Best of Tom: Family, Wrong or Wrong (DOD58)

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:02 Clip: I'm the cool dad. That's my thing. I know now what I can offer you that no one else can. Complete and honor dependent. I'm a man. I'm sensitive. I need to feel loved. I need to be desired.

0:00:22 Clip: Telling is the only part of being a father that I enjoy.

0:00:28 Tom: To Dear Old Dads, the podcast that won't admit when it's wrong, because it never is. I'm Tom Curry. I've joined, as always, by Thomas Smith and Eli Bosnick. Hello, gentlemen.

0:00:34 Eli: I feel like we did this episode already and I think we made it very clear I am never wrong like as soon as I'm wrong I'm happy to do this show I just feel like it's not going to make any sense let

0:00:48 Thomas: Boy, a great intro, Tom. Great, great stuff. Good. Ten out of ten, because also have the well, the best intros for Tom are they launch us into a different podcast than we intended to do. And that's so like we can blame the victim here and say that Tom is the reason why that happens. But

0:00:54 Eli: Me tell you something I like podcasts and I hope we do one today

0:01:00 Tom: Am

0:01:04 Eli: If podcast has a victim it's done I feel

0:01:08 Tom: I really the victim though

0:01:13 Thomas: Because did you guys have those fucking dads I sort of the which is like well they're never wrong oh you know my wife she's never all the only two words I say is you're right and that's you know like that those kind of fucking memes like it's I don't know it just reminded me of that and did we do an episode out on that are you saying we already did that uh

0:01:13 Tom: Did

0:01:33 Eli: Like we did definitely did like a yes dear always have to agree with your wife episode I don't I don'T know if we've done an episode about like dads who never admit when they're wrong because that's a serious problem too especially

0:01:37 Tom: We I don't remember doing that but

0:01:39 Thomas: Me neither okay two votes for sure well some level there's like in a societal endorsement of it a little bit where it's like yeah they never admit they're wrong you know you just have to work around the fact that like it's it's you mean that's psychotic that that's like completely completely psychotic.

0:02:01 Tom: Isn't wait a minute eli isn'tthat sort of part and parcel of the do it because I said so philosophy that you espoused

0:02:06 Thomas: Here we go.

0:02:07 Eli: No I mean so here's the thing here's how I feel about do it because I said so do it because my dad did not do that right my dad was willing to discuss everything and one of the things that I admired about him most as a parent was that like no matter how dumb my opinion and trust me I have had some truly magically stupid opinions through the years like we would talk it through he was uh you know open to whatever I had to say like no matter how bad my idea was no matter how wrong I was he wanted to break it down I don't want to say socratically because now when people say that I always associate that with like a pompous guy who knows he's right doing like a bullshit q a with you to lead you to his fucking answer which which sucks.

0:02:49 Tom: My God, I know.

0:02:55 Thomas: It does.

0:02:57 Eli: It just sucks. You can taste it in the air like a fart and you're just,

0:03:00 Thomas: The only thing Socratic method means now in today's world on the internet is a racist trying to ask you a series of obviously bad faith questions that don't even work. And they're like, yeah, I use the Socrative method. Like, Like, no, you're just an asshole. Like,

0:03:14 Eli: Our, our, my 2016 Twitter notifications has become, which I feel like Socrates would be bummed about particularly, but he would definitely drink poison if he read my Twitter mentions. So, you know, it just depends on, uh, depends on how you feel, but like, no dad was really good about that and I I know I guess my worry is because okay correct me here I worry that sometimes my dad respected my opinions so much that I did not grow the proper gravitas for authority and that let me believe wrong things things for longer than I should have

0:03:25 Thomas: Tom, Tom, we need to be very careful here in how we react. Oh, that's that's you know, you should explore that, Eli. That's a don't good thought. That's yeah, think there's something there. I think maybe it's like a guy who's drinking 47 beers a night being like, yeah, yeah, I think I might have a problem. I don't, is this right?

0:03:56 Eli: You know what I'm saying you know I'm saying

0:04:13 Tom: I don't. It's possible. I don't t want to go too far here. Just something to think about maybe mullet over in the old brain pan kind of a thing

0:04:16 Thomas: I might. Well, I Think, I THINK what's funny is we had that like do it or I said, so conversation. I, my recollection of that, correct me if I'm wrong, uh, dads was Eli was just wrong about his own opinion. Like he thought he had that opinion. And then by the time we, we told him like, yeah, but your dad gave you reasons and we give our kids reasons and you give your kid reasons. But then he was still like, Yeah, but still, that's how I remember that going.

0:04:40 Eli: That's how I also recall it and therefore I choose to ignore it that's not how I remember him Tom doesn't speak to his exes let's just really dig in on that one let's not get distracted from what we're here to talk about today the

0:04:44 Tom: That's because that's literally how that went yeah

0:04:48 Thomas: Well yeah good well

0:04:56 Tom: My crazy beliefs and attitudes get a lot of traction online I will just say like

0:05:01 Eli: Is true those honestly tom has a terrible hot take great for downloads and we should consider that as a business model

0:05:11 Thomas: Wanted you a little bit of a follow-ups from the fight one because at end of it we think we sort of broached a really fascinating subtopic of it which is this whole like my family right or wrong uh or whatever which I feel like I can't wait to do the usual three bears shtick here although it might just be like two bears and a fucking uh no a me like of just a garbage bears in a fucking raccoon is what it'll be and I'll be the raccoon because my it's so funny I I would see other families you know doing the like my side right or wrong kind of thing or if their kid did anything it didn't matter like you know back in school back in grade school where like a kid would get in trouble you know would do just be shitty like they'd fucking break a window and do it's obviously they're in the wrong and then they'd have a parent who would come in and yell at the teacher and for me consider

0:05:31 Tom: And then eli

0:05:32 Eli: Raccoon oh

0:06:02 Thomas: Me get why don't you guys just guess what I had my version version of that was like my my family wrong or wrong like there's no my the answer for my dad was whatever we did was wrong he didn't want to hear the story he was just like we were already started in the wrong no matter what and so it was fucking mind -boggling to see those parents who would come in and they're yelling at the teacher like as if the teacher was the wrong one in the you know in the conflict with the nine -year -old that like took a shit in class they're like I I bet the teacher is wrong in this situation. You know, it blew my mind. But I don't know. I sort of wonder if isn't a certain amount of that. Sort of like Eli's realization a minute ago. I'm wondering if maybe I need a certain amount of feeling like I have their back no matter what. But I can't go 100%. I just can't. Yeah, I can.

0:06:56 Tom: No matter what never no

0:06:57 Thomas: I can do that. I agree. Okay. Thank you, Tom.

0:06:57 Tom: Matter what yeah no I dude I'm right there with you man was a kid when I lived in with my dad and again Again, this is going to sound more insane than I think it was because, again, my dad was a single dad in the early 1980s, right? And that's a tough position, I think, that I'm very sympathetic to. There were not a lot of single dads in 1984 in that I literally never met any in the 1980s. So my dad Was a single Dad in the 80s. And in 1984, I moved in with my dad. And one of the things that he said when we moved into him was, listen, whatever trouble you get into at school, it's double when you get home.

