LAM1009: My Cousin Vinny

Transcript

This transcript was generated automatically and may contain errors — the audio is the record.

0:00:25 Thomas: Hello and welcome to Opening Arguments. Weird day, huh? Today for me, probably yesterday for you, I'm guessing. Weird day. It's also been a weird week because I was at the Puzzle and the Thunderstorm pajama party. Lydia and I both were there for almost a week, so it was a whirlwind of travel. And as such, we weren't able to do our Vapid Response Wednesday, but that'll be back next week. In the meantime, got something nice and fun to maybe take a break from the chaos. And that is Lotawful Movies, My Cousin Vinny. That's right. The patrons let us have nice things. We got to watch just a great movie. It was so much fun. So you're going to hear me, Matt, Jenessa, and Lydia talking about what's got to be my favorite law movie now, having actually seen it. Because I hadn't seen it, I hadn'T seen the full thing. And so this is, of course, available in its entirety on patreon .com slash law at that $2 tier and above. Going to give you a nice, healthy, long chunk for the normies here. So it'll still be fun and worthwhile. While but if you want to hear that whole thing gotta go on patreon and it's worth it it was so much fun if you'd like not a break from the chaos that's going on I have to imagine that tomorrow after I sleep for eternity from all this travel I'm likely going to record on the whole charlie kirk thing because uh yeah lots to say on that if anyone's following my social media you've seen some of my thoughts but yeah very crazy times right now but enough about that let's get to to something fun. We'll take a quick break and then we'll get to Lot Awful Movies 1009. My Cousin Vinny, such a good movie. God, I loved it. I want to watch it again. We're going to be right back with that.

0:02:01 Ad: [Ad break 1 — ad music]

0:02:01 Thomas: Hello and welcome to Lotawful Movies 1009, got the numbering right this time, looked it up, took the time. I'm Thomas. Oh, we have so many people. We have so much great people for you to meet today. With me as always, Matt Cameron, real life attorney. How are you doing?

0:02:11 Matt: Hey, Tommy Pistachios. How you doing?

0:02:19 Lydia: Oh, no. The whole time.

0:02:19 Jenessa: This is offensive.

0:02:21 Matt: I'm doing this the whole time. Don't worry about it.

0:02:21 Thomas: That's a a great start yeah hey yes somebody says hey tony bag of donuts I swear somebody says that at some point and I I think lydia thought that was a like a name I was you know I think he's saying bag of donuts like a joke on somebody's name but it's never explained which I actually like I like movies should explain less let us do it in our brains good stuff anyway also joining us is of of course, Dr. Jenessa Seymour. How are you doing?

0:02:24 Matt: Forget about it Yep.

0:02:30 Jenessa: He does.

0:02:41 Matt: Yes.

0:02:44 Jenessa: I'm doing great, and as we slowly code switch, my actual Italian-American accent will be coming out. I will not be doing a caricature.

0:03:00 Thomas: Yeah, the audience does need to know which of us they should find offensive. And that's important. I think it's firmly everybody but Jenessa, I think. No one else. Yeah.

0:03:09 Lydia: Everyone except for Jenessa.

0:03:11 Jenessa: Yeah, there you go.

0:03:12 Thomas: We'll all sound exactly the same, but you should be offended only by the three.

0:03:14 Jenessa: Entirely possible.

0:03:17 Thomas: Oh, and Lydia's walking here. How you doing.

0:03:16 Lydia: Oh, my God.

0:03:22 Jenessa: God damn it.

0:03:22 Lydia: Hi. Doing well. Wait a second. Okay, so of the four of us, only two of us have seen this movie before, right?

0:03:29 Thomas: Yeah, I hadn't seen seen it.

0:03:30 Matt: Somehow. Yeah. I know.

0:03:32 Thomas: I'd seen a lot of parts of it from away over the years. And I, I knew I liked it sort of like I didn't need to see it. Like I just knew like, Oh yeah, that's great. Like every part of it I've seen is good. And guess what? We watched it. It's great movie. Fantastic. Oh yeah.

0:03:44 Lydia: My cousin Vinny. Yeah. I don't think we said the name.

0:03:47 Thomas: That's in the title of the thing, but yeah, sure. My cousin Vinny, we could do like the actual title drop they do.

0:03:48 Jenessa: Shit. Every 90s movie, you gotta say it.

0:03:55 Matt: Yeah, gotta use the name.

0:03:56 Thomas: But this one's the least bad. Cause he's just like genuinely in the scene. He's He's like, my cousin Vinny.

0:04:01 Matt: Organically. Yeah Thank

0:04:01 Lydia: Oh, I know. I love it so much. Oh. That's great. We've got an attorney in the family. My cousin, Vinny, perfect.

0:04:08 Thomas: Good stuff. Oh, this was great. We've, you know, long resisted doing this because the only thing worse than doing like a bad comedy for a lamb is like a good comedy or maybe vice versa. I don't know. It's because like, it's just a good movie. So it's going to be interesting. But I think overwhelmingly, I think the patrons in the audience decided we deserve good things or something. So we're just doing a good move. Yeah.

0:04:28 Matt: You so much, everybody, because, you know, everything sucks, and this is great. This was a lot of fun.

0:04:31 Thomas: We needed this.

0:04:33 Lydia: Yeah, this is so good. Yep.

0:04:33 Thomas: I love this movie. What an interesting movie. Movie. 1992, right? Yeah.

0:04:38 Lydia: 1992.

0:04:38 Matt: Yeah What a year.

0:04:39 Thomas: And I would say it pretty much holds up. I mean, I don't even think it's like that.

0:04:44 Lydia: I'd say like one glaring

0:04:44 Thomas: There's some stuff that'd be like, yeah, it's a little problematic. Yeah.

0:04:46 Lydia: Exception I'm sure Jenessa has thoughts on that

0:04:49 Thomas: Yeah. But like for the most part, like it could have been worse. Like you watch some movies from any time past 10 years ago or something and it's Like, oh, but no, it holds up pretty well.

0:04:59 Jenessa: I do. I've watched this like 4 million times, so I was not surprised by almost anything. But thinking about it from that lens, like, yeah, I mean, we are in Alabama. And, you know, know there's that one moment where the guy's like our ancestors from england and it just zooms in on a black juror so like for 92 that was yeah

0:05:17 Lydia: Right self

0:05:18 Thomas: Well, I think that's meant to be. Yeah, I Think that's a good joke. Okay.

0:05:20 Lydia: -aware self -aware yeah

0:05:21 Jenessa: That was meant to be a joke about that being racist not a joke of racism so for 92 advanced

0:05:30 Thomas: Yeah I'm glad we're on on the same page I thought you were calling it out for a second yeah

0:05:32 Jenessa: No no I think that was smart and very funny making fun of racism

0:05:34 Matt: It's pretty nuanced yeah

0:05:38 Lydia: Let me give you a note about um also like with the casting apparently will smith was up for the role of the friend right yeah he was up för stan and and mitchell whitfield who ended up getting the part he said it came down to me and Will Smith which is funny because that's probably the last Last time I ever beat out Will Smith for a part.

0:05:45 Matt: Yes stan yeah yep

0:05:58 Lydia: And Ruben, I think he was a producer behind it, right, Ruben? And he said, it really became an honest conversation about how having an unjustly arrested young black man in the Deep South would change the dynamic of the narrative.

0:05:55 Thomas: It's really funny

0:05:58 Jenessa: What oh

0:06:08 Thomas: Yeah yeah yeah exactly no

0:06:10 Lydia: Yeah, as talented as Will was, we made a determination that it was too intrusive to the central thesis of the movie.

0:06:08 Jenessa: Yeah

0:06:08 Matt: Yep not as funny

0:06:14 Thomas: Yeah that's pretty funny that makes sense though it does it would not at all work as a light -hearted comedy

0:06:21 Lydia: No, absolutely not.

