WTW151: Remember the Anti-Woke Amazon? Yeah, Us Neither.

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:03 Clip: What's so scary about the woke mob, how often you just don't see them coming.

0:00:11 Clip: Anywhere you see diversity, equity, and inclusion, you see Marxism and you see woke principles being pushed.

0:00:19 Clip: Wokeness is a virus more dangerous than any pandemic hands down. The woke monster is here and it's coming for everything, everything, and everything. Instead of go-go boots, the seductress green M&M will now wear sneakers.

0:00:41 Thomas: And welcome to Where There's Woke. I'm Thomas, that's Lydia. How you doing? Wow, was

0:00:45 Lydia: You know, basking in the glory of things falling apart in MAGA world. Because it's actually, I don't know, there's like little bits of stuff happening. Trying. I've done my best.

0:00:53 Thomas: That a thematic hello everyone guys, everyone be real encouraging that was so good

0:01:01 Lydia: Thank Thank you. Yeah, in our last episode we talked about like the stumbles from the anti-woke university, right? University of Austin. I thought it'd be fun to kind of stay in the parallel economy, as people like to call it, um, and talk about another, I mean, I would say failure honestly, in like the anti-woke marketplace.

0:01:22 Thomas: Are a lot of them. We kind of had a list going of all the failed right-equivalent businesses?

0:01:28 Lydia: But I think what's interesting on this one too is like, there's... there's always grift related to these things, but I think there's like an even more remarkable level of grift that I'm excited to get into that I wasn't expecting as I was prepping this episode. So, yeah. Yeah Right, with that little teaser in mind, though, do you remember Public Square? Do you remember hearing about it back in the day.

0:01:46 Thomas: I think I kind of do, but, yeah, barely.

0:01:52 Thomas: It's been a long time, right? Well, since it launched, when did it launch? Okay.

0:01:54 Lydia: That's right. No, it's technically, but like nobody

0:01:58 Thomas: That's a half a decade.

0:01:58 Lydia: Really heard about it until a couple of years after that. But let's go ahead and start with this clip kind of reminding everybody what public square is.

0:02:07 Clip: A million Americans are flocking to a new marketplace. It's called Public Square and it's making it easier for conservatives to buy from 50,000 companies that share their values. Joining us now with more is Public Square CEO Michael Seifert. Michael, it's great to see you this morning. We've had a conversation here on the show about Public Square in the past, and I know that I got a call this week from a friend of mine saying, look, man, I don't know what it is. I don't know what it is, but there's an opportunity here. There's an optimistic opportunity for companies and individuals, for entrepreneurs that are ready to reflect or at least not offend American values.

0:02:45 Clip: Well, you're absolutely right. And not only is there a lot of excitement from obviously millions of consumers right now because they feel like there are hopeful alternatives to many of their favorite brands, but the entrepreneurs themselves are recognizing. We've had thousands of them join the platform this week and say, there is an unaddressed market here. If you are someone in this country who has more family values, loves your country, loves the Constitution and the values that it protects, there are businesses that would

0:02:52 Thomas: Millions. Nay, billions. Oh, see, that's why it's not for me because I have no family values. I hate the constitution I hate our freedoms quite a bit can't stand them so this sounds like it's not for me then okay and I don't, and I have no morals. What do you say? I always love that. It's like, yeah, man, that's everyone, we we all have value family and it's like in the constitution so by

0:03:23 Lydia: Family values yep yep yep

0:03:33 Clip: Love to reach you. And these businesses are recognizing that that community and that trust that could be implemented in these transactions is a really strong desire in the marketplace. And in turn, we are witnessing this true patriotic economy grow in a massive way that I think is taking everyone by surprise and surpassing all expectations. It's really exciting. Michael, I don't know if you... That

0:03:54 Thomas: Now it must be, god, huge, right?

0:03:56 Lydia: Oh boy, I don't want to spoil it, But

0:03:59 Thomas: Must be the new Amazon? All

0:04:02 Lydia: No. Spoiler alert. And then I want to go a little bit further in this interview. We can chat about, you know, a little bit more about what to expect.

0:04:15 Clip: The other thing I'll say too, Will, is that people are recognizing that whether you're looking for household cleaning supplies or a new pair of pants, you should be able to do that with companies that will give you a sense of satisfaction knowing that you're not funding your opposition, and instead you're spending money with people that share your worldview and want the same hopeful future for the country that you do. What is that? Really quickly, Michael, on the way out, what is it that we share?

0:04:40 Clip: Is it our values? Is it patriotism? Is it conservatism? What is Public Square in terms of sharing my values, if you were telling me, hey, this is where you should come, Public Square? Yeah, great question. So if you go to PublicSQ .com, you'll see right away that we are a marketplace that's pro-life, pro-family, and pro-freedom. If you love our country, our Constitution, and the values that that wonderful document protects, you're going to love this marketplace. This is far deeper than politics. This is principled. And we're having a blast creating America's marketplace. There's a definite demand, deficit need.

0:04:39 Thomas: Freedom and the troops what's the grift I mean we don't know god

0:05:15 Lydia: Incredible.

0:05:16 Thomas: It's, you know, I underestimate, it's got to be even bigger than I thought by now, just because of that pitch.

0:05:22 Lydia: Yeah, I mean, this was going to be the anti-woke Amazon, like you said, right? Is potentially bigger than Amazon, a whole parallel economy. Donald Trump Jr. got involved. That was a big deal. That's kind of, you know, that 2023 timeframe is when he started speaking about it. And it was built with this idea. Michael Seifert created the idea in 2021 that conservatives could actually like outcompete woke companies, that, you know, it's.

