep training will take just one night, so.

0:23:01 Thomas: Yeah.

0:23:10 Eli: Uh, head on over to patreon.com forward.

0:23:12 Thomas: You. Don't.

0:23:12 Eli: Slash Dear Old Dance.

0:23:14 Thomas: Want to miss it, we had a great story, Tom had a great story last week, if, um, nothing else, the extendo stories, if you're someone who just for some reason you love auto ads and you're like, I don't have a problem with that, you're still, if you're not a patron, you're missing those stories, Tom had a great one last week that that also, I think, prompted what's hopefully going to be a longer story about it sometime. I can't wait. So, patreon.

0:23:34 Thomas: .com slash Dear Old Dads. And with that said, let's get to the discussion on consent that led Tom to write that opening quote.

0:23:34 Tom: No, it's not a consent, god damn it,

0:23:44 Eli: I think we were going to talk About whether or not we ever walked in on our parents, right? Wasn't that the, isn't, wasn't, not the topic for today, Tom? Tom?

0:23:46 Tom: Oof, ooff, I, okay, all right, all right, we're not talking, you, you're making me out to be insane again, let's, no,

0:23:59 Eli: No, you're going to do that in a minute, Tom.

0:24:00 Thomas: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, Eli set us up because we have a bet going on. This has been like two weeks in real life that Eli and I have been on pins and needles over this.

0:24:01 Tom: I don't think so, I'm really curious, like,

0:24:05 Eli: We have a bet. Yeah. So

0:24:09 Thomas: Going, yeah.

0:24:10 Eli: If I, if I can part the curtain ever so slightly, on a Sunday night at midnight, we all text, "What do you guys want to talk about tomorrow?" That's the, uh, that's the hard work and planning that goes into the pre-program here. Um, so we were like, oh, we should talk about spouses going through each other's phones. And I was like, well, I definitely have an opinion on that. And Thomas was like, I have an opinion around that. And I was like, oh my gosh, I would love to place money on what Tom thinks about spouses going through each other's phones. You

0:24:44 Thomas: Because it's the perfect thing where it could go either way for Tom. We were talking about, we Were joking About, Eli had a good line where he was like, I think Tom could either be like, I don't, I've never seen Hayley's phone. Or it could Be like, every night Tom subjects his

0:24:49 Eli: Get Right. Every Night, before I let her into the house, she Passes her phone through the slot. I download the data, we have it hooked up to a computer which an a Chat GPT monitors For

0:25:01 Tom: No.

0:25:02 Thomas: No. But, but I Think it would Be Tom doing this to himself, though. It Would be more Yeah.

0:25:11 Eli: Yes. To Be Fair.

0:25:14 Thomas: Yeah, he

0:25:14 Eli: It Is it, is Tom doing This To himself. It's Definitely not him doing It, Ailey To

0:25:14 Tom: Doubt. Yeah. Right. Right.

0:25:16 Thomas: Submits Submits His Phone to the Monogamy Monogamator 5000, yeah.

0:25:19 Eli: The Monogamy-Tron 3000. Sure.

0:25:22 Thomas: Yeah. All right.

0:25:22 Tom: All Right.

0:25:24 Thomas: So drum roll. Let's see.

0:25:25 Tom: Well, so I do I keep you On pins and needles longer, like Let you guys have your, do I just give you my, because we're on the same page on this. I would, I would absolutely never go through or ask to look through my wife's phone. Like I would never.

0:25:27 Thomas: Yeah.

0:25:38 Thomas: That, figured that.

0:25:39 Tom: Yeah. Like there was no way I would do that. And if she wanted to see my phone, like make sure like whenever I get a new phone that like it's set up. So like her face will open the phone. Right. So if she picks up my phone and needs it, She can open my phone anytime if she ever wants to look at my phone, she can. But I would be very, like, if she said, like, "I want to go through your text messages," I'd let her do it. I wouldn't hold them back from her ever. But it would be a very, that would lead to a very difficult conversation where I would be very disappointed that I had broken her trust, that made her feel that way.

0:25:41 Eli: An

0:25:50 Thomas: Okay. Here we go. Here we go.

0:26:13 Thomas: Hmm.

0:26:14 Tom: So I would never say no. I wouldn't be like, "No, you can't look through my messages." Like, that's I wouldn't do that, but it would be a huge problem. Wait.

0:26:14 Thomas: Interesting.

0:26:21 Eli: Upsettingly sane take, take, Tom.

0:26:24 Thomas: Yeah Tom, do you mind retaking here? Let's just redo that one.

0:26:25 Eli: Tom. Yeah.

0:26:27 Tom: Can recast.

0:26:27 Thomas: But yeah, can You Be insane? Do you mind, we need

0:26:27 Tom: This Yeah. Yeah.

0:26:27 Eli: No. Just do it. I'm just gonna get a clap in, just get a good clap in

0:26:30 Tom: But yeah

0:26:32 Thomas: A clean take You know what, uh, I heard, I heard a phone go off, we need clean take can You be insane, please, for the sake of the show, Tom.