0:06:22 Matt: No yeah this really is such a good balance between great courtroom drama and legal stuff and an actual comedy that's actually funny that's a really hard thing to do they nailed it I mean obviously it's

0:06:36 Thomas: Okay opening salvos here how do you feel about the law of the movie it's comedy yeah it's a movie sure hey

0:06:36 Matt: A movie so you're going to murder you're gonna do a murder trial and over the weekend right so that that's gonna

0:06:40 Thomas: They got nothing else to do in in that town. I don't know. Yeah.

0:06:40 Jenessa: Speedy

0:06:42 Matt: Happen that's true you can prepare a murder to trial over the weekend why

0:06:46 Jenessa: Trial it finally happened for someone yeah

0:06:47 Matt: Not yeah yeah uh yeah I mean there's there's the usual stuff like that like the one order kind of thing where they they compress the timeline ridiculously and like you know obviously surprise witnesses and silly things that happens but you know I'm not gonna pick nets it's it's great there's nothing that really jumped out

0:07:00 Thomas: Well, but they address the surprise witness thing, don't they? They at least are aware that it needs to be explained.

0:07:02 Jenessa: Yeah

0:07:05 Matt: It's still kind of reversible error but to have this an expert witness come in

0:07:09 Thomas: Sure, Matt. I actually think that's intentional. We'll get to it. But like, I think that plus the objection being overruled, even though he knows it's obviously like, I think it is supposed to be he's like messing with him on purpose. The judge we'll get to the

0:07:20 Matt: Like yeah yeah okay but yeah no I mean it's it's a great as a law movie I can see why it's one of those movies everybody's asked me my whole wife I've ever seen and I've never seen so I should have seen it by

0:07:29 Thomas: Most unrealistic law thing is that we didn't pass a law that what's her name would be allowed to be the romantic partner of what's his name? God damn it. What's anyone's his name marissa tomei can't be

0:07:39 Lydia: Marissa Tomei and Joe Pesci yeah

0:07:39 Matt: Now you mean

0:07:42 Thomas: The romantic partner of Joe Pesci that's the only thing like later they passed that law I think but it wasn't in effect then yeah god

0:07:48 Matt: Because she's already my girlfriend right that's yeah

0:07:49 Lydia: There she was 26 at the time of this filming and like not well known or anything like that like up and coming this really like shot putted her to the spotlight but their age difference was so egregious she was 36 he was 48 when they were filming

0:07:55 Thomas: She's the best really okay because I was gonna say this whole time I thought he had to not be that old back then because it's so long ago that I was like boy he's a rough for 32 or whatever he is It looks like shit.

0:08:11 Matt: He's always been

0:08:04 Lydia: This yeah no he was yeah here's the thing they wanted to try and like reduce the age gap the look of the age gap. So he wore a wig.

0:08:20 Thomas: Okay. I respect that.

0:08:23 Lydia: And underneath the wig, he had a non -surgical facelift system. And so it had like adhesive tabs and hook and eye. Yeah, to try and reduce the wrinkles. It took about three hours per day to set

0:08:28 Jenessa: What

0:08:29 Thomas: Just pulling. Yeah. Like they did with Bilbo Baggins, you know?

0:08:37 Jenessa: Whoa

0:08:37 Lydia: It up on him for filming.

0:08:39 Thomas: And I bet you it looked, oh, Jenessa watched it on VHS. Did it look okay on VHS? Because for us, it looked pretty bad. But I imagine with the film definition of the time, it might've looked okay.

0:08:42 Matt: Old nice

0:08:42 Jenessa: I watched this on a dvd that I own and it had the unskippable preview for all the wonderful fox dvds you can buy of fight club and uh the x files you can get all the dvd extras call this number and

0:08:57 Matt: Miss that

0:09:01 Lydia: Like what? Okay. Oh...

0:08:58 Thomas: Oh, that's fantastic. Yeah. Yeah. Of course, definitely. Can I buy that? Can I order that? Yeah. Yeah. I would still, that would work on me still. That advertisement. Yeah. Oh man.

0:09:14 Matt: Uh actually if I can real quick I'm going to ask Jenessa your relationship with this movie your family's relationship with the movie because I believe you're the only one of us who is in any way ethnically italian I think that's

0:09:21 Jenessa: Order oh yeah so this is probably one of my favorite movies it's in the top five for sure I love this movie top to bottom. And I will argue it portrays my culture very well. I know that's not going to seem true for people who find it grating and upsetting, but I'm like, yeah, you love it or you hate it, man. My parents love it.

0:09:28 Thomas: So good. Movie rules.

0:09:50 Jenessa: It's always been taken very positively. I've never heard anybody be like, wow, this portrays Italians very negatively. It is like, no, that's us. That's, Yeah.

0:09:59 Thomas: There's already plenty of other stuff that does that to where I feel like you can take this one as a win, you know, like, oh, okay.

0:10:05 Matt: You have a brooklyn connection

0:10:08 Jenessa: So my family did come through Ellis Island, but very quickly moved. OK, depending on where you're from in New York state, I am either from upstate or from New York City because nobody believes in suburbs. So we moved slightly north of New York City, which is north enough that people from New York City think I am from cow country. But the people from cow country are like, you're obviously from the city.

0:10:29 Thomas: That's funny. Yeah, you city slicker.

0:10:32 Jenessa: And then we settled in one spot and never moved. So I grew up in a neighborhood where like every block had somebody from my family on it, and I could not get away with anything if I went for a walk. Oh, yeah. Is that a New York thing? Do you guys not have like square

0:10:43 Thomas: Oh man, no blocks have anyone from my family on it anywhere. Yeah I got nothing. That is weird. Weird.

0:10:46 Lydia: You don't have blocks well

0:10:53 Thomas: Oh, it's also just a city thing. I mean, I'm from the

0:10:53 Jenessa: Streets oh

0:10:54 Lydia: No it's a country thing like yeah yeah

0:10:57 Thomas: Actual cow country that you are talking about. Like people would talk about like neighbors and I'd be confused as to what that meant. Yeah.

0:11:03 Jenessa: Oh yeah you live in real cows

0:11:06 Lydia: The first time I went to thomas's house I asked him you know that garbage day must have been really crappy because they had had a long driveway they would have had to bring the cans down and he was like that's not there's no garbage day here you

0:11:14 Thomas: I was like, that's the funniest thing I've ever heard in my life. You fucking rich person in your garbage collection. You absolute celebrity.

0:11:18 Jenessa: No wait what do you do what

0:11:20 Matt: Yeah I know it's baffling you go to the

0:11:21 Lydia: Load up the truck with garbage Jenessa

0:11:25 Thomas: Yeah, we had to take it to the county dump. I mean, there are people who lived in the shitty town nearby that had garbage pickup. So, like, even in the area, that was a little abnormal that I didn't know what that was. But not where I was. There was no garbage pickup for me.

0:11:25 Jenessa: What

0:11:25 Matt: Dump there

0:11:26 Lydia: Doesn't get it either yeah yeah yeah oh

0:11:35 Jenessa: Okay okay yeah we had public town garbage I moved to Illinois for grad school and I was shocked to learn that there's such a thing as like privatized garbage and I dated a guy who lived on a cul-de-sac and all five people picked a different garbage company so there was that like boop boop like backing up noise in the cul-de-sac about four days a week at five in the morning and I was like this is why you move to new york you pay your freaking taxes and you don't have to deal with this

0:12:14 Thomas: Here we go. Vinny, bag of donuts. Yeah, you pay garbage. You got it.

0:12:14 Matt: She is now we're hearing

0:12:15 Jenessa: Shit god damn it yeah it just you just gotta get

0:12:18 Lydia: No it's happening

0:12:20 Thomas: We just need to get Jenessa angry, and then she becomes the movie.

0:12:23 Jenessa: Me warmed up and it starts it's coming like yeah

0:12:25 Thomas: It's nice. I love this movie so much, it feels like we get more of it.

0:12:30 Jenessa: Yeah if you get me in teacher mode I'm like oh yes my mother and then my mom calls me it's like ma so it comes out oh

0:12:33 Thomas: That's nice, yeah. Yeah. Oh my God. That's so funny.