0:06:59 Eli: I guess

0:07:34 Tom: That was one ofthe very first things that I heard. My dad, when we first moved inwith him, I'm in first grade, middle of first grade. So I'm like six and a half, seven years old. And there were two things that stood out in my mind that hesaid, like our first, like, getting to know you's time when wemoved in with him. You know, because we didn't, my dad lived in an entirely different state. It's not like we didn'T know him, but like we DIDN'T live with him ever in our, in our lives at that point. Um, he said, I'm not a short order cook. I make dinner. If you eat it, great. If You don't eat it also great, but I'm NOT making two dinners and whatever trouble you get into at school, it's double when you get home. And

0:08:10 Thomas: Start tiling putting this bathroom kid.

0:08:13 Eli: It's because he knocked a tile out of the floor at school and so yeah you know man of his word time

0:08:18 Tom: So I I never I'm right there with you thomas like to some degree it never occurred to me and I think my dad in actuality as we lived with him he did have a much more nuanced stance on that but I think he laid down a lot of like really binary rules in the beginning because like you know he's got to have a low tolerance for shit because he's a single parent and there's just there's there's a very limited amount of energy and time that you can spend yeah right like he's gone from 6 a .m to 6 p .m every day that was his work schedule so

0:08:38 Thomas: She doesn't have time. Yeah yeah. Really is the limiting factor in a lot of parenting. Like I really do understand. I really do get that. Yeah because like I my kids are fighting all the time as I've as I mentioned they're just fighting each other constantly and like sometimes I'll be like okay let's fucking you write an affidavit of your side and I'll fucking we'll do a deposition and and then other times I'm just like look whatever this is just no you're just I can't I just whatever is happening right now I'm busy I'm working on whatever we're making dinner we had something something there's times where you're just like just just just no yeah

0:08:53 Eli: And money man time and money it does it makes you exceptionally sympathetic to the bad parenting technique of well now nobody gets to blank right because look again that's bad and you shouldn't do it but the the urge when they're like I want this on the tv I want this on tv for you to just be like I'm gonna shoot the tv I shot the tv so now this particular moment I'm in hell is over so

0:09:48 Thomas: Yeah well yeah it sucks I I always hated that as a kid I hated when there was clearly something where there are two sides to it and one side I thought was right once I thought it was wrong and then the whatever the authority figure was like I don't fucking care just stop stop you're You're making, it matters so much.

0:10:03 Eli: Because it matters so much to you in

0:10:05 Thomas: The most important thing in the world. It's like, you're fucking, it's like yeah, but we're talking about my version of the Armenian genocide. We don't just say like, we don't call it we'll just call it 50, 50, come on. You know, like as a kid and it's, it really is nothing. But when, when you're a maxed out adult what's happening is just like, well there's noise happening and I can't like that.

0:10:05 Eli: That moment

0:10:26 Thomas: You're just fucking max. You're like, ah, and I know it too. Too, that the worst thing is I absolutely still feel that, you know, like I said, I'm not doing it. I'm non -oblivious to it. Maybe my parents weren't either. I don't know. But like, I know they probably were. They didn't give a shit. They were perfectly happy being like, if there's noise, fuck these kids. Stop the noise. Don't care. But I feel bad. Oh, but speaking of noise real quick, what's the worst possible noise in a podcast, Eli? I'm just wondering if you could tell us.

0:10:26 Eli: Right yeah my cricket back oh god

0:10:55 Thomas: No no the uh no worse the auto ads oh

0:10:57 Eli: My crickets back oh hey oh my god I have such a good auto ad story for you guys so ever since I started talking shit about auto ads I have gotten one auto ad and one auto add alone and that is for saint jude's children hospital I get it at every ad break sometimes multiple times per ad break I used to have cancer but now I dominate on the soccer field that's it every single and

0:11:26 Tom: Now I dominate on the soccer field

0:11:28 Thomas: Is that really the ad

0:11:30 Eli: That is the end it is for the St. Jude's Children Hospital and it is the only one I get ever and it is always preceded when I'm listening by like these fucking auto ads man I hate them so much help children like I die in terrible agony fight against God's will so I my new revised position is fuck all auto ads except the ones that focus on children's cancer

0:11:50 Tom: Fight against god's will

0:12:01 Thomas: I love that that is a perfect prank by either me or the ad company oh you're gonna talk shit about ads you're going to talk shit about children's cancer baby fuck you talk shit about this ad, Eli.

0:12:05 Eli: Children's cancer yeah

0:12:12 Tom: So the fuck is wait a minute what is saint jude's advertising are they advertising like for cancer like is it like a pro cancer what

0:12:18 Eli: Mommy

0:12:18 Thomas: Against cancers if I had to guess, but donate

0:12:21 Tom: Am

0:12:21 Eli: Told me to get near the so you're supposed to donate money to the hospital but also there's like a look most of these hospitals they're just gonna let your kid die but over at St. Jude's we're in it to fucking win it and can I say honestly from my heart I believe them I believe that most hospitals are like I don't know liver too small not worth it have some aspirin

0:12:21 Tom: I supposed to do with that ad donate

0:12:24 Thomas: Money to the hospital. Yeah. It's funny doing the like shitty brand X, like those ads, but for children's cancer, you know, like you show the black and white footage of the other hospital and you're You're trying to open the door as a parent and you fall over. Does this ever happen to you? You know, thing.

0:13:01 Tom: Eight chemotherapy set it and forget it and

0:13:02 Eli: So so I've mentioned this before but my cousin was um of fertility over at cleveland clinic for years um she's super duper smart lady and she would have clients come in and be like Like, well, we knew we had to get this done at Cleveland Clinic. And it's like, dude, this isn't fucking bumble and bumble. It's not a haircut. And yet it kind of is. It's terrifying. Like there's a bad hospital that we live closer to the bad hospital than we do to the good hospital. So if I'm ever in an ambulance situation, they can refuse to take me to the Good Hospital.

0:13:38 Thomas: Well, if you don't want to be guilted into donating to children's cancer research or whatever, make sure to instead donate to us at patreon.com slash your old dads.

0:13:47 Eli: Slash

0:13:48 Tom: You you can help eli afford the good hospital did you ever talk now eli this wouldn't happen for you because I don't think you grew up with a sibling that was contemporaneous in age but like thomas did you never

0:13:48 Eli: Dear old dads, the Good hospital. That is true and I've solved the problem as a parent as well it's really fantastic guys can't recommend having one kid enough

0:14:10 Tom: You ever get in trouble for something your brother or sister did did

0:14:14 Thomas: I mean there were times when it was just like well for me it was like there are times when if my dad was mad it was Like the whole house was just miserable so it didn't fucking didn't really matter who was in trouble it was Just like fuck this is sucks it's just sucks here

0:14:27 Tom: That yeah that's I remember like like something would get fucked up like I don't even remember any like somebody would like you know eat the fucking cookies you weren't supposed to eat or break something or you know do some kid shit like whatever the fucking kid shit was and then no neither my brother or I would admit to having having done whatever the thing is, and then my dad would just be like, I gotta punish both of you guys, now you're both, because he wouldn't be like nobody gets punished, because I couldn't find the guilty party, he'd be like all right, well the only solution then is everybody eats shit, and then you know, you'd be and then like when I knew it wasn't me, it made me crazy, because I'd be my brother won't blink, but my brother, there is something as stone cold as you can can possibly imagine about my brother bob like he'll be like my dad could be like all right look here's the thing we're setting you guys are both getting set on fire at three o 'clock unless one of you admits to it my brother would be like he would look me right in my eye and be like it's gonna be a hot one and that would be it that wouldbe it like we would be we'd be on fire and he'd be like I need those fucking cookies man I did not anyway

0:15:07 Thomas: I could probably imagine yeah jeez

0:15:35 Tom: You would have they would have done he would have every time I caved I caged I'd be like oh it was me it was me it wasn't me but my brother absolutely not I ate so much shit because of my brother

0:15:50 Thomas: I'm just realizing how much of I think mine and certainly Tom's childhood was basically squid games like it was just you realize like oh you don't have to put up with psychological torment quite so much anymore. There's all these situations where you're like, well, if he says he didn't do it, then you're just like, fuck. It was like prison. God, it was so bad. There was all the, ugh.