0:26:35 Tom: Three two three two

0:26:36 Eli: No I she actually reads Tom. If I can just give you, I hate to feed lines, she reads your text messages to you, you've never read your own text messages, so three, two, one, go. If you just go

0:26:49 Tom: Oh

0:26:49 Thomas: Would have been the, like, you remember when Facebook first started, or a few years after it, and there'd be the fucking couples that had the joint Facebook account oh my god that could be Tom, yeah.

0:26:55 Tom: My god no

0:26:58 Eli: Yikes, fucking yeah, 100 could be Tom, a million percent could be Tom. I will called Haley right now and demand she come down, you will be Tom Haley on Facebook by this afternoon, Tom, by this after noon you'll be tailing of course, oh

0:26:59 Tom: No, yeah no I, I

0:27:08 Thomas: God did you have those friends though those

0:27:13 Tom: I never No, I never had any friends that had joint accounts, that'ss an older people thing

0:27:17 Thomas: That meant for me was, okay, I literally will never interact with that account ever, like I don't, oh you have a joint Facebook account, cool, I barely would interact with one of you, I'm as sure shit not going to interact with both of you, you know how insane that is, you're just like hey I would love to send a message to both of you for some reason, like what the fuck, yeah yeah

0:27:33 Eli: My god it's insane, it's it's a, I, I will say, and this is pin in this because this is a topic for a whole nother day, couples who air their relationship drama on Facebook you you could not pay, there is no deeper, more fiery hell than those relationships, again, I will for another day, for another day

0:27:47 Tom: Oh my god that is grotesque

0:27:48 Thomas: Unreal I will

0:28:00 Tom: Another day for sure, all

0:28:00 Eli: Yeah

0:28:00 Thomas: Never I will never understand that as long as I live, I never will, it's the weirdest thing, geez

0:28:06 Tom: Right, so where are you guys at, so my, my dick's out, where are, are you guys at with this now?

0:28:09 Eli: That's

0:28:11 Thomas: Again, we're not doing the consent one man just

0:28:12 Eli: About that's about my phone, yeah no, um, so I'm, me and Anna are both a little snoopy, like we don't regularly check each other's phones like this, it's not built in, there's not an agreement, but I'll occasionally, like, if she walks out of the room I'll be like, who's she texting, what's she talking about with and I have permission, I have commission, so much so that if I am planning a surprise for Anna, I will tell her, hey, don't check my phone for the next, like, couple of days, I don't know if she's ever checked it, I don't know if she's checking it but I just I know that we're but

0:28:13 Thomas: Yeah oh wow geez I

0:28:43 Tom: Yeah,

0:28:42 Thomas: Hope she's keeping a tally of how many surprises you've been planning that didn't plan out, weird that

0:28:47 Eli: But we're both snoops, we're both snoobs, so we'll both be like, don't, don't look for a couple of days because I got to do a surprise thing, but yeah, um exactly blows a surprise, well

0:28:56 Thomas: Kind of blows the surprise, eyes. Like the fact that you're tipping her off. Yeah. So you have to do decoy ones occasionally.

0:29:03 Tom: This

0:29:03 Eli: Yeah, ooh, smart, I don't do that, so she just knows the surprise is incoming, yeah, but when, when we were first together, I wouldn't say I've done it in the last, like, two or three years, but when we were first together I definitely would be like, can I, can I see, can I say you're not because I suspect, again, not because I suspected infidelity because it's not, not an issue, but just because, like, I want to see what she's texting her friends about, like, don't you ever see your part, okay, maybe I'm the weirdo we found Elon don't you ever you

0:29:22 Thomas: Weird. What the fuck? Now we're doing a weird realignment. Wow.

0:29:35 Tom: Is great. This is great, I feel so much less pressure right now yes I

0:29:37 Thomas: I think Tom has the middle position. Eli is

0:29:40 Eli: Guys never you're

0:29:41 Thomas: The insane position. And I have the other insane position, which is Lydia's phone is my dad's diaries. Journals. I'll never, I feel bad. Like Like, I do, to the point where if her phone ends up in a position where I can see it and she gets a message, I'm like, fuck. That's like, that's like your parent is naked.

0:29:57 Eli: Tossing the dealer chip at a poker and you're like, oh, oh, I saw his cards, I saw him, I saw all his cards I can afford.

0:30:01 Thomas: Yep. Yeah. Yeah, pretty much. I'm, like, I don't, I're not, this isn't something I'm supposed to be a part of. Like, yeah,

0:30:08 Eli: Oh, it's juice. It's, but it's juiced. Like sometimes like friend will write to her, right? The friend who's just life is horrible and it's just always creating

0:30:16 Thomas: Just ask her what she's saying. Don't you just ask, ask for Anna's version of it?

0:30:18 Eli: A problem.