0:12:38 Matt: It so you grew up around people who sounded like this is that and you yourself know how to sound like

0:12:42 Jenessa: This is not foreign to me at all this is what I sound like if I'm not actively suppressing it oh

0:12:49 Thomas: Well, plus there is the whole Godfather thing where even like the mafia people started acting like the movie and it's like this thing that turns in on itself. So I feel like there's a singularity of Italian -ness and it just keeps going until one day it consumes us all, you know?

0:13:01 Lydia: I know

0:13:03 Jenessa: Culture is self-reinforcing by its media representation.

0:13:10 Thomas: Very interesting. This, God, it was so nice. It was so fun. I love it. Let's just do this for lamb every month. The same movie. Let's never change.

0:13:17 Jenessa: I've watched it approximately that many times. So really?

0:13:21 Lydia: I will say this was not that successful when it came out yeah like the reviews weren't that great it did fine at the box office but it really found its footing with home video and stuff and Roger Ebert I saw his review and I was like this is insane but I guess he wasn't wrong in terms of how it was received he said it's the kind of movie home video was invented for not worth the trip to the theater but slam it into the VCR and you get your rentals worth and yeah I know it's offensive yeah

0:13:46 Thomas: Okay. Begrudgingly, like, probably you're right, but also.

0:13:49 Jenessa: Rude. Wait, but this is confusing to me because if it didn't do so hot, but then Marissa Tomei got an Oscar, which is like, yeah, comedies

0:13:58 Lydia: Yeah, she got the Oscar yeah so she got the Oscar for supporting yeah and and there was oh my

0:13:59 Matt: Yeah yeah that's supporting tell me she doesn't deserve it come on

0:13:59 Thomas: She got an Oscar? Holy shit. Comedies, comedies never, well, she does, but comedies like never get, yeah. Wow. That's how good she was.

0:14:07 Lydia: God, and there was a whole conspiracy theory that they

0:14:07 Jenessa: Never get an Oscar. This is so impressive oh come

0:14:14 Lydia: Said the wrong name that it was supposed to go to you know so-and-so it was a bunch of like middle -aged women And yeah, and exactly. And so to the point where like, the accountants that are involved with the Oscars had to release a statement saying like, we have a whole process if something like that happens, like we saw with La La Land and Moonlight, right, where someone has to come out and address it right then and there that the wrong awardee has been called. And so that did not happen. And Marissa Tomei definitely won. They even did like a whole survey of Oscar voters years later. And they all said like, yeah, we'd still vote for her.

0:14:15 Jenessa: On oh screw you wow oh

0:14:17 Thomas: How fucking dare you? Wow. Yeah. God,

0:14:47 Matt: No yeah no it's such a performance well I also I read somewhere I did some background reading too. And apparently this was one of the first years that they sent the Academy videos. So the theory was that the other best supporting actress stuff, it was pretty boring and like kind of Merchant Ivory, you know, straight up stuff. So they really enjoyed just having a break watching Marisa Tomei do this. But it's an outstanding performance in any genre. So I mean, yeah, makes the movie.

0:14:48 Thomas: She's the best. So good. Popped it in the VCR. Yeah. Yeah. It's good. Very interesting, too. I love, too, how much older movies go too old, and in my opinion, they kind of all suck for the most part. But, like, there's a certain era where stuff was allowed to breathe a little more, like our attention spans were a little higher. You know, and that could be good or bad, because often when there was a bad scene, it dragged on for fucking ever, you know? But, but, like when it was a good scene, It's like this, it's not, it'S not rushing me. It's not. It's just, you Know, it is good times, you KNOW, that kind of pacing. Thing the

0:14:52 Lydia: Mm-hmm yeah yeah yeah oh I know so good oh

0:15:07 Jenessa: Yeah buddy

0:15:37 Matt: Yeah. Let's talk about how grits are made for a couple of minutes and maybe that'll be useful later.

0:15:40 Thomas: Funny thing was I did not predict that that was coming back later because it was a good self -contained bit in itself so good

0:15:41 Matt: I don't know, but it works. Yeah

0:15:47 Jenessa: Yes they make everything feel nothing feels like you're setting up Chekhov's gun it all feels like a natural part of the story and then it comes back and you're like oh shit that really was part of it

0:15:47 Matt: Exactly. Works on its own no

0:15:55 Thomas: So good God, I love this movie we yeah do we go through what do we do I just want to talk about how much I love it more

0:16:02 Lydia: So good all right well do we want to dive into it just the setup for anyone who hasn't seen My Cousin Vinny? What are you doing first of all go watch it and second of all we start with the setup right so we have a driving scene where there's two kids. Ralph Macchio, karate kid, is in this. And his friend, Stan, driving around in a convertible.

0:16:06 Matt: Let's jump in he

0:16:22 Thomas: Isn't it weird how Ralph Macchio forgot how to act like as a kid he was fucking phenomenal as a kid was good and then now he he sucks. Like he's not, it's like, what happened? I don't understand. Yeah. But it's, I, it'S like you, uh, yeah. I mean, he wasn't like, he was fine. I don't know. I, there was somewhere I thought that maybe the direction or the writing was a little awkward.

0:16:27 Matt: Doesn't

0:16:29 Lydia: And then Cobra Kai. Yeah, yeah. Oh, I don't know. I thought he was good. Yeah? Yeah.

0:16:34 Matt: Have to do much in this movie but shotgun

0:16:36 Jenessa: Yeah, but he had some rough moments in this movie. Yeah, maybe that's what set him up.

0:16:48 Lydia: So they stopped to get some food during their road trip. And Ralph Macchio accidentally shoplifts tuna because his hands are full. He puts in his pocket. He doesn't realize until they're driving away and they get pulled over by a sheriff but with a gun which is very surprising yeah and then we see them, they get put in a lineup they get identified for something that we don't know what's

0:17:09 Thomas: Not having seen this, I was really confused. Like, I was like, whoa, this is escalating quickly. Like is this a bit, like, I thought it was a joke for a while. I was, like, wow, the South or whatever. Yeah but

0:17:10 Lydia: Happening yeah right, you felt exactly how the kids felt right like they're like all this over a can of tuna like we accidentally shoplifted it but it turns out the convenience store guy that they just were at was found dead right after they left. And they're allowed to make one phone call. They call Ralph Macchio's mom, but they're doing it in front of the cops. That was one of my first questions, Matt. Is that just in the office? I mean, it's a small town, so maybe, but I don't know.

0:17:43 Matt: Yeah small town I mean you can't promise where you're gonna get your one call I don't

0:17:47 Thomas: Is that a call that's that's not like privileged or anything is it because I know the prison calls they listen to and all that but

0:17:53 Matt: Know anything you say in front of the cops they can write it down so

0:17:55 Thomas: But I mean like are those phones bugged or whatever like the prison ones where it's like any call okay interesting yes

0:17:59 Matt: Uh I wouldn't assume the police station one would be

0:18:02 Jenessa: I just sent you guys a picture that is my favorite cop in that scene. Lindsey Graham is in that police station. I don't know how else to say it.

0:18:10 Thomas: Yeah I thought that too and weirdly the cop at the end is kind of like um ted lasso he's like it's Like Ted Lasso's dad I was kept thinking it was him. I was like, that can't be him.

0:18:11 Lydia: Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly yeah the the sheriff yeah and then we get to the end of our setup here where his mom lets him know that they actually have an attorney in the family and Ralph Macchio goes oh that's great we've got an attorney the family my cousin Vinny I'm not gonna do voices so, and then we get some scene of Vinny coming into town driving on in everyone's checking him out and I just want to say again for the record love Joe Pesci, love Marissa Tomei from the very beginning, it's just so good it's so good yeah yes right

0:18:47 Thomas: Yeah. So good.