0:16:10 Eli: It's the stanford prison experiment but your dad was the warden and nobody eventually let you guys out

0:16:18 Thomas: Ugh. It's good to be out.

0:16:18 Tom: I think like I don't know what I would do if I were my dad in that same spot I I really don't know what I would do because I'm lucky. My kids are the worst liars ever. So like Donovan, sometimes he'll be like, I'll be like, dude, did you do this thing? And I'll Be like, no.

0:16:24 Thomas: . Yeah.

0:16:32 Tom: I'll BE like, really? Yeah, I did it. That's all it takes. He breaks under that amount of pressure. If the cops ever picked him up, they'd like bring him into the interrogation room and there'd be like that camera in the corner and they'd be like, so he'd be like, okay, I'm going to do this. It a hundred percent. I did it. I did. That was me.

0:16:46 Tom: I'll draw you a picture, like whatever it takes like they So it's super easy.

0:16:46 Eli: Stabbed that guy yep oh

0:16:52 Tom: Like I have this thing thomas I don't know if you had the same thing where I hate and I still hate when there's just that like shitty emotional vibe tension in the house like it makes me

0:17:03 Eli: You hate it it's it's the worst

0:17:04 Thomas: Worst. Worste.

0:17:05 Tom: I cannot live in that space I can't it makesme so crazy

0:17:09 Thomas: I'm glad you say that, Tom. I'm Glad You Say That. That's the healthy response, and I think I feel the same way, and I know not everybody who was kind of raised in my circumstances feels quite that same way. But that's the way to be. Don't fucking create that shit. I'm so glad to hear you say that, because

0:17:25 Eli: God there are some people and that are just like well no when when you're upset the vibes just suck until I feel better and you're like no no anything but this anything but this weird terror and it's especially bad if they're like well I actually don't want to talk about it right now and you'll be like oh so we're just gonna we're just gonna do this we're gonna have like this shitty wait

0:17:32 Thomas: For everybody. Yeah, just forever. Yeah, this

0:17:45 Tom: We're just gonna have this shitty awful fucking but my dad said similar to what you said thomas like my dad it's like this this happened a lot my brother figured out how to work this because my brother is like a soulless automaton I don't know what the fuck is wrong with that kid I mean I love him I guess vaguely but like my

0:18:01 Thomas: Is a new chapter of horror that we're getting to learn about in Tom's childhood. Did yeah my brother would sometimes make people float with his mind and you know just dismantle their body you know it just happened

0:18:05 Tom: But like you've seen stranger things it's kind of like that

0:18:13 Thomas: We'd be tiling a bunch of the whole house was tiled after that those murders oh

0:18:18 Tom: Well I would always like my dad would give us both chores like we said before like we'd have have like especially in the summertime to keep us busy while he was working and we were home unsupervised for eight hours a day 12 hours a week six to six so we'd have like these chores and like what have you and my brother figured out at some age I don't remember maybe sixth seventh eighth grade somewhere around there that if he didn't do the chore his chore that I hated my dad coming home being pissed because bob didn't know his tournament dad wouldn't be mad at me he didn't take it out on me but I hated the vibe in the house I hated attention I hated just the way way the house felt I hated like just the whole thing right so I'd do his fucking chore I'd be like I'm just gonna do it and so my brother like fairly quickly figured that out and like we would have these like fucking fights about it like these like and they would sometimes devolve into fights like fighting each other because we're like teenagers

0:19:06 Thomas: It sounded like you didn't have any other option you were in you were in a prisoner's dilemma with a psychopath you're like fuck I can't I win I lose every time he just just says, yeah, sure. Burn the prison to the ground. I don't fucking care. I mean, don't give a shit.

0:19:12 Tom: He didn't care he he seriously did not blink he never blinked on that shit I did that motherfucker's chores for like years years,

0:19:17 Eli: I'm gonna be pushing the button no you don't it's not how it

0:19:20 Thomas: He, but is he a hard, is he really good poker player?

0:19:23 Eli: Works I

0:19:27 Tom: He could be, he absolutely could be.

0:19:29 Thomas: All in. You don't even have any cards. I said all in you literally there's, you haven't been all in.

0:19:33 Eli: Said all in this is a roulette wheel sir you just bet the amount that you want now

0:19:37 Thomas: I thought you're right. Okay. I fold. Fuck. God damn it. Tom's brother. Okay. Yeah. I have cards. You you don't, but I fucking, I'm scared. So yeah, I fold.

0:19:45 Eli: Can I say because I had a cousin like that not a not a sibling obviously but I hada cousin like that life turns around and beats the shit out of those people and it has been I don't know if this is true your brother it has been delicious to watch the minute this dude tried it in the real world he was like I'm a sociopath everyone was like oh you're a sociopath you can't work at this jiffy lube anymore and he was like oh what but mommy didn't catch me he this is the story I might get in trouble for telling this but I actually don't care about this person in any way shape or form he was stealing from his job uh like they caught him but they didn't have proof they didn'T have it on the cameras and he was like you don't have me on the camera and they were like yeah man you're still fucking fired and I remember his mind was he was like what but you don'T have cameras and the guy was like dude this is a fucking like it was literally an automobile parts store he was a fucking automobile parts store you're just fired because I don't like you I don't like your face go away

0:20:56 Thomas: Does he think like I get due process at the Jiffy lube though? Like you can't.

0:21:00 Eli: He was like your honor I object and he was like who are you talking to man you suck

0:21:05 Tom: Yeah there's there's no adjudication you dumb ass like that my brother that's actually a good point because like I I probably shouldn't tell this on air but I don't care like I fired my brother more than once so like my brother has worked for me yeah like nobody I will also say nobody makes because that attitude makes me fucking crazy right that attitude of just this sort of like passive aggressive aggression makes me fucking insane. It just like it goes right under my fucking fingernails. You know, I can't stand it. But my brother kind of struggled for a long time to find his footing in terms of like work and what have you. And so a couple of times I hired my brother to work for the company that I worked for when I was a manager there. And like when I Was managing this title company, I hired him as be a closer and he would go out and like these guys got paid for every transaction that they signed like they didn't get it wasn't a commission because they weren't selling anything but that's just how the payment was structured right so they if they did five closings they got I don't know 500 bucks whatever it was but if they fucked something up meaning they like missed the signature or made a mistake on and they were also responsible for going out and fixing it right so like if there's a hundred pages of documents and you miss one of them that loan is not going to fund until you go get that other signature so

0:21:25 Thomas: For sure yeah sorry this is not important but what is the difference between a closer and a notary okay

0:22:26 Tom: Closer has to be a notary to do their job, but a notory is just, yeah,

0:22:29 Thomas: So this is so that yeah because I don't think I've ever I'm familiar with a closer but I always have a notory come out whenever we've refinanced or whatever so is it that okay

0:22:36 Tom: That person is their job title is closer. Yeah.