0:30:18 Tom: That That's What I do like I'll just like, if like, Hayley's like, we're like laying in bed together, like watching TV, and like she's like intently on her phone chit-chatting, I'm a curious motherfucker, so I'll be like what are you up to? You know, I'll be like, oh, I

0:30:29 Eli: That's what I'm, that's what I'm talking about. Yeah.

0:30:29 Thomas: Mm -hmm. Yeah. Yeah, but I would just ask for her. I don't look at her phone.

0:30:33 Tom: Was just chatting with so- -and-so about such-and-such," and then she'll, like, you, she'll do the same for me if I'm like, you, chatting with somebody or whatever, which is, it's pretty unusual, but like, if I were, you know, she'd be like, "Hey, what are you up to?" And I'll be like, "Oh, I'm chatting with, you know, Thomas and Eli to plan the show for 16 minutes from now," or whatever, you know, but like you

0:30:34 Eli: No, I'm not. I.

0:30:51 Eli: No, that's, that' 's what I'm doing too. I want to clarify. I'm not waiting till she leaves the room and then sneaking a peek. I just occasionally like to see

0:30:57 Thomas: Okay because it sounded like that was kind of what you're, you use

0:30:59 Eli: No I just like to say occasionally I like to see snoop

0:31:01 Tom: Kind of said that though

0:31:02 Thomas: The word snoop, you use the word Snoop

0:31:03 Tom: You said like when she leaves the the room sometimes I'll look at her phone, I

0:31:06 Thomas: Let the record show

0:31:05 Eli: I for me no No, not for the last two or three years I'm

0:31:11 Thomas: Now you're in the hot seat, you know how Tom moderates his insane views, once we challenge him, he tempers him a little, you're doing it Eli, you're going it

0:31:15 Tom: This never

0:31:14 Eli: Not look never first of all, first of all, I will not have you insult Tom like that. Tom has never backed down from his insane views. If anything, he triples down in a medium where we can't control him

0:31:31 Tom: Yeah

0:31:24 Thomas: That's fair, fair point yeah that might have been just me hoping he would, that was probably wishful thinking yeah you know you're right that's on me

0:31:33 Eli: Hoping yeah no we, we all we would deeply hope here on Dear Old Dads that that he would ameliorate his views. No, I'm, look, I will say not in the last, like, two or three years minimum, but sometimes, you guys don't ever get a little snoopy snoop yeah, you guys whatever I'll

0:31:48 Thomas: Never, never I never do it, I, I I hope that you can, you know me well enough to know, this is, you know, this is like cheating at a game, it's the same thing for me, cheating at the board game, you know, I never will ever, ever, it's just, it's a constitutional thing, yeah there you go, I I think it correlates.

0:32:05 Eli: Cheat the fuck out of a board game too, so I see, this is where we are, wouldn't

0:32:07 Tom: See I'm Thomas, I'm kind of there with you, like, I, I'm very comfortable asking Haley, like, "What are you up to?" Because then she can tell me, "None of your business," and I'll be like, "Oh, no, I'm more curious," but I'm not, not going to push you, know, but like, like, phone is like, it's like reading, like a, if she kept a journal, like if she kept a diary, I would no more read her diary than I would read her phone, like what if she's like I would never read her emails or read her dairy like I would ever do anything that doesn't respect her privacy, ever. Eli, you're like losing it, I love, love it, buddy.

0:32:18 Thomas: Yeah, yeah, right, right. No, no. Are you kidding? That's so intrusive.

0:32:29 Eli: Want to snoop on your wife's diary, yeah

0:32:43 Thomas: To, I want to give credit to Lydia when I tipped her off that we were talking about this, because, because I told her about the jokes you made, Eli, about not knowing what Thomas position would be, because it was so funny. Was like, "Ooh, make sure to ask Eli about, you goes with his opinion that he can bug his fucking son's phone for his whole life," like, it's kind of a similar issue but uh

0:32:59 Eli: And you'll notice they, uh they match you

0:33:05 Tom: But I don't feel as like pathological as you do Thomas. Like if I see a message, like I like, like if we're standing together, I might like look over her shoulder or something, but I, I mean, I'll go like, I'm like, if we're standing together and she's like chit -chatting with somebody and we're like, you know, standing in line for something, I might look over his shoulder and be like, Hey, what are you up to? Who are you chatting with? You know? Like I don't avert my gaze at all, you know, but also there's

0:33:10 Thomas: I know I'm not like fucking gouging my eyes out, yeah

0:33:19 Eli: Sneak a little pink you sneak a little peak yeah there's a, there's little Eli in you, Tom, there's no Eli and you whispering in your ear you

0:33:32 Tom: A little bit, like I'm certainly curious. I don't want to pretend I'm not curious. I'm always curious. But I will say that I have needed her phone. So Haley sleeps... She to bed later than I do. She sleeps later in the morning. So I'm up earlier. So I am the first one up in the morning. And there has been... I needed to cancel a Verizon account of ours, like our 5G account, because we are moving and we don't need it. And I need her phone to do it. I got a call from her phone and she is like, just take my phone while I'm asleep and call. And I was like, there's no way I'm going to do that. I would never...