0:18:52 Matt: As soon as they show up yeah yeah oh I can we go back for just a second. I just want to mention that this entire setup. So this is obviously it's a comedy. It's a comedy about somebody who two people who are potentially going to be heading to death row. So it's kind of a strange way to set up a comedy, but it does actually, I think it's a great portrayal. And when people wonder, like, how could this ever happen that you could be wrongfully accused of murder? Like this is a perfect setup for, you know, how you could be wrong place, wrong time, pulled over and say something like I shot the clerk question mark. Right. And then, and that goes down the transcript as I shot the clerk.

0:19:03 Lydia: In the deep south yeah yeah yeah Yeah. I know.

0:19:21 Thomas: I wouldn't have taken you seriously a while ago. But I mean, can I get a lawyer dog is a case like come on.

0:19:22 Lydia: God, it was so funny.

0:19:27 Jenessa: That's exactly what I thought of. Love.

0:19:27 Matt: Exactly. Exactly. Right, right, right. But it's, yeah, I mean, just, I think it's a really good educational sort of thing for showing how things, even though it's comedy, right? But how this sort of thing might happen for people who don't think about this stuff very often. I don't really like how they kind of play the death penalty up for laughs, but you know, again, it's 1992. Yeah.

0:19:42 Thomas: I mean it's at least they're sending it up. You know, I think I think it's meant I think we're meant to kind of not be super excited about all that.

0:19:50 Matt: Somebody's executed in the middle of the movie.

0:19:50 Jenessa: They're setting up stakes. I even, I

0:19:53 Matt: Somebody is executed and it's just, you know. It's a joke. Like, it'S just kind of, I don'T know, but yeah, not complaining.

0:19:57 Jenessa: Appreciate how they even set up those stakes by being like, okay, well, they wouldn't be doing an execution at the jail, but you wouldn't be held in the prison. And so they literally have the guy turn around and give you the, here's how crappy our system is. The jail just got condemned. So you're getting held in the present. And you see the prisoners, the protesters outside the prison, they're

0:20:09 Matt: Yeah. It's nice little detail. Yeah, no, I liked that inclusion of the protesters.

0:20:21 Jenessa: Hitting all the little details here mm

0:20:22 Thomas: This is much better research than so many of the law movies we've watched. Doesn't mean they nailed everything, but, like, you can at least tell instantly that they were trying. Which is more than you can say for most law movies.

0:20:34 Lydia: Just stepping out of that really fast, the writer did a lot of work to try and get this right um uh yeah he said I took he met with an attorney to um to try, and get every single detail right, and he said, I took extensive notes. I'd ask him, what class in law school do you learn criminal court procedure? He said, you don't. I said, You don't? Then how do you learn? Well, you either go to court and watch and listen and learn or the firm that hires you teaches you. And then, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yep. Mm hmm. Yeah, so Jenessa mentioned that the kids are actually in a state correctional facility. And we get Vinny visiting for the first time, which was my first opportunity to watch Thomas like laugh about the interaction between Vinny and the friend Stan because Stan doesn't know him so Ralph Macchio's sleeping and Vinny just you know gives the guard some money as he's letting him into his cell and Stan thinks that it's someone who's come to assault him

0:20:38 Thomas: Imagine that! Doing fucking work! God, I get so mad at the lazy -ass ones. It's nice. Wow. I love that. Oh, God. Yeah. Oh, right.

0:21:02 Matt: And that went straight into the movie. That one. Yeah, that's great. And also, I read that he stopped in and just talked to a random small town DA just to find out what that's like, right? I love that. And he's not a lawyer. The screenwriter had to look it up because it was so good. And then the director also was a lawyer, an English lawyer, technically, but wanted to try to keep it as true to life as possible. I'm sure we'll get there with the court stuff.

0:21:47 Lydia: Sexually assault him. It's just like the most ridiculous thing but like Like, yeah, that's obviously how he would react in that situation. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

0:21:53 Thomas: Yeah! Yeah. I don't even think that's necessarily that cringe nowadays because it was never it wasn't really like glorified or anything like it does end up just being like a misunderstanding. That's funny. I know it's like, OK, that could have been a lot worse. I think that could be like a lot worse.

0:22:03 Matt: But yeah, I mean, it's probably the least bad age joke. And it's still very funny, but but like still

0:22:11 Jenessa: Yeah it's still not it's not great but at least it was portrayed as a thing that would be bad if it were true who's on

0:22:13 Matt: Prison rape, but yeah. Right. So he's, that's

0:22:18 Lydia: Yeah. I think it's okay because it was set up from Stan. Yes. Stan said this is the stuff that happens to you in prison, right?

0:22:20 Thomas: Yeah. It's like a young it's like a kid's like. Yeah, yeah. Like it's them like understanding that's about that's how prison goes. And then.

0:22:29 Matt: True. We never get any implication that's actually happening in the place they're in. So that does help. But it's also like the, there's several instances, of course, this throughout the movie, but that fun arrested development kind of thing where you're having two different conversations at the same time. That's classic. So good. Such good humor.

0:22:42 Thomas: So good.

0:22:42 Lydia: And what we learn in this scene is that Vinny actually has no experience in trial or anything even related to the charges that they have.

0:22:51 Thomas: It was an OA quote a long time ago, but it truly is good, even better in context. He's like, how many cases have you had? And eventually you find out, you know, like none. And he's like you graduated from law school six years ago. What have you been doing? Studying for the bar. So good. I love it.

0:23:00 Lydia: Yeah. Bar. Yeah. And then we'd learn that it took him six times to pass. He was like, well, third time's the charm. And Vinny goes, not for me it isn't.

0:23:15 Matt: And that was the setup. That was the inspiration for the movie. It was Dale Warner heard about a guy that filled the bar, I think 13 times. And he thought to himself, well, he had to defend you for murder and, you know, some kind of small town case. And that was the setup. This isn't for you.

0:23:26 Jenessa: First, there is some states have a cap like if you fail a certain number of times they're like Like, come on, man, it's not happening for you. I did wonder, he mentions he's been doing like civil personal injury, which of course rarely goes to trial. Are you? Yes. Oh, God. The thing that always confuses me, I'm pretty sure this is true about my own profession, and yet I still can't believe it, is like, I think you are allowed to do a criminal trial having never

0:23:26 Thomas: God, I love it. Oh, wow. Oh, yeah. Yeah. For what later is the best joke in the entire movie. Yeah.

0:23:41 Lydia: Yeah. So good. At the pool hall. Yeah, so

0:24:01 Jenessa: Done one and specialized in personal injury, like you're just generally uh yeah oh

0:24:03 Thomas: I I mean, you're allowed to defend yourself, so.

0:24:08 Lydia: That's the basis of the case that we'll talk about at the end. Just a little sneak peek for folks.

0:24:09 Matt: But yes, the Scalia case. Yeah.

0:24:14 Lydia: Yeah United States v. Gonzalez-Lopez. We're going to play some oral argument from that.

0:24:16 Matt: But I will say that this is not how pro hac vice usually works. I don't know. Maybe back then, maybe in Alabama, but like,

0:24:23 Jenessa: This part's weird, yeah

0:24:25 Lydia: Okay. I was going to ask about this. So the next piece that we get is Vinny going down to the court, to the judge's chambers. It's Fred Gwynn, Herman Munster, for anyone who watches the Munsters.

0:24:33 Matt: So good.

0:24:35 Thomas: Guy is so huge.

0:24:36 Lydia: Yeah, and to Fred Gwynne, to the judge, he lies about his qualifications and experience.

0:24:36 Matt: Yeah, it's a big face.

0:24:38 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah, so he does like a little in-person interview for pro hac vice. Is that kind of what you're saying, Matt?

0:24:46 Lydia: Yeah, interesting.

0:24:48 Matt: Yeah?

0:24:49 Jenessa: Not today that's not normal has that

0:24:50 Matt: No, I think pretty much everywhere you have to have another lawyer swear by you basically to and who's going to hang out with you and make sure you do it but you know I love it as a as an idea that maybe in 1992 this judge would just sit down with you and interview you informally and decide right right there's nobody else around to do it but I mean obviously like alabama court procedure is going to be very different from new york court procedure although you know we do learn that they're very good at court in alabamba in this movie so yeah and we find out he went to yale that's behind him uh on the on the wall so there's little bit of northern supremacy going on here too

0:25:03 Thomas: And the super small town thing, you know, yeah.