0:22:39 Thomas: Okay thank you appreciate it gotcha

0:22:40 Tom: Yeah. Same, same difference. It's Right. Just, it'S a little more behind the scenes other than just the signing that you don't see, like that their job would entail typically. But so anyway, so that was my brother's job. Right. So but like I said, if you miss a signature, he's got to go and fix it because there's nobody else to go out and fix it. You got paid for it. But it was inconvenient. He'd just be like, I'm just not going to do it. Just don't pay me for that one. And I'd be like dude, that's not how it works.

0:22:45 Thomas: Gotcha okay

0:23:02 Tom: He's like, like, he would just he would just be like, oh, I don't I'm not going to go out. I'm just and I was like, well, if you don't go out and fix your mistake, it's not just that I'm not going to pay you for one deal. I am firing you. And then he would because I don don't need you to work here if you're bad at your job and won't fix your errors and he's just like but my brother doesn't blink so he's like I'm not going and I'm like you're not working here anymore you're fired and he didn't believe me he came to work the next day and I was like I

0:23:02 Thomas: They just won't get a house cool but there's no cameras there's no cameras yeah oh god oh

0:23:20 Eli: Tom

0:23:33 Tom: Don't know what part of you're hired you didn't catch from when I said you're tired but you don't work here and I've done it twice I've fired that guy twice in his life

0:23:33 Eli: And then and

0:23:38 Thomas: My god twice okay I think the old saying applies first one shame on him for real second one shame on you like for like like I that's it saying normally Normally doesn't apply, but like

0:23:48 Tom: It's hard not to help help family though. It is, I will admit it's hard not to help family.

0:23:52 Eli: Tom

0:23:53 Thomas: It's easy for me. Jesus.

0:23:54 Eli: Tom you and I I'm afraid to tell you that you and I are the same person right now because when we're not the same person anymore you'll forget my name and walk away from me but we this has has happened to me so many times with friends because I again I was a manager at a retail store a retail toy store where there was no requirement to enter entry and I cannot tell you I've dozens of friends who are still my friends who would be like I'm going through a really tough time man do you have any shifts you could give me and I'd be like absolutely buddy let me rearrange the schedule of this retail business that I'm running so that you can have a shift and then they would leave at at lunch you'd be like I don't know man not for me and I'd be like I'm gonna murder you gonna murder you yep and then with it without irony two months later they'll be like you know money's been a little tight lady and I'll belike

0:24:39 Tom: Yeah, man. I have had so many. Yeah. Yep.

0:24:42 Thomas: It's incredible.

0:24:54 Tom: Yeah I do. I, I don't do it anymore. When I was young in the, in the sort of like managerial role, I'd hire family, et cetera. Now I just don't give a fuck. Like, it's like, Oh yeah, you got a position of authority. Like yeah, yeah, you should, uh, you should get one too. It's great.

0:25:07 Thomas: You know, this is fascinating because I don't, I won't speak for Eli. I don'T, I DON'T think this is what's going on there, but for, for Tom and your dynamic, I think there's a lot there. That's kind of in common, not, not identical, but in common with me. And I think for me being raised with kind of a tyrant as a dad, I, I think it does kind of force these personality things. Like there've been times when my younger sister, um, or like anyone in my family or kind of me, but sorta, um have, have needed something from other siblings. And for me, I've never needed, you know, I'm never been broke or anything, but like, you know, little bit of help here and there. I've been like, Oh, it'd be cool if we did this. Or maybe it's like, Hey, this is, would be a good idea if maybe if we all pulled in money to some, and like the minute that comes up, it turns into just hell. And it's, like, this weird pride or something that for some reason, none of my siblings, and I think it's because of maybe my dad possibly being raised with that environment, they cannot be dependent on anyone at all. Like they cannot be dependent because to bar like like my little sister she's doing fine now but like she was the last one to kind of figure out life of us I mean she is the youngest in fairness but still it was like kind of late you know she just didn't have a great job she's never had any money at all and you know my brother tried to help her I would offer to help er and it's just hell like it just doesn't it can't work and is like we each have this feeling of kind of go it alone like we'd rather be fucking on the street than dependent on another sibling like literally and I don't know why that is

0:26:44 Tom: Have a similar sort of sense in that. It was actually funny. Like, uh、 like I think you'll appreciate this. We were watching Haley and I were watching some show yesterday. We were watching a rerun of like some sitcom. I can't remember what it was yesterday. And some character in it gets fired from their job and doesn't like it's that shtick where you get fired and you don't like tell your family that you got fired and then you wake up every morning and go to work and you know, like you're not really working and she just don't want to tell you and hayley is like that would be a hundred percent you you just would never she's like you just if anything bad happens she's just not going to tell me and I was like that's outrageous like I would tell you once I fix the problem you know like that

0:27:21 Eli: That's what I was gonna say the difference is that you would just go and be a fry cook at mcdonald's without telling her until you somehow owned that mcdonald's I

0:27:27 Thomas: You would would work enough shifts to make like a ceo's wage you're like tom there's not that many hours I donno man I figured it out I'm Uber driving in between preparing orders at the drive -thru it works out yeah I guess it's sort of related to the toxic independence thing a little bit but it's but it sucks because I have really tried in life I can't speak for any of my other siblings although I will strongly suggest they have not tried to do as much work on themselves as I have but I'm not sure of that I've really tried to buck these trends and just and if If somebody needs money or somebody does something, I'm not going to be shitty about it. I'm just like, here, free money. Literally don't care. Literally don'T just don't even fuck, but they still treat it like it's strings or they treat it. Like it's, you know, the, oh, you're just want to have one over on me. It's like, dude, I don't fucking, I DON'T care. I really

0:27:38 Eli: Think you know yeah opposite

0:28:20 Thomas: Don't like I, but I, it's can't get out of this pattern. You know, you establish these dynamics as fucking 10 year olds and then that's your whole life, isn't it? It's crazy. Crazy I guess Eli you don't have that the like sibling uh yeah

0:28:31 Eli: Opposite I was I was literally gonna say this past week um my sister's going through a little bit of a tough spot and she texted me she was like hey can I like come hang at your house because and but the subtext is like you guys spoil me rotten and I could use some like like unrequited unconditional love right now and sure enough she like came we got her all her favorite foods but the best example of me being the opposite of this is that when she brought her car back the inspection was four months out of date it needed an oil change and it had no gas and she was just she just like gently waved towards the car and I was like yeah I'll go take care of it right and she just got back in it and she Was like yay car is not bad bad things anymore.

0:29:14 Thomas: I think that's a little different though when it's somebody who's much younger and you didn't there's something about being raised around the same space you're occupying the same space and attention from your parents or from you know there's Something about that rivalry a little bit uh they even have a word for it I think a term for it um and it just it's a a little different than like when the age when the age gap is bigger I don't think it kicks in quite as much I'd be I would be curious in the alternate universe where Eli has a sibling around his age I really would be curious what that would be like probably would have killed him

0:29:27 Tom: I would too I

0:29:48 Eli: Going to say, it doesn't sound fun. I don't like the idea of sharing attention.