0:34:00 Thomas: I I the same thing, I'd be like, I know there's no reason this matters, but I don't like it. I don t want to do it.

0:34:05 Tom: Yeah, I don't, same thing.

0:34:06 Eli: Guys are throwing away snoopertunities, fix new opportunity with consent

0:34:08 Tom: No opportunities. I just makes me feel weird. And it's not because I feel the same way. Like if she would needed my phone for something, I'd be like, yeah, take my phone. I don't care. I've, I've given her my phone and left the house when when she's needed my iPhone to like FaceTime with somebody. Cause I have an iPhone and she doesn't. And I'd been like, oh yeah, you can just take my iPhone. I'll just leave the house. So I don't give a shit what she looks at, but it feels weird to not be like super respectful of her privacy, like that feels like something that I think specifically like a lot of dudes do to women and to as like a way to like control them and to like like have

0:34:12 Eli: Okay

0:34:13 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Well,

0:34:46 Tom: Ownership of their private space

0:34:46 Eli: Oh

0:34:46 Thomas: And vice versa, actually. This is a, this is one where I think women do this maybe even more, I think, to men.

0:34:48 Tom: Yeah maybe, yeah

0:34:52 Eli: Yeah no, know, I know dudes who like have to turn it in. And I want to be clear, I am not looking for infidelity. I'm just curious. There's nothing I could see on the phone that I would care about.

0:34:52 Tom: Maybe you know totally believe you, Eli, I do

0:35:05 Eli: It could be another dude's erect schlong.

0:35:05 Thomas: Yeah I believe you. What?

0:35:05 Tom: Like, I know that curiosity curiosity, because I'm not looking for infidelity either

0:35:10 Eli: And I'd be like, exactly.

0:35:10 Tom: But I'm a fucking snoopy snoop too, I'm curious, yeah

0:35:13 Eli: If Anna had a diary and I didn't read it, I would die. I would die. Like, remember when Roger Rabbit is hearing shave and a haircut, that's what would happen, and then I would explode and die

0:35:14 Tom: Oh

0:35:21 Thomas: Oh my god. Yeah! I have a diary, I must read it! And he bursts through a wall. Yeah, hey

0:35:31 Eli: Yes exactly, Tom, one quick thing, Tom, I do need to call out abuse when I hear it, and I hope this isn't uncomfortable, uh, why would you allow your wife to have a non-iPhone? Is like, what, what fell apart in In the relationship that you feel like she needs to have the same.

0:35:43 Tom: I'm oh no now we're gonna, this is all the email we're going to get for the next, like, fucking six months, is that I

0:35:49 Thomas: I I we don't have iPhones, Lydia and I, don't know my phone

0:35:53 Tom: Got one, two years ago

0:35:53 Eli: What

0:35:54 Thomas: Which is funny because I love Mac for everything, I love Mac for everything else, but I, I converted, converted a while back. And here's the thing, I converted for a dumb reason, and I want to go back to iPhone, and I even bought one, but I, it's, now I've reached that age where I bought one in order to switch, and every time I look at it, I'm like, I don't know what that is, and so I just stick with my old phone.

0:35:54 Eli: Is the matter with you?

0:36:15 Eli: Yeah. You know what's on it? Your vasectomy appointment is on that phone. And that's why you can't switch over.

0:36:19 Thomas: Yeah. Yep.

0:36:21 Tom: You'll be unsurprised to learn that I actually made the switch to the iPhone just because they came out with that update that allows at you can be like apps can't track me. Didn't even want an iPhone. Yeah.

0:36:31 Thomas: You are a respect privacy guy. I'm, it's weird. I don't know if Tom has the same thing, but I have a weird mindset where I'm like, I don't, I deserve to have this knowledge or not deserve, but like I haven't been, no one has chosen to give me this knowledge. So therefore I respect that. I don't want to know things that I shouldn't know. Like, I just don't, if someone, if, if Lydia wanted to tell me, she would have told me. If not, she didn't like, why, why would I, why should I be privy to something that she didn't want me to be privy to. Right?

0:37:02 Tom: Feel similarly. I feel like I want to know everything about my wife that she wants to tell me. Like So there's nothing she, there's no subject matter she can open up that I would be like, yeah, I don't want to know about that I enlightened

0:37:08 Thomas: Yeah.

0:37:14 Eli: So I guess what we're saying is I love my wife more than you guys love yours. Because I want to know everything about her. Even if she isn't enlightened enough to share it with me yet. Like that's how, that's how dedicated to this relationship I'm gonna get a little choked up, excuse me I'm just so, I just love my wife so much that like I know what is best for What I should know

0:37:26 Tom: Enough to share it. Ha ha. Ha ha. Ha.

0:37:32 Thomas: I I want to keep her in this one room and not ever let her leave from this room that I lock her in and then but I feed her Yeah.