0:05:50 Thomas: Just sorry to correct you that they could outcompete the normal fucking companies there aren't the woke companies it doesn't exist and

0:05:58 Lydia: You're right, you're right. They launch this, is, are people actually using it? And so Michael Seifert, the founder of Public Square, went on Fox Business to talk about that a little bit.

0:06:10 Clip: Less than eight months since our national launch, we've become the largest network of patriotic consumers and businesses to ever exist, and we are excited for our next chapter. Does it sell? Does it work? Absolutely. I believe that the answer to that is undoubtedly yes. If you hear from our businesses, tens of thousands on the platform,

0:06:30 Thomas: I'm sorry. Undoubtedly. Yes. It's undoubtedly.

0:06:36 Lydia: Oops.

0:06:37 Thomas: Yes, what?

0:06:38 Lydia: Yeah.

0:06:41 Clip: They share stories with us daily about how their profits are increasing and their exposure to a group of consumers that are values aligned with them is only increasing through this experience. They've had hard times advertising on platforms like Facebook and YouTube, and they're grateful for a platform that not only respects their values but also will help support them in their endeavor to make this country a better place. So, yes, the patriot economy is not only a fruitful one and a liberating one, it's also a lucrative one. So it's Public Square, it's a SPAC deal, and you're going public, it is a $200 DEAL.

0:07:16 Lydia: We'll talk about that.

0:07:17 Clip: $200 million deal? When do you go public?

0:07:21 Clip: That's a great question. We are expected to close in Q3. We're proud to partner with CLBR, listed on the New York... Ultimately, our desire to go public is rooted in this strong urge to be a company that's by the people, for the people, and owned by we the people. We hear you. Michael Seifert, thank you very much for being with us. Best of luck with the podcast.

0:07:40 Thomas: So socialism. Cool. Where's my piece? Where's my cut oh

0:07:44 Lydia: Yeah you know I actually used them a couple years ago as like a bit for Matreon with Puzzle and Thunderstorm because I wanted to find stupid MAGA coffee to like try and make the guys make it. Yeah yeah I used Public Square to find that. So we're gonna get into all the bits and and pieces all the nooks and crannies all the stupid things in this stupid marketplace that they tried to create that spoiler alert again failed spectacularly um we got to take a break before we're gonna do the rest of it yep oh

0:08:15 Thomas: But I, how do I avoid this break? I can't stand it.

0:08:20 Lydia: Well, you should go to patreon.com/wherethereswoke and then you'll be able to do it

0:08:24 Thomas: Don't know I'm skeptical what else will I get if I'm there wow but

0:08:27 Lydia: Bonuses ad free episodes bonuses are undying love and affection uh

0:08:35 Thomas: Wait, do they share my values? Do they value over on, where there's, patreon.com/wherethereswoke, do they love the Constitution, their families, and freedom? Well, all shit now I have to now I have to shop on patreon.com/wherethereswoke, or, or I hate my country? Darn.

0:08:48 Lydia: And if you're a listener if you'RE a listener then yeah yeah you go clearly

0:08:56 Thomas: Okay well I better do that everyone follow me all right I'll take a break and then get to it

0:09:08 Lydia: We get into the company itself, I just want to do very quickly, run down some of the names involved, um, Michael Seifert, who we saw speaking in those clips, he's the founder and was the CEO, public face through 2025, through the calendar year 2025. Trump Jr., will be talking about him a lot, in case you don't know who he is, son of Donald Trump. Anyway, he's an early investor in this company. He joined the board in December 2024, but was vocal about it prior the board as well. And when there was a rumor that he was going to be joining the board, the stock doubled in price before it was even confirmed. People were very excited about his involvement.

0:09:52 Lydia: Omid Malik is talking about way more than I anticipated when I started putting together the research for this episode.

0:09:59 Thomas: I don't think I know who that is hmm

0:10:00 Lydia: He's 1789 Capital with Donald Trump Jr., which is a venture capital firm. The reason why he matters for this story, from the beginning, is he's the reason the company went public, because they mentioned a SPAC, which is special purpose acquisition company. And the only reason they were able to go public is because they were acquired by Columbia Acquisition Corporate

0:10:23 Thomas: I gonna say he said oh we're going you like other stock thing yeah I noticed that like piggybacking yeah

0:10:33 Lydia: A different company yep yep allowed, but, um, basically through a $200 million deal, they were able to go public and like say that they went public, which is like a big deal for companies to go public, like to be invited to go public and have that opportunity, and they, they just basically like kind of bought their way via Donald Trump Jr.'s business partner.

0:10:55 Thomas: Well I, I think any company could go public. It's about being on the exchange. Yeah.

0:11:01 Thomas: No, I'm saying the thing the thing that's, is, is being on the exchange. No, not the merely going public just

0:11:06 Lydia: They are. OK, gotcha. Gotcha. Are some other folks involved. We might touch on them a little bit. So just so you're familiar with the names, Blake Masters, Nick Ayers, Caitlin Long. Those are board members. They are all people that have been long affiliated with MAGA. They're giving that sort of credibility for the right wing. Donald Trump Jr., when he was interviewed with Axios, and were a number of these other people when they were talking about this launch in 2023, which is part of also this media storm that Michael Seifert did on Fox, said that he wanted a place that, quote, gives conservatives a place where they feel good about actually spending their money. Americans don't feel celebrated in marketplaces. So they wanted to give them a place where they no longer felt ostracized.

0:11:50 Thomas: Just buy your stupid shit. Do you have to be celebrated every time you buy something?