0:29:49 Thomas: I know it's well I was you know I was going to make a joke earlier when we talked about the solving the my kid right or wrong problem by only having one kid it's good Eli because if you had imagine if you add two it's the unstoppable force meets immovable object of your your heart. You'd be like, but you say that he's wrong. And he says that you're wrong, but you can't neither. And then you do the like sixties robot meltdown thing.

0:30:13 Eli: Yeah, I was gonna say this, and I'm not kidding. The closest I have to that is sometimes when Madge and Max fight over blueberries, I'm like, all right, kid, you were holding it a little bit low, and she's a dog. And I feel that. I feel that's a real conflict in my life so yeah same z's

0:30:30 Tom: I'll this just occurred to me, Thomas, when you were talking about like borrowing money or whatever from family. I have put my hand out and borrowed money before from in 2008 when, cause I was in, I'm in real estate. So in 2008, when the housing market crashed, my income crashed. And so, and it was, it was very, very sudden and obviously unexposed like overnight for everybody. Like it was just bad times. So little I got myself in a little bit of financial trouble in terms of debt that I had that I was struggling with and

0:30:55 Thomas: If only that big short movie had come out before then, you know, cause then it would have.

0:31:00 Tom: Would have solved a lot of problems for us god damn it dumb

0:31:02 Thomas: Like people would have seen it coming why didn't they fucking do that movie earlier man it would

0:31:05 Tom: Dumb dumb you know what's crazy though like is it I is that like you were in the business you did see it coming you just couldn't do anything about it except for try to get out of the business um which I couldn't do but like I would tell cecil like I told cecil on air like that this is all going to fall apart but um like it 2008 happened my income took a shit I had a bunch of debts and to their credit but I think this is a funny aside dad and lynn did bail me out in the sense that they loaned me money but they made me sign a promissory note for it so they came over and And they had drawn up like a legit promissory note. It wasn't like a napkin thing. This was a promissary note with like monthly payments and default conditions.

0:31:31 Eli: Acquaintance yeah no

0:31:46 Tom: And like, and I was, and you know, I look at that and I'm like, that's kind of a lot, but it wasn't a small amount of money. And I respected it. And yeah.

0:31:52 Thomas: You do you actually do need to do that that that actually is smart for one for tax reasons you're actually you have to because you haveto charge interest otherwise it you irs assumes you did and then they fucking then you don't know what tax what you're paying on it because they assumed a tax anyway but also like fuck man they get everybody gives you that advice like hey if it's with family I know it sounds weird but you should just draw it up and then every time I feel like most people are like yeah but I'm not gonna do that it's fucking family and then it's like nope that sucked that situation got blown yeah

0:32:24 Tom: Unless that money's a gift, I don't think that's unwise. Like I don'T think that'S unwise, yeah

0:32:27 Thomas: But that's why my mindset my is I just decide that money doesn't exist anymore I'm like yeah fine it is a gift or it isn't whatever like if pay me or not that's the only way those are the two Two options, drop an entire fucking contract or in your mind, if you're the if you'RE the lender, just assume the money doesn't exist anymore because otherwise you're fucked. Like,

0:32:48 Eli: More more important I'll go even further because I have the same philosophy assume that this person is an elaborate con man who has only been after this money and will disappear from your life the second afterwards that way you're not disappointed I cannot tell a good good friends people I really care about who have borrowed thousands of dollars from me and never paid it back right even like the idea of paying it back one one friend who is is not particularly close anymore but would probably think of me as a friend bought a motorcycle with that loan just purchased a motor borrowed um was back when I was working at the toy store borrowed like two grand from me and then a week later bought a motorcycle I

0:33:24 Tom: Bought a motorcycle with it? Jesus Christ, I.

0:33:33 Thomas: That's a lot of money for a toy store era. Jesus.

0:33:39 Eli: I don't know how to explain this in in humble ways I was literally the greatest toy salesman on the planet earth when I was in my prime the amount of yes

0:33:47 Thomas: Awesome. Awesome.

0:33:48 Tom: Was this a commissioned gig? Were you getting commissioned on every yo -yo?

0:33:51 Eli: It was a commission it wasa commission gig I was getting a commission on every on every pair of fake thumbs and I never make more money than I made as a commission employee when iwas selling toys not once

0:33:53 Thomas: They paid him in slinkies. He got one slinky per.

0:33:58 Tom: It's all Monopoly money.

0:34:04 Thomas: And every time you've told me I've heard this before and every time you say that you sold fake thumbs, I think that's a joke like placeholder for what you did, you know, because there's no way that's a real thing.

0:34:15 Eli: Is what it was fake thumbs with little lights in them you squeeze them they light up and it makes it looks like you're

0:34:20 Thomas: It should be part of one of those sayings about how you're a good salesman. Like I sold a pair of fake thumbs to a guy who had thumbs. Plums that's how good I I sold water to the no what are those ones I can't remember there's always they're probably racist actually by now yeah yeah yeah I was trying to go to one that wasn't racially problematic and I could not oh

0:34:31 Tom: Ice cubes to Eskimos, right? Oh, no, you can't say that. Yeah, fuck. Fuck

0:34:34 Eli: Money to a jew gosh man they're really octoroon why does that phrase have octoron

0:34:43 Thomas: Every every idiom do you do that with your kids now too it's great it's part of growing and becoming less shitty as a world but there will be times where just out of nowhere you'll your will go to like this is what everyone said in 1980 fucking nine and then you're like nope and that's why nope no that's not why they say that

0:35:03 Eli: Crisscross

0:35:03 Tom: My all the time I have to be like it's crisscross applesauce this is crissross applesauCE that's what this is yeah do

0:35:07 Eli: Applesauce it's

0:35:07 Thomas: So funny I love when it catches you by surprise though we're like oh yeah that too fuck that thing geez everything we said fucking sucked uh

0:35:16 Tom: Know what I learned not that long ago from buying a house is that it's now called an owner's suite and not the master bedroom I had no idea it makes all the sense in the world when you think about it right but like that never occurred to me at all so like I'm walking through I'm like oh where's the master bedroom I'm the worst blah blah blah you know like

0:35:27 Eli: For the the best yep yep

0:35:31 Thomas: I know I think they they've I think they've adjusted that in computers, too, because like an early, you know, it's always like master and slave device, you know, in terms of the. Yeah, it'S funny.

0:35:44 Eli: It's so one of the funny things is that if you if anyone out there is a c++ nerd um new is technology porto like you're supposed to call it a porto device as opposed to a slave device but the word in code is still slave so you can there are no libraries for c++ plus so you have to put in your comments hey this is from this is in the language and I'm real sorry I love you and I also I think I voted for barack obama twice yes exactly hashtag hashtag I voted voor obama twijs no because you'll just be like the slave slave slavey slave slave slave slave you write the word slave more than twice you get real uncomfortable let me tell you

0:36:12 Thomas: Like in the comments of the code. Yeah, I would vote for Obama a third time. Oh, man. Yeah, that's as it should be. Yeah, That's good. We we barely touched on it, but I do want to say, OK, quick polling for the three bears scenario, I guess, to to kind of reiterate, uh, Eli, I think we can guess your parents or your dad, your dad at least was a Eli's right. No matter who he's in conflict with, right. Or not. Would you surprise us?