0:37:40 Eli: That I locked her in and that

0:37:44 Tom: If Anna said I don't want you to read my phone anymore

0:37:46 Eli: Like I would never read her phone again Yeah, I would never ever do it again

0:37:48 Tom: Okay, yeah, alright so then and that's it and

0:37:51 Thomas: Or is he just saying that for the record I think Tom I think he's just saying not for the record and

0:37:53 Tom: That's it no I

0:37:52 Eli: No, to be fair I would die like Roger Rabbit, I could I would Die like Roger Rabbit. I would never stop talking about it, but I would respect that boundary. If a boundary is laid, I would, but I would talk about it. I would request it for every birthday, every major holiday, every Christmas, New Year's, anything, my deathbed. She'd be like, darling, I love you so much. Here we are on your 41st birthday with you finally passing away. And I'd be like, let me get a peek at them texts just so I can go out. I

0:37:55 Tom: Believe him I believe him

0:37:59 Thomas: Yeah.

0:38:29 Eli: Just want to know what Stephanie said about the party this weekend. I just wanna know

0:38:33 Tom: You know like I'm I'll like, I'll be the old man in the group for a minute, well for always, but like there was a time

0:38:39 Thomas: I was gonna say oh

0:38:34 Eli: Yeah all the time you're 90 will you oh look at me I'm touching my toes Tom I'm catching my toes

0:38:40 Thomas: You will you how big of you Tom yeah

0:38:41 Tom: I'll acknowledge it at least this time there I'll acknowledge it yeah but like I think part of it for me as I'm thinking about this, like like, part of it for me is that, you know, there was a time that I lived in where our conversations with our friends got to be free and open because we had them verbally. Right.

0:38:58 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah.

0:39:01 Tom: And there was no record of it. So you could have this like really comfortable exchange with a friend of yours where you were maybe like and now everything's written down. This like life and importance and permanence now because it's written down, but we're not writing these things for posterity. That's just the medium for communication. And I think it'd be really easy to confuse the fact that it's written down and like give that kind of an unnecessary gravity, whereas like when I was younger, maybe you're just spitballing, bullshitting chit -chatting.

You don't really believe what you're saying, you're, you're just talking, but this is like, but you know what I mean? Like when you read something, it feels bigger than when you just are like bullshitting out loud with a friend. And I, I respect, and I know that there's like a, a bullhorn element to your phone that feels like, well, I gotta, I Gotta be mindful. I don't want to read a text message exchange between Haley and her mom or Haley and her best friend. Like, like I wouldn't put my ear to the wall in the past when they were like talking in another room, you know, to like eavesdrop.

0:39:02 Thomas: Yep. Totally. Mm hmm. Mm hm. Yeah, yeah. Yes, totally.

0:39:41 Eli: I Would totally do that, 100%, so

0:40:12 Thomas: I think that most of mainstream society is way different than us on this. I think that like it's just a trope, it's just a common reference that like, yeah, you, you're allowed to look at his phone.

And if you, and I hate it, and I wanted to say that very comparison, I feel like most people, if you said most people, I think if you said, "Hey, why your partner's having a conversation in that room with somebody, do you think it's okay to do the like put the fucking cup on the wall thing and like, here, like spy on on them?" I think most people would be like, "Well, no, that's kind of, that'd be, that'd be pretty shitty." If, if you imagine if you're, you were caught spying on a conversation that your partner was having in another room, like that'd pretty, you Know, I think most people Be like, "That's pretty shitty." And yet if it's a phone, "Oh, no, that, that's fine, yeah, you should be able to look at the text, 100%, yeah, you should definitely be able look at your partner's text." And I think it's funny that we do that. I don't think, I don't think it makes logical sense, but I feel like that's where mainstream society is.

0:40:53 Eli: Awesome. Super.

0:41:09 Eli: Me hit you with this tank, this hot fresh take that I just pulled Out of the oven. I don't think it's morally right, but I'd absolutely do it, right? Like, if someone was like, "Hey, should You Should

0:41:12 Thomas: Eli's

0:41:19 Tom: I fucking love that you say it, dude. I love that. You'll say it.

0:41:21 Eli: You Listen in on other people's conversations?" I would be like, "Of course not." And then they'd be like, "Would you like to listen in on this conversation?" I'd be, "Yeah." Uh, there was this thing, I remember, dinner party questions, a bonus just for patrons, by the way, over at patreon.com/ Dear Old dance My Favorite episode we've ever done, one of them which we didn't get to, is would you read a book if it contained anything everyone's ever said about you. And I was, I couldn't believe That That was a question, because I was like, put that book into my fucking Veins.

0:41:40 Thomas: Favorite Episode We've Ever done. Oh,

0:41:51 Tom: Fuck no.

0:41:55 Eli: Baby.

0:41:49 Thomas: That Book Is called The internet.

0:41:56 Eli: No.