0:11:57 Lydia: Yeah.

0:11:58 Thomas: Apparently not, though, because I'm sure this didn't actually do well.

0:12:02 Lydia: Huh. But I do, they filmed a little thing when they went public that I thought we could watch part of this. It's, it's fun.

0:12:12 Thomas: Fun. In. The music got me. This sounds important. The

0:12:18 Clip: We're back in New York City. We left our comfortable state of Florida to come to the People's Republic, but we're actually here to head down to the New York Stock Exchange. We're taking Public Square public. We're just trying to, you know, get more people out there, support some of these great patriotic small businesses and consumers who want to support them and just really unite them. This is the culmination of a lot of hard work. I think a lot people view going public as sort of an exit or a finish line, and for us it's fundamentally the opposite. We have a country to save. We have mountains to conquer. We have challenges to overcome. And we can't wait to do that with now our consumers being owners in the platform.

0:12:56 Thomas: Wait to do that with you spending money on us.

0:12:57 Clip: We never could have done this in this timeline either. Without a SPAC. I don't know that anyone's done it in this timeline, literally, I mean, it's been over a year with us, but we didn't even start this conversation until a couple of months into that. I mean this is like less than nine months. I've been a believer in this movement for a long time. I mean it started off obviously as a political movement, but then you see the cancellations of people by banks. It's happened to me and some of my own businesses.

0:13:20 Clip: You see it in the insurance companies. Half the market's been ostracized by woke corporate America. Half the country and the entire country really has been spoon -fed indoctrination and ridiculousness and ESG, and we wanted to do the opposite.

0:13:30 Thomas: Trying to do his dad now.

0:13:32 Clip: We wanted to create a place where people can find businesses and where businesses can find consumers that share a common values base. That didn't exist.

0:13:41 Thomas: He's just trying to do the impression

0:13:44 Clip: Frankly, again, those people were ostracized. Publixware, it links those people, and they're going to take the time to do that because those people have been dejected. They've been left behind, and мы want to make sure that they have access to be able to support the people that they believe in and that share their values and vice versa.

0:13:44 Thomas: That's so funny uh -huh sure

0:13:59 Lydia: Okay, pause for a second. I want us to skip forward, though, in this same clip. Mean, they show Omid Malik as part of this as well, but I want you to watch when they ring the bell. Listen, now listen.

0:14:13 Thomas: Pre

0:14:33 Lydia: USA. USA. Oh, God. Anyway, so, no, just dorky.

0:14:32 Thomas: Yeah someone was gonna say something why was I listening oh

0:14:42 Lydia: Just them saying USA over and over and over again.

0:14:44 Thomas: Is that their company usa wow yeah

0:14:47 Lydia: Do feel like, you know, that the owner of the SPAC is someone that Donald Trump Jr. owns another company with, it's like really just feels, again, you I guess networking, right? If you know the right people, you can kind of do whatever you want. This is seen like as like a huge accomplishment.

0:15:06 Thomas: That's what I was gonna say it was funny when it was I like forget if you said it or if the clip upset at, but it was like, oh, Jr. was signed on, then investors go out. And it's funny that that's just because of who he is and that he'll get favorable treatment. It has nothing to do, he's not like a good businessman or, you know, it's nothing to deal with that. It's just literally, oh cool, just nepotism.

0:15:20 Lydia: Pin in that. Yep. Yep. Gosh. Yeah. No, no. Like major pin in that. We're going to spend a lot of time talking about some of that stuff later. They go public, and that was 2023, 2023. March 2024, they acquired a company called Credova, which is a buy now pay later firm. Particularly they are focused on, it's not like a firm or Klarna, right, like, I use buy now pay laters, you know, for different things and stuff, I find them really effective, but this, this company yeah that this company in particular is focused on doing loans for firearms. Okay. The deal was done all stock, and the owner of Credova is Dusty Wunderlich, which is also a great name. His personal website, it says, Christ follower, devoted husband, proud father, anti-fragile entrepreneur, vocational economist, and cap libertarian, aspiring, oh, maybe,

0:15:53 Thomas: Up tons of debt tens of thousands and oh a narco cap is that what that is

0:16:24 Lydia: I don't know, aspiring philosopher, backcountry hunter, mountaineer. It's a lot of things to put on that.

0:16:25 Thomas: Narco capital there's a lot of things. Pets

0:16:34 Lydia: A little side note, the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau actually had launched an investigation into, around the time that they were acquired by Public Square. And they said that, quote, consumers were being misled about Credova's financing of pets and ammunition. That's what I read. And I was like, what? What's happening? Yeah.

0:16:53 Thomas: Finance my dog yeah I guess

0:16:57 Lydia: What is happening? But wouldn't you know it, come August 2025, Public, from Public Square, met with CFPB and the probe was dropped. So the investigation was launched during the Biden administration and then into the Trump administration. You have Public Square meeting with CFPB, and it's let go. So, see, Square framed it as political persecution, by the way, that Credova was being investigated at all. Closed door meeting. It was like not a big deal at all, you reasonable thing that they would be looking into that nobody really knew about, but political persecution. Narrative that happened as Biden in office and conservatives weren't really, that they are being victimized, they are being persecuted, they're being ostracized from everything and everybody. And hence the reason we need to create this parallel economy, wouldn't you know it, post-Trump, once he's inaugurated, things actually shifted, and there was a mass movement to use Public Square against itself by a lot of left-leaning people, where they, being elected, and they were like, you know, what companies in my zip code are you, self-select to go on the Public Square. Public Square does not just like gather you up.