0:25:06 Lydia: Yeah well this judge particularly, right? He says that he's serious about procedure, and he hands Vinny the Alabama rules of criminal procedure because he expects him to know it front and back when he's in his courtroom. Yes. Interesting. So we know this is Vinny's first case. Mona Lisa Beto is Marissa Tomei, and she's like, what can I do to help?

0:25:39 Lydia: And that's kind of a through line we get through the movie where she's, like, I can help. I can help. Let me help. And he's like no, I'm gonna do this on my own I don't need your help you can't help blah blah blah yeah

0:25:33 Matt: Did

0:25:39 Jenessa: Ever

0:25:47 Thomas: That was interesting. That was the only thing that felt a little like underbaked to me, because at one point she starts reading the court rules manual. I was like, well, good. Let her fucking do that. Is that what she's going to do? I obviously know the famous scene that's coming, but I was thinking maybe she would help more, but like, I don't know if this is just the times or whatever, but I was confused as to why he wasn't letting her help with that. You know, it's kind of weird.

0:26:09 Thomas: I guess it's just a macho thing or what?

0:26:10 Matt: You see that del honor said that in the first meeting he had with fox's creative uh executive that they told him to cut her because they thought that she was too smart they thought it detracted from the movie can you imagine this movie without her so stupid yeah

0:26:15 Jenessa: What? Oh, my God dude

0:26:18 Thomas: Oh my god. Get fucked.

0:26:18 Lydia: Oh they yeah they wanted her lines to go to joe pesci

0:26:23 Thomas: Imagine how many good movies we would have if not for executives. Like, we'd probably have so many more. Assholes.

0:26:29 Lydia: Yeah, so I I think there's also the piece to that, Thomas—I think the original script was much longer and had like this whole backstory about the reason why it took him six times to pass the bar is because he was a little dyslexic is what they say and so there's like a pride sort of situation why he wants to do it by himself and so when you take that out because it was the director said it was gonna be three hours if we kept it the original length of the the

0:26:30 Jenessa: Having

0:26:55 Thomas: I won't release the Snyder Cut. This episode's brought to you by Quince. Hey, cooler temps are rolling in, I hear. It will happen eventually. And when it does, Quince is where I go to for fall staples that actually last. Fall is the best. If there's one thing I think the world can still agree on, it's that fall is the Best Season. Well, with fall coming up, you want to have the right clothes. And most importantly, you do want that quality stuff that doesn't just, I'm telling you so much stuff these days just wears out the instant I wash it. But not Quince. All my Quince clothes are exactly as good as when I first bought them. And for me, that's really the most important thing. But also Quince has the kind of fall staples you wear nonstop. Who doesn't want a 100% Mongolian cashmere sweater starting at just $60? In this economy, they've got denim that's durable and fits right. What makes Quince so different is their direct partnership with ethical factories and skipping the middlemen. So you get top tier fabrics and craftsmanship at half the price of similar brands. My Quince shorts and athletic wear have been my go-to for, I don't know, a year. So I've been looking at Quince for other stuff too, because they do have other stuff. I've got amazing bath towels from Quince that are fantastic. So, I got the clothes, I've got the towels. The next thing I might be looking at is the travel accessories. They look so nice. I think that's where I'm going to go next. When you have a brand like Quince, that you can trust, you know, pretty much everything they make is going to be that same level of quality. So keep it classic and cool this fall with long-lasting staples from Quince. Go to quince.com slash OA for free shipping on your order and 365-day returns. That's Q-U-I-N-C-E dot com slash OA. Free shipping and 365-day returns. One more time, quince.com/OA.

0:26:57 Lydia: Screenplay so they cut it but

0:26:58 Jenessa: Watched

0:26:58 Matt: Very

0:28:42 Ad: [Ad break 2 — ad music]

0:28:43 Jenessa: This about four million times the vibe I always get is what's our through line with the two of them she wants to help he sometimes accepts it he sometimes rejects it he lets her help a little then he gets a little upset if he needed too much help. And where it all culminates is I do need your help and you're going to help me in this extremely important way. And it's actually going to heal after a very big fight. It's going to fix things for us. So there's this character development, this relationship development for them of like, how do we find this balance of like we're a team, we are supposed to work together. We don't necessarily know how to do that exactly right in this situation. That's always how I read it is she's trying to insert herself but she's trying to be respectful of like it's not my area of expertise and is feeling that out and getting there

0:29:41 Thomas: Also love that they kind of accurately are like the reason this is even happening is because he's like, how much is an attorney going to cost? $50,000, $100,000? It's like yeah, probably. Probably.

0:29:49 Lydia: So we get kind of like the first bit you know something that's going to be present in multiple of these scenes is that Vinny's also not sleeping because the first motel that they're at is right by the sawmill with a steam whistle to wake everybody up there they have another place that they stay where they're next to like a pig farm basically everywhere they go the train comes through yeah so he's not sleeping

0:30:07 Thomas: Yeah. Everywhere they move, there's something that wakes them up in the morning.

0:30:13 Matt: Relatable I really felt

0:30:15 Lydia: I just also want to call out the cafe moment when they start talking about grits and they're going to order they're looking at the menu and they'RE taking taking a second and then they're like well I guess I'll have the breakfast yeah yeah yeah it

0:30:17 Matt: That yeah yeah

0:30:21 Thomas: It's so good. I guess I'll have breakfast. Well, he doesn't say that because that makes the joke better. He says, what do you think? Breakfast? And I was like, that was kind of weird. And then just shows the menu and the menu is just breakfast, lunch and dinner.

0:30:27 Matt: Yeah, yeah. It's so good. Such a good gag.

0:30:36 Thomas: I love it. And then the way so he's all paranoid about the grits. It's just truly great comedy. Like he just the way he keeps trying to delay eating it because he's like, you know, he's going to try it first. She like, doesn't want to try at first. And then he just keeps finding something to say. And he's like, no, I'll finally do it. And they just puts a tiny bit on his fork. It's so good. Oh, it's such good comedy.

0:30:32 Lydia: Says breakfast lunch dinner yeah

0:30:44 Jenessa: Eventually and she takes a picture with her

0:30:53 Lydia: Yeah the tiny bit yeah so good all right so we get to our first courtroom scene which is the arraignment and he comes in he's trying to like mimic what the district attorney is doing you can see who's played by Lane Smith. Yep.

0:30:56 Matt: So good. New Yorkers.

0:30:57 Thomas: So good. Yeah.

0:31:08 Matt: So good.

0:31:08 Thomas: Lane Smith, classic. This movie rules. God, I love it so much.

0:31:09 Lydia: Yep we get Fred Gwynn coming in who is very bothered by the style of dress that Vinny is in and he has said next time you come into my courtroom you will look lawyerly.

0:31:23 Lydia: He tries to explain instead of just offering how the defendants' plea you know he's like you have two options you can say guilty or not guilty and Vinny's like okay but if you just understand like this is all a misunderstanding etc etc. Judge does not like that. Holds him in contempt of court, and sends him off to prison.

0:31:39 Thomas: Yeah, so it's a returning bit of he's just constantly in contempt. And yeah, again because the jail's condemned that means he goes off to prison with them oh god so funny this movie is so good he says the thing you said that the yeah like I said yeah

0:31:48 Matt: With his glance. So good.

0:31:53 Lydia: So Mona Lisa bails him out. We see them, you know, a little bit later on the road. And she's like, well, why didn't you know like how to do all that stuff? And Vinny says, you don't learn procedures in law school. You learn either what I said. Yep. Yep, and Mona Lisa's like yeah, I had to use the traveler's checks because I got, this is like a little side plot we don't have to get too into, to but I had to use the traveler's checks because I got I tried to hustle the money but I got stiffed and he is not happy about that and they go track down the person who stiffed her down at the pool hall except for yeah oh not an arraignment okay right right yeah yeah yeah

0:32:24 Thomas: We can kind of skip most of the side plot except that the pool hall is the best joke in the entire fucking thing oh so not an arraignment right oh I don't remember the thing your talking about then

0:32:28 Matt: Oh, but real point of order real quick on the hearing, which is clearly a probable cause hearing for the murder charge.