0:41:56 Thomas: Are you kidding me? It sucks. I Hate That Book. Yeah,

0:41:58 Tom: Oh

0:41:58 Eli: Well, That. No, I, I, I know, I'm in that book. It's called Facebook. And it, it, it really fucking sucks. But I'm, yeah, no, yeah.

0:42:01 Tom: Yeah,

0:42:02 Thomas: Exactly when When You Have A following of any kind, that's called my DMs and my fucking email and my fuck, I'm just Enough Of it, enough, I care What, what You think about Me anymore.

0:42:11 Eli: No, we, we've, we're, we've gotten, we'd gotten more than a taste of that. But the, but the like secret private conversation stuff, oh, that, that tantalizes

0:42:17 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah, no, I don't want to know. I don't want to know.

0:42:20 Eli: Me to no end. But, oh, I would love to know.

0:42:23 Thomas: Never would read it.

0:42:21 Tom: No, I'm right there too. Like absolutely no, no. No, I would take that. If that If that book existed, Eli, I would burn it. I would reduce the ashes to more ashes, compress them into a diamond, and shoot that to the sun. Absolutely, I don't want to know.

0:42:35 Eli: Tom, do you see that? Do You see the, do you, do that charred corpse in your fireplace? That's me trying to catch the book so I can read everything said, about you because I'm a snoopy little snoopers and oh

0:42:43 Tom: No way, man. No way.

0:42:46 Thomas: Well, we agree too much on this, I think. So just to find the disagreement a little bit, no one was quite insane enough. Although Eli, you're trying and I appreciate that for the show, you know, for the sake of the show. But I do want to say like Tom, when you said if Haley asked to see all your texts, I thought that answer was at least a place where I would have a different take. If Lydia for some reason and was like, I want to see your phone or your messages, I would absolutely say no. And I'd, the reason is because it would just be a question of why are you wanting that rather than just asking me what I'm doing? Like, if you've gotten to that point where you are, somehow our trust is broken such that you're, would need to do that rather than juste ask me, that means I would just be like, okay, something's fundamentally wrong here. Like, it's,

0:42:50 Eli: To be clear Not about trust, Thomas, is just you want to, I want to see, I just wanna, it's, I trust my wife eternally, it's just wanna

0:43:38 Thomas: No. I, this was a hypothetical I, this was the hypothetical scenario of like, if my wife asked me, but our relationship is so different than that that I can't, it's not even, you know, when you do these hypotheticals it's like yeah, that would mean she's a different person or I'm a different person, doesn't really, there's no value there. Lydia would literally never demand to see my phone, like Ever

0:43:39 Eli: Oh,

0:43:53 Tom: Yeah, and the thing is, I do not think we are that far off.

0:43:55 Eli: Do it do it right now, walk into the room and

0:43:57 Tom: Off. I actually don't think we're that far off. Cause I would like, would give her my phone, but then I would be like, well, I also now know we have a problem and it's a pretty big problem. Right? Like if she was like, I don't, I want to read through your messages. I'd be like oh, well you can, you can here you go.

0:43:58 Thomas: Yeah, yeah, I agree, see, nope,

0:44:13 Tom: But like when you're done, when you've done, we have a big problem like when you're done we have probably to go to counseling. You know what I mean? Like it's that big of a problem.

0:44:12 Thomas: That's our only difference, I'd be like, no, sorry,

0:44:23 Tom: Cause like you're not going to find anything you don't like, like, but like, now I know you don't trust me, and like, I work to build trust, I only ever actively work to build trust, so I would know, like, okay, we have a problem.

0:44:22 Thomas: Yeah, Yeah. Mm -hmm.

0:44:23 Eli: If Anna see Ana wanted to go through my messages, I'd be like, I get it, there you go, I would not think about it for a minute, not for a second, she could be there transcribing them onto stone plates, and I'd me like, I don't know what she needs those for, but I guess she's gonna use them for something, can I have it, that I wanna, I'm gonna lose my Duolingo streak, can you, can you read my messages faster yeah, I mean, I, there will also say that, like, something that happens for me on a pretty regular basis is that I will show Anna messages, because I don't know if you guys know this, uh, to talk about being a public figure, because not a lot of people have this same experience, we get some weird fucking messages and

0:44:43 Thomas: Interesting.

0:44:53 Thomas: Yeah. That's interesting.

0:45:17 Thomas: Yeah.

0:45:18 Eli: So a lot of the time, especially after this year, I will call my wife over and be like, hey, this is what this person said, and then I responded, this are you, do you understand that, and she'd be like, yeah, no, I think you did the right thing, or I maybe wouldn't have responded, or you should block that person or whatever the case might be, so I again, if Anna came down right now and was like, uh, hey, hey, I want to see your phone, I'd be like, nice.

0:45:18 Thomas: You don't say.