0:18:15 Thomas: Don't, you maybe you should explain exactly what it is, because I, I thought it was like an on Amazon, but it sounds like it's not.

0:18:20 Lydia: So it's kind of like the reverse where Public Square isn't finding you. You specifically like go on it. So this was actually detailed in a Huffington Post article because there was someone who who was working for a bank, and the bank said, and this is in California actually, hey, can you look into how we can get our business listed on Public Square? The user side of things, super easy to use, like you just enter your zip code, and then it shows you businesses near you that specifically want to be publicly publicly associated with this. You out to Public Square saying you would like to sell your product or list your business or whatever. There was another business that spoke about their experience where they had painted Trump's, you the fight pose or whatever and they said that when they reached out to list their business to sell that painting they get a call back from public square from employees there that want to know about why he painted things of like Biden and Kamala Harris to kind of vet are you actually conservative enough to be listed on here so there's kind of a little bit of back back and forth. And that's what that individual who was working on behalf of his bank to try and get them on the website found out as well. So when people were so upset about Trump being elected and after the inauguration and everything, this individual actually like went to Reddit because people were like, how do I find out? Like, you the coffee shop near me like do the owners support this? Like did they vote for this? And he was like, oh, this might actually be a good use for this. Why don't you try checking public square and you can look

0:18:28 Thomas: Soviet Russia. No. Oh,

0:20:02 Lydia: Up your zip code and find out like what businesses like specifically asked to be in this conservative marketplace.

0:20:03 Thomas: I see. So where to not spend your money.

0:20:10 Lydia: Exactly. And so people characterize it as like it kind of became like a green book for liberals about how to avoid conservatives and, you impact the economy that way. And I love that. I think that's like so smart, such a good use of it. Exactly And the opposite of what Public Square was trying to do when they're like trying to I mean, I guess they they don't care about getting liberals money.

0:20:30 Thomas: I mean, it is kind of that is kind of what I was trying to do. Like, don't have your values, man. So we're trying to we're not accidentally do you a disservice by shopping at your places because, you You know, we don't have your values.

0:20:43 Lydia: But Yeah. But I mean there's comments of people like finding out that their dentist was listed on there and they're They're like, all right, going to go find a new dentist now. You know, your favorite coffee shop or something. You find out that the owners are publicly supportive.

0:20:48 Thomas: My God. All right. If your favorite coffee shop is MAGA, that's on you because there's no way the coffee is actually good, you know.

0:21:01 Lydia: I mean, this individual that spoke about their favorite coffee shop was actually from California. So I don't know. I think it can be, I don' t know. Guess the coffee I bought was terrible.

0:21:10 Thomas: Your coffee is not made by someone with a gender fluid identity, with a bunch of piercings, who's super cool, it's not going to be as good. I'm just saying. Your That's fault. That's, you Know, I hope that person learned a lesson.

0:21:23 Lydia: -hmm. But it wasn't just like liberals finding out, hey, all these businesses in my area are pieces of crap and I don't want to spend my money there anymore. And the businesses are suffering on that end. It to me a lot of mismanagement. But I think, again, is like for this underlying grift that we see all the time. Um the collapse of public square is so spectacular it is so incredible um they went public in you know towards the middle of 2023

0:21:36 Thomas: Nazis in your area. Oh, spoilers. Let me just pause for a sec to say, so they're just like a yellow pages, but for Nazis, a white pages.

0:22:04 Lydia: Or a yelp I think is like how some people have characterized it a yulp because there's probably ratings and things But yeah, for Nazis, exactly. You got it.

0:22:14 Thomas: Like, I almost had a joke, like, like a dog whistle Yelp. And now that's nothing. Nevermind.

0:22:19 Lydia: Brown pages.

0:22:21 Thomas: Um, so that's like not an amazing business idea, like even if like the businesses that are like, we will just list all of the businesses, probably aren't doing like amazing, because there's the internet right and google owns everything so If you're right away, you're like, I got a great business idea, take away most of the possibility of revenue and then do that tired business idea, it's like, well, that's even worse, man, that's dumb. Only Donald Trump Jr. would, would invest in something like that. Wow.

0:22:48 Lydia: Street Journal actually wrote a piece about this that's pretty good, just a couple months ago, where, this is the tagline, Public Square racked up costs before shifting into fintech, and its stock has cratered by 99% since it went public. Yikes. Yeah, yeah. Reported cumulative losses of nearly $160 million since they went public. They have been unprofitable every single year. You look at what they spent the money on, wouldn't you know it, starting in 2024, uh

0:23:20 Thomas: If you go public we can know all that stuff huh that's in their reports like

0:23:24 Lydia: Exactly. All the SEC filings. In 2024, right after Trump won the presidential election. So, you know, like towards the tail end of 2024, Public Square started paying Donald Trump Jr. $42,000 a month in consulting fees. When I read this at first, I thought it said $42 dozen dollars in consulting fees. And I assumed a year. And then I reread it, was, was like, oh, crap, a month?

0:23:49 Thomas: Be honest that's probably the best money they spent of all the things you're gonna say that's probably the only that is probably the most money they spend

0:23:55 Lydia: Was making more than the founder and CEO of the company. In addition, Nick Ayers, who we mentioned at the top, one of the board members, and also firm by Omid Malik, who, again, we talked about as helping them become public through his SPAC that he had. They were each paid hundreds of thousands of dollars by Public Square for consulting work and other services. In 2025, Donald ended up getting like $500,000 in consulting fees. I think Nick Ayers got like 400-something thousand. There's a lot, like specifically about the stock price change, that I'm trying to understand. Maybe you can kind of help me figure this out. Yeah, it went down by a lot.