0:36:48 Eli: No they they they definitely called me out when I was wrong they stood I will say they stood behind me when there were inappropriate punishments right I had disagreements with teachers um there were certainly times where I was lippy that I probably should have gotten in trouble for it but I said something funny and so I sort of gotta gotta pass at home there's also Also, like, my parents didn't particularly believe that swearing was bad, so I got in trouble twice for swearing, and once from one of my favorite teachers, she had to send me home for the day, and I, of course, you know, being the best kid, the AAA student I was, was traumatized. I was like they

0:36:51 Thomas: Well, that's good. Yeah. Oh

0:37:28 Eli: Sent me home and my mom was like we're we're gonna go to mcdonald's you get to go to mctown I don't know how to tell you you grown -ups are allowed to say fuck so we're just gonna go mcDonald's and not talk about this

0:37:40 Thomas: I funny. I THINK WE TALKED ABOUT THIS MAYBE EARLY. NOW IT'S BEEN A FUCKING YEAR. SO I DON'T CARE IF WE TAUGHT ABOUT A YEAR AGO, Probably new people. Did I tell the story? I can't remember if it was on this or not of when Phoebe got in trouble for saying like, oh, my God, or whatever. Yeah, I think I think maybe that's when Eli, you might have told your story because it's seeming familiar. But it is going to be funny with the bad language because I don't care either. That's going to be a tough one to parent because I super don't care. And then I had to do this, like, pretend be mad at my kid because clearly.

0:37:55 Eli: You told us this story yes yes you had to be like oh phoebe wow

0:38:15 Tom: Wait this is interesting so wait a minute do you not care if your kids swear like if like phoebe started like dropping f -bombs or just because

0:38:22 Thomas: Well, I shouldn't say not care. I would say, like there's obviously a time and a place like if any, you know, if she's like, fuck you, teacher, like obviously that's not OK. But like, I don't know, man, if he gets it depends on how it happens. But if she gets a fucking detention and the thing is like, we heard her saying a bad word to her friends and we'd be like, all right, fucking who cares? I don't give a shit.

0:38:23 Tom: I do care

0:38:43 Eli: Or they fall down and they're like motherfucker I'm like that's first of all that's hilarious but but but also you do have to be like hey there are these weird social codes like you gotta follow these social codes because they're they're important right these ones don't really matter a grown -up will be like naughty naughty but like the other you can't break one code and be like don't worry grown - up rules aren't real and then later when your kid's like why do I have to wear a shirt be like oh wait no please follow the rules now oh uh I want you to to care about these ones right like because all of it's nonsense so that's why you gotta you gotta enforce like sometimes this shit's not gonna make sense and

0:38:47 Thomas: Fine. Yeah. Yeah. Really?

0:39:22 Tom: See

0:39:23 Eli: But and we'll go to mcdonald's

0:39:23 Tom: I care a lot if they swear yeah I care a lot of things where you have like up until a certain age yeah they shouldn't sway like like I it's it's um and my ex has has a very different take on this so my eight -year -old um allowed to curse as much as he would like in her home and like I I am absolutely diametrically opposed to that dime and he like I'll talk to him on the phone and he'll drop f -bombs and like just casually be like I don't fucking care and I'm just like whole what the shit what is happening like and

0:39:51 Eli: Fucking roblox right

0:39:53 Thomas: All right. That's instantly making me question this position. I didn't think that was what that meant.

0:39:59 Tom: Yeah it's so like it's It's so socially inappropriate and I don't trust kids, young kids, especially to do a good job of managing the context of their language usage and not making mistakes. And most of the world, that's going to be a problem for them. Like it just seems insane to me to open that door until they're old enough to know when it's okay to crack that door and when it'S okay to keep that door are shut so like I'm I'm much more I don't like in trouble is not something that happens in my house but I will give a correction if somebody like swears you know like hey hey watch your language you know we don't do that

0:40:35 Thomas: That's fair. Maybe that. Yeah.

0:40:38 Eli: How are we how how are we treating other people are we making other people feel comfortable right because when a little kid swears around me I have sort of a freeze moment where I'm like what do I do here here I can swear I'm really good at swearing do I swear with them do I not swear what do I do it's it's why um when I'm around children I talk like a crazy person because I never swear around kids but all my language is fucks and shits so I'll be like I'm not trying to noodle your doodle because I don't know pull your leg my brain is just like i're not trying a fuck with you and I'm like quick brain something that isn't swearing and it's like I am not horse porcupine And I'm like, well, that was nothing. But I'd read again, like I've been around the kids who have that. And there is a there is a feeling of noncompliance and aggressiveness in the presence of those kids that often makes not just other children, but adults uncomfortable.

0:41:32 Eli: And so that's where I think the correction lies is like, hey, do you think everyone's is like is this cash money? Are we all loving this moment where you just said fuck at this bat mitzvah or is it like not super chill and

0:41:32 Tom: What I I think it's good for kids just to learn the idea of what' s appropriate and what' it's not appropriate it's really useful it's really really just socially valuable for kids so it's an opportunity to give kids and understand just to be like hey look there are some things which are appropriate and some things which are inappropriate and like swearing at your age is just inappropriate right now when you get older it may be more appropriate to swear because some things we can do more older like drive that we can't do when we're younger and kids get that right And it's not complicated. Is a little bit of a nonsensical comparison? Of course it is. But kids do understand it. I've never had a problem with any of the four kids, well, three, getting them to understand that concept. But just understanding the idea of what's appropriate and what's not appropriate has an enormous amount of social value. So it's just a nice, easy kind of wedge in that door.

0:42:43 Thomas: Guess that's kind of what I was had in mind. I guess I didn't have in mind like, oh, yes, say fuck all the time. And I guess I had in mind like you wouldn't my kids won't get in trouble just for the mere existence of these words that they say you know what I mean it would be a contextual thing rather so it wouldn't be like de facto you're in trouble really hard if you ever curse it's like all right man like you gotta fucking I don't care if you're cursing with your friends but like yeah if we're fucking if we're at grandma's house or whatever like you're not that's not okay yeah

0:43:14 Eli: See I I'm in the other where I'm like look if today my son comes home and he's like fucking daniel tiger I'm gonna be like that's hilarious awesome um if he's in preschool school where like adults are gonna be uncomfortable and other kids are gonna be uncomfortable right it's about the uh the way other people feel based on that swing if it's him and me I I will tell you the first time my dad made me laugh all the time but one of the moments that sticks out in my memory the hardest is one of my sweetest memories is me and my parents were in paris you guys remember your first time in parise with your parents right um we were in Paris my mom had

0:43:24 Thomas: That's fine yeah I think my dad did not fly on an airplane for my I'm not even joking. Never during my lifetime.

0:43:55 Eli: He learned you couldn't take a tractor there and he was like I'm out um and they didn't even have mcdonald's but no we were in paris and my mom was out shopping she was supposed to be back at like one and she didn't get back till three um and I got really worried I was like seven or eight years old I got Really worried that something had happened to her because we were in this new place and I was really worried and I had this stuffed hedgehog and we had bought earlier in the day and it had a friend dad was doing it with a french accent but it was also swearing and I was crying he would be like your fucking mother said she would be here at fucking one o 'clock but she's not fucking here so I guess we will just fuck ourselves and I Was crying with laughter I mean truly I cannot remember a moment where I just laughed as hard with my dad but like again that was everyone was playing

0:43:57 Thomas: A tractor. Yeah.