0:45:36 Tom: Right, I

0:45:44 Eli: The other

0:45:27 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's

0:45:44 Tom: Love that you guys like, love the snoopiness of each other, you know what I mean, I do, I love that you're just like, oh, you're a snoopy bitch and I'm a snooty bitch and here we go, let's do a tradesies, I love you guys right now

0:45:50 Thomas: Funny. Weird.

0:45:48 Eli: Yeah, we're... well, let me say this. And I think this might be the answer. I am so much fucking meaner in my private conversations than I would ever be in any universe. So like, a part of it is just like, let me get some of that tea. And my wife's the same way, is like we we

0:46:10 Tom: Right

0:46:11 Thomas: Yeah. She wants to see your best material. Because honestly, yeah, a lot of your best material no one ever sees because it's you being fucking horrendous in messages. And I'm not clear if it's a joke or not, but it's fine. It doesn't matter. It's okay. It was, it's funny either way.

0:46:23 Tom: Doesn't matter

0:46:16 Eli: Exactly yeah that's not the point that's not the it's for an audience of what, but like, yeah, I mean, that is part of it, is just like, the sheer bitchiness that exists in the privacy of my phone, yeah, and in hers as well, because what else, do you, here's the thing, the alternative to that is that you're never a bitch, and I can't, that I would die again, I would die like Roger Rabbit, I need to see my wife's phone and I need to be a bitch in group threads, go get it right now, that's a bonus this month oh

0:47:01 Tom: Go get a reader phone

0:46:55 Thomas: Never seen. I've never, never seen Lydia's phone and even know where it is. I don't know her passcode. No. Oh, that was another thing you said. I think she might know mine just cause I think I used it for something else that she had to know. I didn't care. I, she would never get into my phone. She

0:47:02 Tom: Oh

0:47:12 Eli: Bonus episode this month

0:47:13 Tom: I, oh no, wait hold on, do you guys have, do you keep a document with all of your passwords and everything okay, all right

0:47:15 Eli: Yes yep

0:47:19 Thomas: Yes. Yes, yes. And I did tell her, I was like, hey, I don't know what happened, something happened in my life where I just like was feeling like fucking, I don't know what it was, where I was like, man, a little dark, but for some reason it was on my mind, I was like, hey, am I just dying, so here, just out of nowhere, I was like, here's the, here's the password for this, like just so you know, and that'll get you everything, and she was like what's happening, I was like, I don't know, man. I just felt like I might die. I don't know. I just had one of those weeks.

0:47:21 Tom: Yeah, all right, no a

0:47:43 Eli: Do You guys want to hear something, what a weird reference this is, so the folder that has everything, and I have like my will, all the passwords, all the this, I have a schedule reminder for all the bills, because like I handle all all that stuff. So it's all in a folder. I have named that folder, and I don't need to worry about this. I've named that holder Flamingo. Do you guys know why I've made that folder Flaminggo? Because that was the name of the folder of the robot that died in Flubber with Robin Williams.

0:48:02 Thomas: Oh,

0:48:22 Eli: Do you remember the Robin Williams movie Flubber? Let me tell you what happens. He's in love with with a computer, I'm pretty sure he fucks it, she dies in the movie and the thing that her screen displays before she dies is flamingo, and then he goes and searches on his computer and that's where she's left her like last will and testament as a computer, and I just love the fact that when I am dying my wife will be like, "Right, it's the Flubber reference, flamingo," and then go on my computer and see all this stuff. Um, also, and I highly recommend this, because, because I didn't have this when my dad passed away, every couple of years or so, I make a new video, Will, which is just me

0:48:21 Thomas: I've never seen it. No, I didn't see it.

0:48:48 Tom: Video.

0:49:03 Thomas: Yeah.

0:49:03 Eli: Telling the people I love that I love them.

0:49:03 Thomas: God, I gotta do that. Fuck. How

0:49:06 Eli: Highly recommend it.

0:49:06 Thomas: Do you do that? Oh, this,

0:49:08 Eli: How do you do it without weeping like a washerwoman? Don't. Spoiler alert.

0:49:08 Tom: Will Okay

0:49:08 Thomas: We could talk. New, every time I think about it for a second, I'm I'm depressed and going to cry for the rest of my life. So I can't do it. Like if I think about being separated from my children, I can'T do it, I just can't.

0:49:19 Eli: Oh, I'm not depressed. I do weep like a washing woman in most of them. I would say somewhere between 90 and 98 percent of them, um, which is weird because you don't see that scene in the movie, right? The camera doesn't turn on and grandpa's not like, "Oh, to my grandson, I leave the chocolate factory," um,

0:49:39 Thomas: Yeah, I

0:49:42 Tom: So wait, is this a will where you're actually like a video well, where you, you're giving, you're, you're directing or bequeathing, or is this like a I love you so much thing

0:49:50 Thomas: Wouldn't

0:49:52 Eli: It's just a nice good it's it's a goodbye message? Yeah, no, I, I Haley,

0:49:54 Tom: Oh,

0:49:55 Thomas: Have thought of it as a will.