0:24:37 Thomas: I went down Here, I'll help, down is bad, up is good. Oh, yeah this crap okay

0:24:44 Lydia: A split. I don't know a lot about stock. So, they did something in July 2026, that it was, it a one for 15. So their share count went from over $50 million to about $3.3 million.

0:25:02 Thomas: So it like increases the stock price, so it's like you're, you're dividing the stock by 15 and multiplying the value, right? Something like that. Yeah.

0:25:10 Lydia: But when I look at the split adjusted stock price, try to keep things even, right?

0:25:16 Thomas: Because that keeps yeah yeah no

0:25:17 Lydia: All things being equal. It went from a peak of $210.30 to $5.46.

0:25:28 Thomas: That's still not good oh

0:25:29 Lydia: That seems really, really bad.

0:25:32 Thomas: You know what it is, so I'm just refreshing on, on why they do that, uh, get delisted if you get too low, so major exchanges have a minimum bid price. Yeah.

0:25:42 Lydia: Yeah, and I did read in the Wall Street Journal article that they were getting warnings that they were about to fall off the stock exchange.

0:25:48 Thomas: They don't, they don't, have, some of those exchanges don't have a lot of time for, like, you're a penny stock, they're like, all right, we're the, you know, NASDAQ, or whatever, like, they're not going to put a penny stock on it. Yeah.

0:25:58 Lydia: From the Wall Street Journal, the net losses dwarfed its revenues. After going public in 2023 through the SPAC, Malik SPAC. It has posted full year net losses of $36.6 million in 2025 and $57.6 million in 2024. In the first half of 2026, it lost $12.1 million.

0:26:17 Thomas: See, that's why, like, I don't even think the Donald Trump Jr. money sounds like all that much in terms of this story. Like, that just sounds like they lost tons of money on stuff. Okay.

0:26:27 Lydia: Hold your horses. Versus most, the money that was being spent was on compensation consulting agreements.

0:26:33 Thomas: Trump Jr.'s nose, going right up his nose. Yeah. Oh who else did they get oh

0:26:40 Lydia: Was it. Of the money is being spent on, as I said, some of those board members that were getting paid for consulting fees and Donald Trump Jr. junior. And then, you know, the CEO was making $300 ,000 and stuff. So it's like on payroll and, you know some other like administrative expenses, but it primarily it's those consulting agreements. In 2024, those costs were nearly double the revenues for that year. That seems unsustainable.

0:26:43 Thomas: Then how are they losing all that? Oh, okay.

0:27:10 Thomas: Yeah. Just your consulting stuff? Like all that's in salaries?

0:27:13 Lydia: Yeah consulting and payroll yeah

0:27:16 Thomas: Yeah, no, that's not good.

0:27:17 Lydia: Um, Q3 of 2025, the, of Public Square formally classified the marketplace and brand segments, the reason that the company existed, as discontinued operations. They just shut it down. They listed it as an impairment, which I think we talked about yeah the

0:27:37 Thomas: Yeah. It's kind of like the movie thing. Yeah.

0:27:40 Lydia: WB stuff. Yeah. Yeah, that happened, they cut roughly 50% of staff over the course of, you know, I to eight months. And

0:27:49 Thomas: Much of their consulting, like staff, or just like, okay, but we keep in all these high-paid consultants to do nothing. Oh yeah. So this is just a grift. It was just a cash out. Can make more from a flop than you can from a hit.

0:28:01 Lydia: And, you on to your I don't know what other things. Hold onto your horses. You got to hold on to some other things, so the layoffs that they did primarily affected, obviously, like the marketing team, because they completely are changing their entire strategy yeah exactly and then their streaming show which they had for some reason called Public Square Live, and hosted by, drumroll please, Aaron Scavino, the

0:28:12 Thomas: Don't have anything to market. Yeah. Streaming show. Uh scavino I know that name

0:28:29 Lydia: Yeah. Don Scavino, Scavino's wife, also the person who's in charge of all of the art for the embassies that, yeah, yeah.

0:28:31 Thomas: Aaron scavina oh that person wow

0:28:38 Lydia: The like, we're taking down all the woke art and taking back our embassys.

0:28:39 Thomas: Why do I think she was named something aaron that was her name Oh wow.

0:28:44 Lydia: Pro -America. Yeah. Aaron Scaveno. Yep.

0:28:47 Thomas: I'm just so bad with names, it's a separate topic. Anyway, that's amazing. Wow, it's all one grift. It's all One World of Grift, everybody.

0:28:53 Lydia: And incredible is this too? Like, she, like, was hosting this show, and they had just started a couple months before, and they were being hosted on Real America's Voice. It's a right-wing television channel. I think we've watched stuff that have been hosted on it.

0:29:07 Thomas: Was listed on, what's the face? It's listed on Public Square.

0:29:11 Lydia: -huh. Yeah. God, this is so depressing. So, I mean, well, so War Room with Steve Bannon is on Real America's Voice. The Charlie Kirk Show is on real America's voice. Ted Nugent's Spirit Campfire.

0:29:22 Thomas: Spirit Campfire.

0:29:22 Lydia: Yep. Who knows? They officially have White House press corps access because, of course, they do. And This world is not real. Yeah, they, they, hosting Public Square Live hosted by Aaron Scavino, which no longer existed when they had to lay off everybody because their stock went down by like 99%.

0:29:41 Thomas: And is that good or bad? I forget. I know I just told you. Down is bad. Okay, yeah, yeah! That's not good.

0:29:47 Lydia: I thought you were actually

0:29:48 Thomas: I'm just kidding.