0:32:34 Matt: Well, it's in rain, but also they definitely are doing like, cause they bring in witnesses, right? I'm sorry. No, no, you're right. No. I'm sorry. That was hearing. I get, I'm getting ahead of myself. You're right that's the next day. Yes. Cause they compress this whole thing so much. It all runs together. Yeah.

0:32:37 Jenessa: Polaroid that's us that's another scene yeah yeah yeah it's coming It's coming. It's common.

0:32:47 Thomas: Matt okay

0:32:47 Matt: That's the next day yeah. But the little speech he gives them about out. Because he gets held in contempt again, because he won't just say guilty or not guilty like you're supposed to do in an arraignment. And I actually, I went and looked up the quotes. I liked it so much.

0:32:48 Thomas: Okay yeah give me a time stamp I'll fucking play it that's what I'm here for yeah we can do it yeah I'll find it it's it shouldn't be that hard you might as well play

0:33:00 Matt: Oh yeah, you're right. We can just, we have the technology. I don't actually know a timestamp. That's so good.

0:33:08 Clip: Next time you come into my courtroom, you will look loyally.

0:33:11 Thomas: This god it's so good

0:33:13 Clip: And I mean you comb your hair and wear a suit and tie, and that suit better be made out of some kind of cloth.

0:33:22 Thomas: It's good anyway okay so yeah it goes

0:33:25 Clip: It appears to me that you want to skip the arraignment process, go directly to trial, skip that, and get a dismissal. Well, I'm not about to revamp the entire judicial process just because you find yourself in the unique position of defending clients who say they didn't do it.

0:33:49 Matt: So good. That'S such a perfect judge line. The unique position of defending clients who say they didn't do it. Love it.

0:33:52 Thomas: On uh yeah oh

0:33:53 Lydia: Yeah, yeah. So then do you want to explain the personal injury bit, Thomas?

0:33:57 Thomas: Man oh god so so when we learned in the beginning it's just great writing because Cause we learned, you know, he's a personal injury attorney. We learned that in the, in the scene where he was saying, you know, studying for the bar, like all that. And then as there, he is doing a totally different thing, which is the going to the pool hall to get, try to get $200. And there's that whole scene, which is kind of like, I don't think it's like bad, but it's also kind of not great. Like all of that whole stuff is kind of confusing to me. I don' t know. But anyway, just in the midst of that totally unrelated thing, he sees a guy with a neck brace.

0:34:27 Thomas: It's just like, stops everything. Like, did you get, did you get rear -ended? And it's even better, too, because the look on his face when the guy says, oh, no, I just fell. He's like, he's like he's, like, disgusted with him. Like, and it never and I love this because it doesn't nobody says like, oh. He works personal injury. Like, it's just trust the audience to, like. Remember, like? Oh, yeah. He's personal injury attorney. And then more of the scene happens. He goes, did you fall in your place or someone else's? It's like my place is like, ah, so good. Yeah yeah and I didn't show any of that but yeah

0:34:37 Lydia: Yeah. Yeah. And then he follows up and he's like, yeah, yeah? Yeah, so good. Yeah, yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah that's the black and white one yeah oh

0:34:38 Matt: Yeah, it's so sincere. Here yeah that's right also I just as a character note for uh for mona lisa here I love that she the reason that they're showing up to collect the two hundred dollars is because she hustled him in a pool game she she pretended she didn't know how to play pool that's such a great little character detail yeah that'S right yes so good fantastic yeah yeah

0:35:08 Jenessa: So he's walking around in his leather jacket, but don't worry, I added cowboy boots. So I'm blending right in. The second they walk in, he absolutely does not blend in. She is currently wearing a white and black, like super pad. Everything she wears in in this is like, yes,

0:35:15 Thomas: Yeah there's one where I said oh it's Cruella DeVille it's like yeah she has a different amazing outfit every single scene it's great

0:35:35 Jenessa: Every scene she's got something. They walk in and they just stand out so much. There's a through line all the way through the movie of nobody looks at her and takes her seriously because she has this very feminine, very over the top kind of appearance. But the joke is never like, ha ha, isn't it funny a woman knows about cars? Haha, Isn't It Funny? A Woman Plays Pool. The joke is, isn't it funny that people underestimate her because of how she looks? And this is part of my I Will Die on This Hill. This is a feminist movie. And she is absolutely a well -represented character of like, the joke is on us if we we underestimate her for sure.

0:35:35 Lydia: And I love them mm

0:36:05 Matt: Sure yeah and him then he

0:36:13 Lydia: -hmm yeah totally

0:36:14 Thomas: All right I love it so much yeah and yeah

0:36:24 Matt: Does too all the way through underestimates

0:36:26 Lydia: Yeah yeah yeah girl power yeah yeah

0:36:26 Thomas: I yeah how do you feel about that he also knows her worth though. I think he also knows her value.

0:36:27 Matt: Her sure sure sure yeah that's right yeah right yeah yeah yeah it's the character yeah

0:36:27 Jenessa: He does, but he doesn't. So like, yes. So think about, for example, in the very beginning when he's kicking the tires and he's like, what's wrong with it? They just pulled into town. And somebody comes up and he goes, you got mud in the tires. What's the first thing he does? He looks at her and goes, You ever heard of that? And she says, No. Total confidence says to another guy, She's never heard of it. She knows everything about cars. That guy laughs and And he's not laughing. He's not getting aggressive. He is not feeling defensive. He is just like, whatever. I know her. I'm confident. No. Yeah.

0:36:38 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I like that. Yeah it's so good. I love it. Yeah I fucking love this movie. And most importantly it doesn't ever feel like it's playing any of that for points. Like it never makes it feel like, yeah she might be a woman, but it's just like part of the scene. It's just part of the realism of the scenes and I love that. That's what really sets it apart for me as hmm

0:37:16 Matt: As a writer I have to say I appreciate also just what we're talking about that scene uh that was true to life like that actually happened that that exchange about the mud in your tires thing that dale wanners was driving around and somebody told him about that I love it when when when writers do that

0:37:23 Lydia: Yeah yeah the screenwriter his um he did get mud in his tires like that whole

0:37:24 Thomas: Oh wait what happened what did you

0:37:33 Lydia: Interaction actually happened while he was down there

0:37:34 Thomas: Say gotcha nice so

0:37:35 Matt: And the line about alabama mud and everything like it's it's all directly lifted from his own conversations. Love it.

0:37:38 Lydia: Yeah yeah he He was like, oh, I just thought that was a good detail. They hired a lot of people down there, too, tried to cast with, like, locals and, yeah. Okay, so now we get to this pretrial hearing, which, Matt, you said is likely probable cause, right?

0:37:38 Jenessa: That is so funny.

0:37:52 Matt: It seems that way.

0:37:52 Lydia: Because we have witnesses that are coming forward who all testify that they saw two young men in a green car with a white convertible top driving away after there were two shots.

0:38:03 Thomas: I don't remember what is the difference between that and arraignment it's not like a grand jury or yeah yeah

0:38:06 Jenessa: Yeah, so this is not like a - I'm used to like the idea of a grand jury, but that would be before arraignment. So what is - what the hell is this? Yeah, that the judge found probable cause, basically this

0:38:14 Thomas: I don'T I DON'T GET IT oh I thought that was the arraignment wait this is two

0:38:14 Matt: I, yeah, I, I'm not, I think they're taking liberties. I don't know anything about Alabama law. Obviously it seems a little strange that you'd have like a preliminary arraignment and then go on to anything that resembles probable cause. But it does seem like at the end of the hearing, if I remember right, he says, basically, we're going forward on this after hearing your testimony. And right, right.

0:38:33 Lydia: Yeah, two different things.