0:44:40 Eli: You know everyone was having a good time so that's that's how I feel about swearing. I have a related story about swearring that's so awkward, except it happened to be this week. So this week, um, did a magic gig and I never do magic anymore professionally ever, ever, never. I don't really like gigging cause you have to interrupt people while they're eating or otherwise enjoying a party. I'm not a party guy anymore. I go to to sleep at 10 so they're like we'll start at 10 and I'm like jesus no um and I would rather throw it to my younger friends who are full -time magicians right if I can pay someone else's rent that's so much better than me showing up and being like now I have this money um this was an older client who absolutely insisted um son and had me at some younger stuff and now he wanted me for his daughter's 21st birthday so I was like okay I'll do it fine let's do it so I go to this apartment these people have more money than all the gods put together it's just insane and it is very clearly 20 somethings doing a tremendous amount of cocaine right in on every surface like barely even hiding it they had hired an open bar for their apartment so there was just this guy like clenched in the corner like a prisoner of war being like please ask me for something that That isn't cocaine.

0:46:01 Eli: Please

0:46:01 Thomas: Because there's such a thing as an open cocaine bar. I'd be. Be well

0:46:05 Eli: No, they needed a cocaine tender way more than I needed a bartender. But there was also the daughter's college, like younger than college, maybe 17 year old high school age sister who had obviously been like, I want to be at the grownup party. Now, let me be clear. I think there's nothing wrong with a cocaine party. You want to have a cocaine body, have a coke and party. Just you know remind everybody that they're gonna feel like shit the next day my issue is when you involve children in that shit I be I turn full prude I become a victorian school marm the minute children are around like drugs or sex or any of that stuff I'm like nope now must only be spelling tests and garfield the cat I'm Like I have no chill for that like no it's okay man like we We just won't give her any coke.

0:46:56 Eli: Like I have none of that. No, no, this is, and this

0:46:57 Tom: What? Who's chill about that? Are there people that are chill about that?

0:47:01 Eli: Is a huge thing in drug culture. Yes. There's a huge, huge thing. Huge thing in drag culture of like, don't worry. We don't let them have any drugs or, you know, right.

0:47:09 Thomas: I I imagine is it the is the mindset like well adults drink beers around kids all the time or drink you know so therefore

0:47:16 Tom: Yeah, I'll just I'll just go out real quick and say just that is an unequivocally wrong position. But go ahead. Like no I give no ground on that at all dude I'm right there with you yeah

0:47:21 Eli: Thank you. Exactly. But the, that is the, not mine. There's yes, exactly. So I am super crazy uncomfortable and I don't, I can't be like, Hey man, why is there a child here. Right. Cause it's just a, you know, what am I supposed to do? Um, but I do go up to the host and I'm like, right.

0:47:38 Thomas: You're just some fucking magician somebody hired

0:47:41 Eli: I'm the magician. Uh, and so I'm like, Hey, um, you know, I'm going to do a little show later for everybody. Uh I know that everyone here is swearing. Should I keep it clean? Because there's a younger person here, which is my way of saying, why is there a child in a room where I can see bags of cocaine with my eyeballs? Right. That's what I'm trying to do with this. And he's like, no, no no, no, swear as much as you like, swear as much you like. And she went on to prove exactly why this is a bad scenario. So I'm doing the show. And again, these are post -college age people. They're coked out of their minds. And so all the answers are dirty. And I don't mind doing a dirty show. I don'T mind working blue for all the adults in the room. I'M JUST UNCOMFORTABLE BECAUSE THERE'S A CHILD THERE, RIGHT? I'M just like, there is a child present.

0:48:24 Eli: We shouldn't be making these jokes in front of children. So I guess I'm running, like, a little cleaner than I maybe usually would. But their their answers are, do I think of a word? I'm thinking of blowjob. And I'm like, and everyone's like, and I'm like, this is why I don't gig anymore.

0:48:23 Tom: Man I

0:48:38 Thomas: I just be

0:48:40 Tom: Would have walked out I can't even believe you I would've eli I feel you so I would have been like nope I gotta go all right but go yeah oh zero

0:48:47 Eli: So, so much of my soul wanted to do this. It's so much of my salt. So, but here, here was the moment of just staggering horror, right? I'm doing my big final trick, right. And I'm, like, Hey, you took a word. I get the, they get a book from their shelf. If they look at any word in the book, I'm going to tell you what it is. Right. And so I'm like, okay, this is finally a clean trick. I can involve the sister, make her feel welcome. She'll get a big round of applause. And like, it's not some horrible, dirty thing. So I'm like, Hey, do you want to help with this one? She's like, yeah. And I'm like, great. Go get a word. Come on, go get the book. Come next to me. And I'm thinking of the word and I start to write it down. And this is what happens. Really put yourself in my shoes here. Live in the horror. I'm I'm starting to write down the word. I'm 35 years old. She goes, if if you get this right I'm going to give you a blowjob.

0:48:51 Tom: Percent would have stayed oh what

0:49:38 Eli: Yeah, from a child who is maybe 17 years old and

0:49:43 Tom: See and that's why our position on no is the right position

0:49:49 Thomas: Like, well, nevermind trick over. Okay. Oh, I got it wrong. Oh,

0:49:53 Eli: Yes, it's so close to that. It's so closely that luckily I don't know what maybe somewhere deep in the the medulla ambangata of one of the adults in this room they were like wait a second a child just offered a blow job to an adult so he was like uh I'll take her and they like left I don't know when I kidnapped this child and ran away but I I literally I stole from my buddy man I held perfectly still I just froze held perfectly still until the child was gone and I was like someone else pick a book I was not going to acknowledge the situation that it happened we just picked another book and we did the magic trick with someone else and she turned I

0:50:17 Tom: Christ

0:50:37 Thomas: She turned into one of Tom's exes. I don't, Whoa. There was someone here. Was there, there was someone here a moment ago. Weird. That was my magic trick. She's now not here.

0:50:40 Tom: And they disappeared like magic I

0:50:42 Eli: Made a child disappear oh right gentlemen before we go what do you call a book club that's been stuck on the same book for years church it's

0:51:06 Tom: That's good all so I got it sort of like this isn't this is a me being a kid story not like a story of like one of our kids but eli your your your magic story reminded me of this um this is one of those stories that like and it's like a lot of my childhood where like you have to like look back on and you're like oh it's

0:51:27 Thomas: It's a Tom story. So it's you telling the story.

0:51:29 Tom: It's a tom

0:51:30 Eli: A dumb story

0:51:30 Tom: Story but this one is this

0:51:30 Thomas: So now we've categorized it into Tom is the person talking right now.