0:29:48 Lydia: Asking. I was like, what's happening? So things were not going well for Public Square.

0:29:54 Thomas: Yeah. I think they'll make it. So they'll get in the third act, everybody. They're going to pull through.

0:30:04 Lydia: In January 2026, ended up resigning as CEO. You know, the person who founded Public Square, he has left. He has not really talked about leaving. I'm sure he signed some things as he left. He's now with this company called X Strategies LLC, which I had to look up because I was like, what in the world?

0:30:20 Thomas: I don't know. Doesn't Elon own everything

0:30:23 Lydia: I thought it was, but it's actually a political and corporate consulting firm started by Alex Bruesewitz. Bruesewitz is not a name I was familiar with, but his hands are in everything. He is a child. He was very young. I think he graduated from high school in like 2015. So he's not like literally a child, but he is young.

0:30:23 Thomas: Named X?

0:30:40 Lydia: And he was one of the the organizers of Stop the Steal, very involved.

0:30:39 Thomas: Wait. Yeah oh Wow.

0:30:45 Lydia: Very, very, very involved. And honestly, a huge influence on the social media strategy for the Trump administration this term. Was involved in the campaign. He is the reason Donald Trump went on. I mean, he and Barron, I guess. It was like the two of them, really, that got Donald Trump on all of the podcasts to reach Gen Z. is, unfortunately, very savvy. So I don't, I'm not surprised he owns this political and corporate consulting firm. Now, when I clicked through his website, it was, you know, like about us and that he's a political arm and a corporate arm. And I clicked on each and it just shows him under both.

0:31:22 Lydia: It's like about us, Alex, Alex. But Michael Seifert is with that company now, to some degree. I don't know, know. New CEO is Dusty Wunderlich, again, that founder of Credova, the buy now pay later guns founder. And, you know, just a few months later, so that was January 2026, we have the CEO shakeup. Entering into the summer for the Public Square website, it just redirects to .com. There is no Public Square anymore. It does not exist

0:31:53 Thomas: Got

0:31:53 Lydia: Anymore.

0:31:53 Thomas: Rid of the public, the concept of a public square.

0:31:56 Lydia: Yeah. And the company that is on the New York Stock Exchange, PSQ Holdings, now describes itself as, quote, a payments and financial infrastructure company. And it has and it has three segments of their PSQ Holdings because they're no longer a Public Square. PSQ Payments, PSQ impact.

0:32:08 Thomas: We're Holdings nothing, fucking nothing. Are no longer holding.

0:32:18 Lydia: Yeah. And Credova. That's their third segment. Argument. Think about just like the hype that happened just a few years before this, right? Like how the language and the rhetoric, I guess, but it was everywhere.

0:32:29 Thomas: But how real is that? You know like in the same Same way that, yeah, but in the same way that News, the clips we watched from Fox News and Fox News. I don't even know. There might have been a different thing, but they're same outlets that are able to bootstrap a bunch of anti-woke nothing into existence. And so they try to bootstrap this idea that this company is going to be huge into existence, and it's not necessarily true.

0:32:53 Lydia: Yeah, that's true. You know, I think that's fair. We know Donald Trump Jr. was, you like he was his dad throughout all of that to really hype it up. Michael Seifert, we got to to see that too

0:33:02 Thomas: I just had the funniest thought, which is like, what if he was like, man, I need to call Shrimp AJ to get some pointers on how to do a better impression of my dad. Because that's that's your only fucking meal ticket, obviously, is that you've got nothing else going for you. I can lose her.

0:33:09 Lydia: My gosh I know uh had, um, posted on X when he was confirming Donald Trump Jr. was joining the board, he said, quote, he invested in Public Square before our IPO, has never sold a share, because he and I both believe that our company has tremendous untapped potential and we're just getting started. Um, Marjorie Taylor Greene was posting about it. You know, all of these people who are like promoting it directly at various MAGA events and conventions. Then we had the shift. And you actually saw it from Michael Seifert himself before he stepped down as CEO, or forced to resign, or who knows. Posted the November 2025 earnings on X kind of showing what the reframe was. He's talking about like, like, the crypto payment capabilities that they're really looking forward to doing.

0:34:06 Thomas: We're not going to do any of the business parts of our business. It's just it's just records. We just have like like records. That's all yeah nothing all

0:34:14 Lydia: Quote, digital asset treasury management. What? What is that? Yeah. Label credit cards, gamified loyalty programs. We press forward to build a commerce ecosystem that champions economic liberty, but never talks about the marketplace place at all never talks about even the woke or anything um that the brands that are housed on this space are aligned in values it's reframing and stepping into that crypto space into the the fintech space um anything was officially announced of course um the shake -up donald trump jr has like reaffirmed his support of this company even though though it has shifted, when did a private placement, which basically, I guess, board every member dumped money into the company. And with that press release, he posted on X, I've been an investor. Well, he wrote, I been an investor in PSQ Holdings since before it was public. I remained an investor and I'm now increasing my stake along with my fellow board members because because I still believe in the mission and new management is finally delivering on it.

0:35:20 Thomas: So I should buy now then right fuck

0:35:23 Lydia: And then in the press release, quote, legitimate American businesses are still being denied the modern financial tools they need to survive and grow simply because the legacy financial system does not like their business or the customers they serve. So we move from shopping, you know, like consumer based something that by the people for the people, etc etc to now have you been the victim of debanking because now we can set you up on credova like all these gun manufacturers too cool let's there's a piece of this that kind of opened up more thoughts for me as I was going through this so I initially I'm preparing for this and I'm like, oh, ha ha. This to kind of watch this thing fall apart, losing 99 % or whatever of your stock price and all change up. And you still matter and you're still relevant. People should still care. Donald Trump Jr. is having to work overtime and now they're pouring their personal money into this project as well.