0:38:33 Thomas: Different things oh I don' t remember this at all oh yeah yeah okay I just blended them yeah yeah yeah ok I think that's That's why I blended them. Yeah.

0:38:34 Jenessa: Is a yes yes there's an arraignment the arrairement is literally are you pleading guilty or not arraignment should take 10 minutes yeah so arrainement's quick and done and then you come back later usually way later but there's a brief scene in between and then they come back where all of a sudden the witnesses are testifying.

0:38:36 Matt: Different days, if that. And I think they switched them just for narrative purposes, the pretrial and the arraignments. You'd have a quick one at the beginning yep

0:38:59 Lydia: Yeah, I think so.

0:39:01 Thomas: Another thing I do appreciate is he doesn't ask anything of any of the witnesses. And it seems like he just doesn't know what the fuck he's doing. And he doesn't know what he's doing really. He doesn't seem like he knows what he's doing. And by the way, the comedy of him being like, hey, I got to learn the procedure of the court. The only way to do that is this. And the feeling of like, yeah, but I can't afford to keep bailing you out.

0:39:23 Thomas: Just the joke idea that he's going to just keep getting held in contempt over and over trying to learn this thing. I love that. That so then as part of that like he's not asking any of the witnesses any questions and then they say like yeah we're gonna go forward with this that's when the friend is like this can't be my lawyer like no fucking way and it makes sense you're like geez yeah this is not going well but then when Karate Kid goes to kind of fire Vinny maybe I really like the case that Vinny makes to stay to be his lawyer which is that like hey man this is Alabama and you killed a good old boy, this was always going to go to trial.

0:39:55 Thomas: And it's like, OK. And I also like because I don't know if he's bullshitting, but like it's plausible and it's like, oh, maybe you kind of know something. And then the whole conceit of the movie, which is definitely something I didn't know from only seeing the good scenes is, yeah, he's kind of fucking up everywhere and he doesn't know the ins and outs, but he's able to suss out people's bull shitting like he just can cut through bullshit. And that's how he's going to be an actual asset to Karate Kid is like he always knows where the bullshit shit is. And I also like it too, because it works in this family scenario where he knows they didn't do it. You know, it wouldn't really work in like a client,

0:39:55 Matt: He's right that's true that's true mm

0:40:28 Thomas: Typical lawyer client thing, but if it's your family and like, I know you didn't do it, so there is going to be some bullshit. There's going to be, brings up the magician example of like, you know, magician came and Vinny knew every single trick, how they did it. AndI love it because it's like, yeah, that all works in this scenario. I don't, you know, obviously it's unrealistic, but like, I like that within the reality of the movie, it's all kind of justified. And it's It's like, yeah, he's going to know to call bullshit because he knows if they're innocent, there has to be some trick here. There has to Be some bullshit going on.

0:40:55 Matt: Right and it's such a good character development I was thinking too that we're we're basically up to the conversation the basketball court we're saying I don't know if I can do this right with this with this guy and I had a moment did you ever see you ever seen the uh somebody recut did like a trailer for the shining they made it look like a comedy you ever seeing this it's really good

0:41:10 Thomas: Oh, I don't think I saw it. No.

0:41:10 Jenessa: What?

0:41:11 Matt: It's fantastic but I was think you could do the same thing with a movie that I'm calling my cousin vincent which is basically a horror film a legal horror film where you realize that you're going to the chair because you're being represented by this jamoke. It's perfect.

0:41:23 Jenessa: No, no. I really like too how they play this together with, there's the history of his nephew knowing, yeah, this guy knows how to argue. And then we transition to, we've been seeing it already, the way that him and Mona Lisa argue. Like they're always arguing in a, it's not just like snippy, I hate you. It is always arguing in a way that really is setting you up for how to construct a good argument.

0:41:55 Jenessa: And it fits the whole vibe of, yeah, if you know anything about Italian American culture, there's a lot of yelling going on. There's a lot of vigorous debate happening on a regular basis. So it fits really well culturally.

0:42:09 Thomas: One thing I didn't even think of is the author Italian is the writer Italian.

0:42:10 Jenessa: Literally must be right

0:42:13 Lydia: I don't think so.

0:42:14 Matt: Wanner? I don't think so.

0:42:14 Lydia: I don't think so,

0:42:15 Jenessa: Did someone just observe us like a anthropological cultural study what happened gotta be brooklyn

0:42:16 Thomas: Interesting. Yeah, maybe.

0:42:22 Matt: Maybe he's married to an Italian woman or something.

0:42:24 Lydia: No he's Jewish. He's Jewish, yeah Okay,

0:42:24 Thomas: Oh, could be. Okay.

0:42:24 Matt: I mean, it seems very true to life, but yeah. Because, hmm, interesting. So he grew up in New York, I'm assuming. I mean it just feels very, you know.

0:42:29 Thomas: Yeah. Yeah. Probably has some.

0:42:30 Jenessa: Brooklin is a lot of jewish and italian americans hanging out and that's our pair here the two friends one's jewish one's italian

0:42:40 Lydia: So Vinny gets invited to go hunting with Lane Smith, the DA, and he's like this is a perfect opportunity I'm gonna you know smooth talk him and stuff and get him to get him to show me his files and I don't have a timestamp for this hun but when he comes back to the hotel

0:42:49 Matt: Get his files. So good.

0:42:58 Thomas: Well, first, we might as well play this part.

0:43:02 Clip: I don't know. I suppose. I mean I'm a man's man. I could go deer hunting. A sweet, innocent, harmless, leaf-eating, doe-eyed little I'm not going to go out there just to wimp out, you know? I mean, the guy will lose respect for me.

0:43:02 Thomas: God she's so good I meant to just go to the last part but I'm now I'm just gonna watch the movie

0:43:26 Clip: What about these pants I got on? Oh, imagine you're a deer. You spot a little brook. You put your little deer lips down Bam, a fucking bullet rips off part of your head. Your brains are laying on the ground Now I ask you, would you give a fuck what kind of pants the son of a bitch who shot you was wearing?

0:43:36 Thomas: Sorry oh god I love it every so deserving though like so deserving love it okay well I'm going to that part here they're in the car going to the

0:44:00 Lydia: Room so good yeah

0:44:00 Matt: Oscar winner, Marisa Tomei. Yeah, absolutely.

0:44:12 Clip: I'd sure like to get a look at your files. You got Xerox machine over there? Shirley, can you Xeroxx all the files on the Gambini-Rothenstein

0:44:14 Thomas: Hunt

0:44:21 Jenessa: In the hotel I'll

0:44:32 Thomas: He's looking all satisfied with himself yeah back in the hotel room he's got all the files only notice they don't look xerox but but that's just me.

0:44:45 Clip: Trotter's files. All of them. You stole his files? I didn't steal his files. Listen to this. I'm just ready to finesse him. I'm starting to finess him. He offers to have his secretary copy everything from me.

0:45:04 Clip: He's letting us use his hunting cabin as soon as he gets back. He sleeps like a baby when he's there.

0:45:16 Clip: You reading this book? Don't read this book, OK.

0:45:21 Thomas: Yeah, that's the only part. I don't like that because that's a court rules book or whatever it is.

0:45:28 Clip: Don't you wonder why Trotter gave you his files? I told you why already. By law, you're entitled. It's called disclosure, you dickhead. He has to show you everything, otherwise it could be a mistrial. He has give you a list of all his witnesses. You can talk to all his witness. He's not allowed any surprises. Didn't teach you that in law school either?

0:45:53 Lydia: Yeah

0:45:53 Thomas: Just look on his face.

0:45:53 Lydia: So good yeah Yeah.

0:45:56 Jenessa: Tell you you why here's why he says what are you doing reading this she was gonna let him get away with his ego of like oh I guess you talked him into it the second he's like what areyou doing reading this book she's like oh guess what dickhead I know exactly why he gave you the files because I read and you don't and that's gonna lead us up to later in the movie we're gonna have a total shift when he's in a panic he's gonna come up to her and go where'd you read that disclosure shit like open the book show it to me so we have a total flip of his attitude of how he approaches the book this is what happens when you watch it a hundred times instead of once

0:46:34 Thomas: Yeah, yeah.