0:49:56 Tom: Fuck, that's so dark. I've

0:49:58 Thomas: But in this day and age, Tom, don't... Well, okay, like pretend you loved your kids, For example, it's hard because the situations where I would want to have this are the worst situations. When the kids are adults, whatever, they will have been old enough to comprehend my unbeatable, impossible love for them by then. I think they will be old enough intellectually know, oh, my dad was an insane person in how much he loved me, so I'm cool with that. What I'm not cool with is me dying before they're old enough to understand that, and so those are the only scenarios that I think of this for, and it's like, it's too heartbreaking. I can't do it. I

0:49:59 Tom: Never done that that'd be weird, yeah.

0:50:06 Eli: He loves Haley. He loves Haley.

0:50:42 Thomas: Even start it

0:50:42 Tom: I guess I feel like, I, for all those people, like, for, for my kids, like, me, I guess the the blog that I've been writing to them for years is that sort of ongoing love letter, so, so I feel comfortable with that because and then if, if there is a world where Haley is confused about my feelings for her, it's because she has suffered a traumatic brain injury, like I write her I

0:50:43 Thomas: Sure

0:50:53 Eli: So fuck Haley I guess.

0:51:02 Thomas: Well, maybe she needs the video in that, that world, you know, she might appreciate it, okay,

0:51:05 Eli: You know that old

0:51:06 Tom: Have I have written that lady songs and poems, and written her books, actual books, and mailed her love letters, like, there is no world

0:51:15 Eli: News, Tom, she wants a video old news. So

0:51:15 Tom: Yeah, I guess the video is the only thing I haven't done, so that's, that's

0:51:21 Eli: Here's

0:51:21 Thomas: In your video will to goodbye to your wife, do you do a little, you know, do a strip show, do little?

0:51:27 Eli: Strip. Yes. That's how I always end it. Yeah. Just for her.

0:51:27 Thomas: Yeah, okay. Yeah Yeah.

0:51:28 Tom: It was all strip show I thought it was just all strip show, no, I

0:51:31 Eli: Those considering doing this, and for you guys, because you're gonna do it, I have kept all of the old ones, um, the first the first video like goodbye message I made for Anna, we were dating, we were not engaged yet, we were debating, and it's me being like, hey, I want you to know I loved you and I want to propose to you, so bad, right now, it's, it's not long after the first date.

0:51:39 Thomas: This is too depressing. I can't do it. Oh, wow. It's after the first date. That's

0:51:56 Eli: Let me tell you, it's pretty, it's pretty soon. 'Cause I, I fell hard and fast.

0:51:57 Thomas: Awesome.

0:51:54 Tom: Wow, he's in the bathroom of the movie theater of the first date, just

0:52:01 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah, like he's

0:52:01 Eli: Yeah. So she has like, she

0:52:04 Thomas: Like he gets to the date. Hey, I made you something. Hi, I'm Eli. Here's something I made for you. Too

0:52:07 Eli: Has like four or five videos. Max has two. Max says two videos that aren't the old version when he was like, when she was pregnant with him.

0:52:15 Thomas: Dark. Too Dark. I Can't Do It. Man, it

0:52:15 Tom: Wow. God. I haven't done that. No, this is a dark ending for the show.

0:52:19 Eli: And then when he was born and then, uh, I need to do a new one. Cause the one that I have for him right now is just when he's born

0:52:19 Tom: I

0:52:19 Thomas: Is that. How do you like I would have to take a whole day where I know I'm going to be useless list for the day like I would, I would seriously, I would melt. Like I just would die. It's so hard to even emotionally think about this for me that I just can't even do it. I, but I need to because what if the plane goes down and my kids don't know. God,

0:52:26 Eli: Yeah do it, yeah, yeah heart attacks happen all the time.

0:52:43 Thomas: Damn it yeah.

0:52:43 Tom: I want to do one where I just, it just, like, opens up and it's like me and I spend like a minute or so just like adjusting myself and getting comfortable and clearing my throat. Bye. And then end it.

0:52:52 Eli: All Right. People like complain that I don't laugh enough on my shows, but it's not me, it's the fact that we record over Zoom. It turns out you guys just aren't remotely funny. Yeah.

0:53:11 Tom: I do. Right.

0:53:13 Thomas: All Ouch.

0:53:17 Clip: Want to meet sexy DILFs in your area? Email the dads at DearOldDads.com or, better yet, send us a message on Patreon. You can follow us on all social media by checking the links in the show notes. And if you need more podcasts in your life, you can find Tom on Cognitive Dissonance, Thomas on Serious Inquiries Only, and Eli on Law'd Awful Movies and all the Puzzle in the Thunderstorm shows. Dear Old Dads is edited and produced by my favorite DILF, Tom Smith, who also wrote and recorded the intro music, which is used with his permission. This podcast is a production of Daddy Issues LLC. Copyright 2022. All rights reserved.

0:53:57 Eli: To my grandson I leave the chocolate factory, um, no.