0:51:31 Eli: Telling the story okay good to know

0:51:35 Tom: So so There are there are parts of the story that I want to make sure that I that parts of this scenario I gotta paint for the main show but there was I used to go my mother used to live down in Tampa, Florida um and so my dad lived in Chicago after I moved in with my dad my mom stayed in Tampa and she was very often destitute so she she was very often like living with friends or, you know, otherwise struggling like to to make her way before like getting on her feet for my mom eventually became like renting a trailer in Tampa, which is a pretty desperate getting on your feet kind of kind of a solution. So just kind of paint a picture. There was one time she sent for us. So she she did to her credit. She scrounged up some money. She bought some plane tickets. She sent for us to spend a week or two with her over the summer Tampa. We were off of school. So no better time to go to Tampa, Florida than like fucking July. No more wonderful time. But she rarely had time off of work. And so we'd go down to visit her, but she

0:52:37 Tom: Would have to go To work every day.

0:52:38 Thomas: Whoa. Now she's working. OK,

0:52:40 Tom: Yeah, she would work.

0:52:40 Thomas: What did she do? What? This is wow. Huge, if

0:52:43 Tom: I don't remember what she did. Yeah I don't remember what her job was but this one time we went to visit her she was living with a friend this woman named marissa and I don'T know that she and my mom were very good friends or even terribly friendly and where this lady marissa lived and I'll tell more about this on the main show was like this really fucked up house like near these like woods in florida by this lake it was all fucking nuts um marissa when we when my mom would leave for work she would tell us to go play outside and not to come back inside until my mom came back from work so my mom would leave like nine o 'clock and like we'd have to be out of the house from nine to say five when my mom got back so we'd Have to play outside we weren't allowed back in the house during this time which is kind of shit like in florida it's fucking hot there's frequently just a thunderstorm in the the afternoon in the summer there's yeah like I can't even I'll tell that's like there's alligator stories I'll talk about like

0:53:35 Thomas: Fucking alligators.

0:53:40 Tom: Later but that are part of this particular trip I

0:53:40 Eli: Today's not the day for alligator stories today

0:53:45 Tom: Literally don't know how to express to you how much it is a miracle we survived this two weeks in Florida like literally survived it but like we were there and so this lady Marissa is like how like she she has people over so my brother and I are outside we're playing in the garage trying to like keep out of the direct sunlight we're in there's nothing to play with by the way there's no toys or anything so we're just like we got rocks and like we're throwing shit at stuff and like playing with the wildlife and trying to catch lizards and like just whatever you can do to occupy yourself for eight hours in the Florida sun so we're doing this thing and she has people over so she has over at least at least two other couples and she had a guy there herself so

0:53:55 Thomas: Jesus

0:54:07 Eli: Alive

0:54:28 Thomas: Question. Is she feeding you at least? How are you eating? Yeah yeah

0:54:31 Tom: There's I don't remember that so I don't want to like I don't wanta say no BUT I don't remember coming inside and we and I know we weren't allowed inside because we had to pee outside so she's like she was like she'd be like just go around a tree like she did not want us insides she was not this is not a good situation right this is a bad situation

0:54:34 Eli: It's real it's Real Florida Project up in here it's not it sounds dope it sounds super cool cool

0:54:52 Tom: This is the part that like I had to look back at this as an adult and realize like what had happened. So one day it's the middle of the week and I'm outside and I got to take a shit. Like I just like, it's one of those things where I'm just like I absolutely have got to take a shit. And I knew I wasn't allowed back in the house, but I had to go back in the house. You know, so like I had to go back in. And so I was like, fuck it. I was like, I'm either going to shit my pants or I got to go inside the house to use the toilet. You know? So I go inside the house and I walked in and through what I now know was the opening ceremonies, shall we say, of a group sex orgy situation so

0:55:09 Thomas: Jesus christ really that's I'll be honest of the things you could have said when I walked in the door you know like that's that's not the worst I'll just say that's it's not the worst like there's I was prepared for like there an active dismemberment of a body just like everybody heroin needles everywhere. Like, if anything, at least this is a bit of good, clean fun is all.

0:55:35 Eli: Interesting yeah okay that is worse that is worse I

0:55:56 Tom: Now I don't know if there were that yeah I yeah it was and I had no idea that that's what I had walked into because I didn't like I was a pretty young kid so I'm like in you know second or third grade so I never I didn't like really process those images in that way at all like but like it was very clearly that's what was happening like just it was like

0:56:16 Thomas: Until the hypnotist regressed you and you're like, wait a minute, this is hidden memory singing

0:56:20 Tom: You just like it's like it's you'll look back and I'm like oh no like that dude's dick was out like and her hand was on it and like they were all like in a pile together most of them were mostly clothed but I mean it was the opening ceremonies for an orgy right so that's like what they were getting up to

0:56:33 Thomas: The national anthem.

0:56:35 Eli: Was gonna say sounds like a shitty orgy because you know the ones I've been to you're laying out the air mattresses you're pointing out where the water is

0:56:43 Thomas: The exits, yeah, the fire extinguishers,

0:56:45 Tom: Why so it was just it was it was one of those things like where you look back on and you're like wait a minute that magic show was inappropriate like wait a minute like I know I know why I wasn't allowed in the house during the day because everybody was getting fucked that's why I wasn't allowed in the house during the day

0:57:01 Thomas: I get, I don't know, do you trust that memory, because, like, what what has been this situation, that you, like every day for two weeks, your wife's friend, or your mom's friend is having an orgy, like what, the other days were orgy rehearsal, all right, everybody, two, three, four, oh, fuck, there's a kid here, damn it, stop, stop.

0:57:17 Eli: Yeah dress walk through room cool

0:57:11 Tom: I just think that that was that day I think she just didn't want us there I think he was very unfriendly to us no she was like I don't know what her situation was with my mom or why she let my mom stay there but she was very hostile to us like she didn't let us eat her food like was super like she was super hostile to being there and like pretty yeah like pretty openly so

0:57:34 Thomas: There's, there's jizz in it. That's why.

0:57:31 Eli: Tom I feel like I don't get to say this enough but I want you to know I mean it from my heart I wish there was a hell for your mom to be in I really do I'm sad there's not I'm sad she just gets to be dead I'm I'm coming around on the christian worldview just for your mom all

0:57:56 Tom: Yeah it was it was not an ideal uh two-week scenario so but yeah it was like it is one of those stories where like you look back on you're like I walked into an orgy once when I was in second or third grade that was a weird thing to do that's a weird memory to sort of like have tucked away in the back of the old bean yeah Yeah.

0:58:18 Clip: Want to meet sexy DILFs in your area? Email the dads at DearOldDads.com or, better yet, send us a message on Patreon. You can follow us on all social media by checking the links in the show notes. And if you need more podcasts in your life, you can find Tom on Cognitive Dissonance, Thomas on Serious Inquiries Only, and Eli on Godawful Movies and all the Puzzle in the Thunderstorm shows. Dear Old Dads is edited and produced by my favorite DILF, Tom Smith, who also wrote and recorded the intro music, which is used with his permission. This podcast is a production of Daddy Issues LLC. Copyright 2022. All rights reserved.

0:58:57 Eli: Do want to record those, that's what they say.

0:58:58 Thomas: I think we should probably record. Had me going a half hour earlier and I can't, I don't even know. My medication hasn't kicked in yet. I don't know what, what button does that? Who am I? What work is this? Are you listening to the to the if books could kill yeah it's so good oh of course yeah I love that show uh

0:59:09 Eli: Well love languages yeah I

0:59:10 Tom: It looks good yeah do you like that I love that show yeah yeah yeah I also

0:59:15 Eli: Also listen to things that aren't me love it my favorite one is ready

0:59:17 Tom: My favorite