0:35:47 Thomas: The people fuck the people yeah yeah he's doing

0:36:22 Lydia: Well, yeah, yeah. But there's actually an element of this that started getting into Congress with So you know, some of this is political potentially, but there is a letter from the House Judiciary Democrats that was issued to Malik, who's, you know, the person who is responsible essentially for making this group go public, Donald Trump Jr.'s business partner for 1789 Capital, a man named Buzz Kirk and Trump Jr., basically calling out the fall that they saw with Public Square, but tying it into a broader pattern that is happening related specifically to 1789 Capital. So I want to read actually quite a bit of this.

0:36:22 Thomas: 1.5 times nothing I understand what you just said but okay

0:37:10 Lydia: Yeah, it'll make more sense as I'm stepping through this letter.

0:37:13 Thomas: Like the crypto pump and dumps are we doing that okay

0:37:16 Lydia: Don't even know. Well, you'll have to tell me what you think. So two years ago, your company, 1789 Capital Management LLC, was a struggling venture capital firm. Oh, this is from Jamie Raskin, by the way, and House Democrats.

0:37:17 Thomas: We'll see oh nice Nice.

0:37:28 Lydia: Struggling venture capitol firm that earned consistently disappointing results by serially investing in total market flops. And they footnote and give quite a few citations.

0:37:36 Thomas: As it wasn't entirely necessary to.

0:37:38 Lydia: I love this. No, I love this letter. You're going to love it. Your most noteworthy investment was the financing of a white nationalist media network that shared your, quote, anti-woke political message. Was Tucker Carlson's media company, by the way. Right after the 2024 U.S. presidential election and the firm's recruitment of Donald Trump Jr. as a new partner, 1789 Capital suddenly had had the Midas touch. You became the overnight darling of the venture capital world, rocketing from $150 million in assets under management to an astonishing $3 billion.

0:38:10 Thomas: Wow. That's impossible, actually.

0:38:12 Lydia: Yeah. A trio of businessmen with heretofore lackluster records in the market was suddenly running the hottest firm in the United States, picking out with almost clairvoyant accuracy winner after winner by investing in companies that would soon come to win hugely lucrative federal government contracts and grants and favorable regulatory actions. I like could not believe this as I was reading this.

0:38:35 Lydia: How did this miraculous transformation in the fortunes of your LLC come about?

0:38:36 Thomas: Well, we and exercise more, I think.

0:38:43 Lydia: Was it indeed magic or was it rank corruption, a toxic blend of trading on insider knowledge and the use of insider political influence to steer major federal contracts and other financial benefits to Donald Trump Jr.'s new favorite businesses. The story is amazing either way. In 2023, Mr. Malik and Mr. Buskirk launched 1789 Capital with the financial backing of MAGA mega -donor Rebecca Mercer, etc., etc., ecc. She's someone who was very involved in in the January 6th riot and funding. A lot of groups.

0:39:13 Thomas: Isn't that because Mercer, isn't that like a billionaire or whatever? Yeah god

0:39:17 Lydia: Skipping ahead a little bit. The early returns on 1789 capital were not promising. The firm invested in several anti-woke startups. One of its investments, Public Square, dubbed the anti -woke Amazon, lost 97, they cite 97 percent of its value after 1789 Capital took it public. Another, Grab a Gun, which lets customers shop for firearms on saw its stock plunge 75 percent since 1789 Capital took it public. But on November 5th, 2024, 1789 Capital's fortunes radically changed with the election of Donald Trump. Just four days after the election, 1789 Capital pounced on this unprecedented business by capitalizing on the only unique asset possessed by its founders, their relationship with Donald Trump Jr. November 9th, you named Don Jr., the president's eldest son, a full partner, tapping him to assist with, quote, new investment origination, capital raising, and strategy.

0:39:25 Thomas: Crap oh my god this is what I'm saying that was the only smart money they spent yeah

0:40:10 Lydia: Yep. And then I'm going to read this because I want to get this in the record, just these like digs Don at Don Jr. Based on his own personal business resume, Don Jr may have been an unlikely choice to originate investments for an upstart venture capital company. His rare solo ventures outside the paternal eye of the Trump organization have been well -documented flops, including investing in dry oil wells, hydroponic lettuce farms, and an African mining company. He became the lucky charm for 1789 Capital. Talked about the $150 to $3 billion in assets under management. This is like in the span of no time at all.

0:40:43 Thomas: That's it, that's nuts, yeah

0:40:45 Lydia: Investment fund generating roughly a 200 percent return as of June 30th, 2026, 10 times the average return for peer venture capital firms founded in 2023. this is crazy. Investment illustrates this dynamic more clearly than 1789 Capital's stake in rare earth company Vulcan Elements. The day Donald Trump was elected, Vulcan Elements was a small startup with no active manufacturing facilities and no history of fulfilling government contracts. Then, 1789 Capital invested several million dollars. Soon after this investment, Vulcan Elements boasted that it had been raking in federal dollars throughout its capital raise, securing nine different government contracts in the past eight months. And that, as it turned out, was just the beginning. In November 2025, the Trump administration wrenched open a giant spigot of government cash for Vulcan Elements. That month, the Department of Defense announced a massive $620 million direct loan to Vulcan Elements.