0:46:35 Matt: Script's in your head.

0:46:35 Thomas: Yeah, no, I just didn't understand why he's so resistant at first. But yeah, I think it's just kind of the macho culture thing, do -it -himself thing.

0:46:43 Lydia: And then we get one second of War Deer, basically. One second.

0:46:50 Thomas: It's really funny, though.

0:46:51 Lydia: I don't know if you want to play it, but yeah, I know it's true. Now we're preparing for trial. They go to Lane Smith's hunting cabin and Mona Lisa is pacing. This is like one of the most famous scenes from this movie. She shares that she's stressed about getting married and we get my biological clock is ticking like

0:46:52 Thomas: I do like... Oh, no. We'll play the whole movie if we play that.

0:47:10 Lydia: This. Yeah, yeah.

0:47:10 Matt: And she's like 24.

0:47:11 Thomas: Yeah. I'll marry her. Is that still, can we, is it an option? Can we still? No, it's a movie. Damn it.

0:47:17 Lydia: And then this section basically ends with, unfortunately, he's not getting sleep there either because there's an insane owl, which is a real owl, by the way. They train the owl to open its mouth. Yeah.

0:47:27 Thomas: Yeah, it doesn't make that sound, though. Yeah, okay. I was going to say.

0:47:29 Lydia: No, no, they did the sound in post, but they had the owl trained to not react to the gunshots and they got that on the first take. Yeah yeah.

0:47:37 Matt: That's an impressive owl.

0:47:37 Lydia: It is an impressive owl. Yeah Yeah. Yeah.

0:47:39 Matt: You know, I said that to Casey as we were watching this. I paused it and I said, they would never use a real owl today. That just wouldn't happen. You would just like, what a loss. What a great loss to, well, I don't know. Maybe the owls are happier not to be in movies. I don' t know.

0:47:48 Jenessa: Wait so you're saying it's not that that tiny owl makes that sound but there is a screech owl was that not a screeched owl sound what was that sound okay

0:47:55 Lydia: No, it was probably a screech owl sound. They just put it in post.

0:47:56 Thomas: It was just, I can just tell as a sound person, it was way fucking enhanced is all. Maybe it makes it sound like that, but it was, yeah.

0:48:02 Jenessa: The microphone was in front of its mouth yeah yeah okay I got you

0:48:03 Thomas: They enhanced it a lot for comedic purposes. Well, yeah, and it was coming through the fucking. Sound system. Like, yeah, it's very loud. Yeah.

0:48:08 Lydia: It was the right source. Yeah so the owl keeps them up. They end up sleeping in the car and then we get a huge huge storm of rain and lightning and now when they wake up the car is stuck in the mud and unfortunately Mona Lisa had his suit in the trunk and it came out when he was trying to get a piece of wood to jimmy the car out of there and so now he needs a new suit a shower and trial starts in 30 minutes so we got it's urgent yeah yeah

0:48:11 Matt: Yeah. Very well-miked male owl, yeah.

0:48:40 Jenessa: One of my leads us to my favorite line of that he's got to do all these things of I gotta I gotta shower I gotta get a suit I gotta go to the bathroom I gotta get to the courtroom and she goes you take a fucking shower I'll get your fucking

0:48:52 Thomas: Yeah, I felt like you would like that. Like I just felt like that that sounds like Jenessa to me. Because it is a combination of foul language yelling, but also caring and doing a nice thing for your partner. Like it's just yeah, it's charming. I like it. Unfortunately, you know, we can't play everything.

0:49:06 Matt: And planning. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

0:49:11 Thomas: But my favorite part about the suit and the dressing part is probably in the rule of threes. The second time when he's like, what are you wearing? And he goes, oh, you were serious about that. So good.

0:49:05 Jenessa: Suit it's very

0:49:20 Lydia: Yeah that's why he gets held in contempt that second time yeah so we get lane smith's opening statements and vinnie is so tired he's sleeping and if you go to 115 38 we get vinny's opening statement when he wakes

0:49:20 Matt: It's so good. Mm -hmm

0:49:38 Thomas: Yeah. We did. This is pretty iconic. Yeah, we do. We do need that. Well, wait, you didn't do the suit bit, did you?

0:49:38 Lydia: Up yeah so we have trial day one starting and vinny is nowhere to be found we know he's trying to get a suit and take a shower but you know obviously time is passing people are getting pretty frustrated and then the the yeah

0:49:50 Thomas: Yeah. And the store was closed and the, yeah, the laundromat thing was, was not not existent or something

0:49:57 Lydia: So the door opens and vinnie walks through in the most amazing outfit ever the most amazing outfit ever it's pressed or like like crushed velvet I guess and it's like this it has a

0:50:02 Thomas: It's so funny it's so good yeah yeah and it's like a tux like the cut of it or whatever so it's like tails yeah it's so fucking funny genuinely we were laughing our asses off

0:50:05 Jenessa: Crushed prom suit yeah bow

0:50:15 Lydia: Tail yeah the tails to his suit yeah and it's just it's so beautiful and and yeah I don't know if you want to go to there when the judge is asking him

0:50:17 Jenessa: Ribbon maroon

0:50:27 Thomas: I feel like it's where it's still good we might as well man

0:50:33 Clip: Mr. Gambini, are you mocking me with that outfit? Mocking you? No, I'm not mocking you, Judge. Then explain that outfit. I bought a suit. You seen it. This town doesn't have a one-hour cleaners, Except that the only store you could buy a suit in has got the flu. You get that? The whole store got the flue. So I had get this in a second-hand store. So it's either wear the leather jacket, So, I wore this ridiculous thing for you.

0:51:21 Thomas: I love it you want drugs

0:51:21 Matt: Good yeah

0:51:24 Clip: Drugs? No. I don't take drugs. I'm holding you in contempt of court. Well, here's a fucking surprise.

0:51:34 Lydia: Yeah he gets away with that one yeah yeah

0:51:45 Thomas: I like it because I feel like he genuinely doesn't know that he just said that because it's like it's like his inner you know Italian coming out or whatever like just like he's he's actually oblivious to the fact that he said

0:51:56 Jenessa: Oh man that line of I wore this ridiculous thing for you second only to oh yeah you blend is like those lines never stop in my house house

0:52:02 Thomas: That yeah for

0:52:10 Lydia: For you yeah so lane smith has finished his opening statements and vinny is asked to present his but he's been sleeping the whole time um so he comes

0:52:22 Thomas: You yeah he's pretty much fast asleep so then he has to wake up and give his statement this might have been another one that made the intro at some

0:52:51 Clip: Everything that guy just said is bullshit. Counsel's entire opening statement is argument. The entire opening statement, with the exception of thank you, will be stricken from

0:53:05 Thomas: Point it's so good it's

0:53:07 Matt: With you it's a perfect detail the exception of thank you

0:53:09 Clip: The jury will please

0:53:09 Lydia: This yeah so good yeah

0:53:09 Thomas: So good and isn't that correct though Matt like that's what I love about it because I feel like if a writer hadn't done the research I feel like what would have happened even if you wrote that scene they would have been like objection and it would have been like oh show some decorum you know they would have just said something like that but I love that specifically objection because it's argument I just think if you hadn't done the work as a writer you never would have thought of that like that's the thing you have to have come across quite a bit of law to think of that, to write it. And it's just so perfect with the exception of thank you. You just imagine the opening statement going down in the record as thank you, and we're going to have to call it there for this preview. I hope you enjoyed it. As I promised, it was a healthy chunk, but if you want to get the rest of that healthy chunk you got to go to patreon.com/law. Pledge at that two dollar level and above. That's where you can hear the full thing. Thanks so much to our patrons for both supporting the show and letting us have a nice thing. I I hope everyone's safe out there and Matt and Jenessa will be in your ears for Rapid Response Friday very soon. Thanks so much for listening. We'll see you then.

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