0:41:45 Lydia: Contemporaneously, the Department of Commerce provided the company with a $50 million grant under the CHIPS and Science Act. In exchange, DOD received warrants and Vulcan Elements while DOC received 50 million of equity, giving the U.S. government a vested interest in the company's long-term success. How is this not an insane conflict of interest? Your son is on the firm that has contributed to this company. This is crazy.

0:42:05 Thomas: It is yeah when they do the final tally on the grift earned in this administration, it's going to be Wayne Gretzky's points record. You're not coming close to this.

0:42:15 Lydia: It's to be off the chart. You can't quantify it.

0:42:21 Thomas: I don't even know. This isn't important, but for sports people, I don't even know if that's the right reference. What's unbreakable record? The baseball player's games started, games played in a row. What's that guy's name? Name there's a him and there's the junior um hold on no it's uh it's

0:42:35 Lydia: Don't know. Ken Griffey. Is a Ken Griffy Jr., though.

0:42:42 Thomas: But that's not who you won't know who it is I don't think uh yeah ripken jr he played every single game from 1982 to 1998 that's like one of the biggest ones, uh, joe DiMaggio's hitting streak, let's see, oh yeah, Wilt Chamberlain, yeah, Wayne Gretzky, maybe it is that, maybe that is the most unbreakable one, actually. But still, I don't even think that's a good enough comparison for the total amount of grift of this administration. It's impossible.

0:42:47 Lydia: I do that name. Wow. That's crazy. Yeah, listen to this. According to public reports, Vulcan Elements was worth approximately $200 million when 1789 Capital secured its initial stake in the suddenly auspicious company. Less than a year later, Vulcan Elements was reportedly worth $2 billion, marking a 900% return on investment for the lucky few who grabbed a stake in the company before the avalanche of taxpayer money arrived.

0:43:36 Thomas: Unreal. Unreal. I mean, to be fair, I do not know to whom or what, but to be fair, they did not know he was going to win. You know, like this started before won, right?

0:43:47 Lydia: Did, but, but Trump Jr. wasn't involved in 1789 Capital until he won. Right. And they appointed him November 9th.

0:43:53 Thomas: I thought that was just before. Oh, yeah.

0:43:55 Lydia: Right? So the election happened November 5th. Don, Don Jr. gets appointed November 9. Yeah. Then all of these things start happening immediately.

0:43:55 Thomas: OK. OK, John

0:44:05 Lydia: Of dozens of companies that the Pentagon was considering funding at the time, Elements was, quote, the only deal initiated by a top aide to the president. After the request came in, DOD was forced to execute the loan at an, quote. Unusually rapid pace with Pentagon staffers working late nights to meet the White House's demand to, quote, get this done. They cite a few other things. Juul is an e -cigarette manufacturer. You're probably familiar with that.

0:44:31 Lydia: There was a on them because of the of flavored e -Cigarettes being, you know, basically a way to get kids hooked. Was going to be prohibiting Juul from selling the products in the United States. And then in March 2025, 1789, Capital acquired a $5 million stake in Juul. And the FDA said, never mind. Guys are good. And they authorized the marketing of five e -cigarette products, including flavored varieties.

0:44:30 Thomas: Course yeah yeah

0:45:01 Lydia: That, again, was the entire uproar and discussion for regulation and discussion for pulling off the market completely. When 1789 Capital got their hands in it, oh, suddenly it's not a problem anymore. And it wasn't something where it was like, you know, Donald Trump was president in March 2025 when 1789 got that stake, Trump was already president for a while, right? The FDA didn't make that move before. They made it after 1789 invested or, you know, put in $5 million or whatever to have some I don't know. What would you call that? Yeah of the Markets also cited in this letter as well about, you know, like funny business happening there. 1789 Capital was involved. Alas, it is now impossible to believe that your firm's astonishing growth and success are due to anything other than insider political influence and thoroughgoing corruption. Indeed, President Trump recently admitted that his oldest sons have, quote, inside information with, quote, almost anything they do. Whether government decisions and contracts are being manipulated to ensure that your firm and the president's family get a cut of the action or your firm in the president family are being given advanced insider information about those forthcoming decisions and contacts, or more likely both, they say in parentheses. These practices constitute clear violations of law, banning governmental conflicts of interest, political insider trading, exploitation of public office for financial gain and fraud. And then they ask for for a variety of information. So this was issued August 26, 2026. I don't think we have any information yet.

0:45:36 Thomas: Ownership stake yeah where it's yeah well then yeah I mean they don't have the numbers to enforce it probably right

0:46:40 Lydia: That's probably true. But they did request, or I guess he wrote demand, Jamie Raskin wrote, I demand the following information no later than 5 p.m. on September 9th. I haven't seen anything since, but, you know, I hope this is a thread that they're not willing to drop because it just seems really, really insane to me. A paper trail, thankfully, that we can see like none of this stuff seems to be happening, you I don't know how much that matters while Republicans are in power, probably none of it but at least you are documents and some of this stuff is now in the record um then hopefully we can kind of see it being pursued eventually um who knows let

0:47:26 Thomas: On one hand, we've got a failing, stupid, idiotic business idea. On the other hand, a great business idea is grift and just corruption. It's a good... it's maybe not a good long-term strategy, hopefully, but it's certainly a good short-term strategy.

0:47:42 Lydia: So there you have it

0:47:43 Thomas: Right. Invest in corruption, everybody. I'm buying 100 shares. Corruption.

0:48:06 Clip: Undoubtedly yes. If

0:48:12 Lydia: John, Don Jr. gets appointed November 9.

0:48:14 Thomas: Jr.

0:48:15 Lydia: Yeah. I'm cutting it so you can put that at the end.